Aspyr Announces Civ3 Complete & Civ4

[dojoboy]

A GOTM vanilla start file expects to find a whole different set of races and units, as assembled by Cracker to simulate the extra PtW races and their UUs. There is no existing mod installer that would set up PtW or C3C or Aspyr Almost-Complete to run the GOTM vanilla start file. If you want to play the GOTM using the new Aspyr software then you'll need the PtW start file, and Complete will have to run in PtW mode.

Ah, that's right, it's modded. I should've remembered that.

Civ3Com will run the PtW start file. Many of the Civ-Extras that are included in Ci3Com, from the PtW expansion, that were fan-made, obviously run.

 

[AlanH]

Civ3Com will run the PtW start file.

Yes it will, but for GOTM you'd better make sure it's running as PtW and not as Conquests. It will probably be able to do either.

On a PC you can load a PtW file in Civ3 Conquests, but if you do then you don't play it as PtW, you play it under Conquests rules. The corruption model is different, there are two kinds of leaders ... lots of game play changes, which is why we run separate competitions for the "Classic" (GOTM) and Conquests (COTM) versions of Civ3.

We occasionally get GOTM submission attempts from players who ran the PTW start save in Conquests instead of PtW. They have played a different game from everyone else, to Conquests rules, the resulting submitted file is in Conquests format, and we have to reject them. Unfortunately there's no way to prevent people using this combination and wasting their time.

So unless you know better, I'm pretty sure the Aspyr software release will have to contain two executables, for PtW and Conquests. They *might* have combined them into a single package to look like one executable, with two game version options offered at start up, but that's not the way it's presented on the PC.

 

[dojoboy]

I see, disregard my second PM.

 

[Gatekeeper]

Welcome to the CFC Mac community Gatekeeper! Woo-hoo! Everyone, let me introduce you to Gatekeeper, a fellow Apolyton mate of mine. I'm sure you'll find GK a valuable member of the community. In fact, he's just what our community has been needing. Every community needs a Gatekeeper! :insert rim shot:

Aww, shucks, dojoboy. I'm just an ordinary mortal, nothing more.

Gatekeeper

 

[Gatekeeper]

Hello Gatekeeper and welcome! How does a Mac user survive at Apolyton?

On nuts, berries and roots, mostly.

I've never been able to find the Mac ghetto over there, and assumed it didn't exist.

Oh, it's there. The forum used to have "Macintosh" in its title, but TPTB over there renamed it to something like "Non-Windows Civilization Forum" or something like that. The forum gets maybe two to five posts per month.

It gets real lonely over there D), but I while away the time the OT, Civ II and Civ IV forums.

Gatekeeper

 

[Brad Oliver]

So unless you know better, I'm pretty sure the Aspyr software release will have to contain two executables, for PtW and Conquests.

Yes, the shipping DVD will have a "Complete" app, which has the option of running as "Conquests" for you purists. It'll also have a separate (and unsupported) "Play the World" app, which has the option of running as "Civ3 Gold" for a truly complete experience. ;-)

 

[iamliberal]

I will upgrade to complete and play exclusively Conquests. Before I converted to Mac in Feb '04, I loved Conquests on my PC. PTW was a nice little bump up (should've been a free patch, imo). Conquests, on the other hand, had a lot of nice changes (my favorite is the victory screen so you can see how many turns left, who is winning, etc). I can't imagine why anyone would want to play vanilla civ once we have conquests

Welcome gatekeeper!

 

[antaine]

the thing that annoyed me most about civ3 for the mac was the lack of an editor that could specify correct civ placement. all these years and no patch?

i cannot express my disappointment at having been passed over twice for such an essential just because i use a mac. Two belated releases (one by almost half a decade) and still no fix? There's no excuse for that!

 

[k-a-bob]

the thing that annoyed me most about civ3 for the mac was the lack of an editor that could specify correct civ placement. all these years and no patch?

i cannot express my disappointment at having been passed over twice for such an essential just because i use a mac. Two belated releases (one by almost half a decade) and still no fix? There's no excuse for that!

It's a different company from the initial release and it is basically an obsolete product already. Would you rather have the Civ 4 development stopped in favor of an editor that'll only be used until the next game comes out (a few months)?

I would not. Perspective please.

 

[Brad Oliver]

Two belated releases (one by almost half a decade) and still no fix?

According to my math, 1/2006 - 4/2004 (the date of the 1.22 patch for Conquests) is a hair under 2 years.

 

[Macintosh]

German reseller Arktis announced Civ4 for Mac in stock at march 2006, 31st.
I guess that is just another nice wish, isn't it?

 

[Brad Oliver]

German reseller Arktis announced Civ4 for Mac in stock at march 2006, 31st.
I guess that is just another nice wish, isn't it?

It sure is. Let me be blunt: no one knows yet when Civ4 is going to ship. When we get closer to testing, someone from Aspyr will no doubt mention it - that's when the dates will start to have real meaning instead of being completely blind guesses.

 

[k-a-bob]

It sure is. Let me be blunt: no one knows yet when Civ4 is going to ship. When we get closer to testing, someone from Aspyr will no doubt mention it - that's when the dates will start to have real meaning instead of being completely blind guesses.

Hey - I'd be happy with Christmas.

 

[Hellfire]

It's a different company from the initial release and it is basically an obsolete product already. Would you rather have the Civ 4 development stopped in favor of an editor that'll only be used until the next game comes out (a few months)?

I would not. Perspective please.

Sorry, but when I see this I get in the mood for a rant. Nothing personal but anyone who doesn't have an editor for mac Cvi3 has a right to be upset, if your perspective is correct.

If your perspective is "what can you give me now," then Civ3 is great, because it's working very well, has most everything we want, and allows us to finally do most of what PC users can do, even without the editor. You can't be upset that the editor is

If your perspective is "what should they have given me," then this is just another poor example of treating mac users like second class users. All the same catch 22 arguments still apply. The wait and see approach for Mac games is annoying and stupid. Bungie and Blizzard proved that simultaneous or near simultaneous releases can and do work and can be profitable, even before Mac OS X had all the tools it has now (like Xcode). I'm not arguing the details but what I am saying is that just because we have Civ3 now doesn't mean in general that we shouldn't ease up on the pressure on some companies to start getting the hint.

So before one asks someone to have perspective, one needs to ask if there are multiple perspectives and which one is he coming from. I'm sorry I don't mean to be mean but it's very important to make these distrinctions because saying "you have something now just be happy" still doesn't always cut it.

In other words... why hasn't Sid hired Brad to run a Mac division yet???????????

 

[antaine]

Thank you. And for the math, I was going from the release of the PC game, which, if I recall, had a fully functioning editor before the mac version was ever released (if not, it was close).

as far as perspective, here's mine: I want a civ game where I can play on a large, accurate map of the Earth with the civs in their correct places. That's it. Don't care about multiplayer, don't care about fancy scenarios for WWII or the like.

Despite the addition of culture and borders and lots of nice graphics and other additions, from my perspective civ 2 was better in that it better answered my desire. unfortunately it doesn't run native on os x (and lacks the other nifty stuff).

I'm just tremendously disappointed in that I waited eagerly all this time for the addition of that one specific feature (civ placement - which seemed to have been part of the pc ptw) and when I saw that this contained ptw I ran out and bought it figuring it would (finally) have that feature. In the end, all I get is a bunch more civs (which is good) that I still can't place correctly.

Private individuals made a civ placement tool utility for the pc as a stopgap prior to the release of the fully functioning editor. I'm surprised that no private person with the right knowhow did the same for the mac editor in all this time.

 

[MAS]

Sorry, but ... <snip>...
In other words... why hasn't Sid hired Brad to run a Mac division yet???????????

I SO agree with your rant! If Bungy (R.I.P.) could do it, and Blizzard can still do it with their latest game....

Though I knew C3C for mac woud lack an editor before I bought it and I still spend 50 euro's on it! So you can't say I don't appreciate the fact that C3C still made it to the mac! To those of us who are more avid mac gamers, it came as a complete and utter suprice. I mean, I didn't expect it to happen and stopped hoping for it, then it happened anyway!

But you are right: The least we want these company's to think is that they could get away with less than the best they have!

 

[k-a-bob]

Does neither of you know the history? There have been no updates on the program in so long because MacSoft would not release their rights to the software (nor any updates) until their contract ran out. Who exactly was supposed to work on this? Brad? While working for another company - unknowing of whether they would even get rights to it?

When they did get the rights to it, PC Civ 4 is about to be released, so Civ 3 is going to be obsolete very soon. My point is this: what sense is there for a company to work on a small piece of a game that is due to be obsolete in a matter of months over the brand spanking new release of the actual latest version?

I would bet that working on an editor would push back the release of C-IV by many months - making it a year (or more) after the PC version. I can't see the logic in that.

"All these years and no patch" - that lies at the foot of MacSoft, not any current dev team.

As for a world map where everyone is placed properly, I have been playing that since I have been on this forum - look for Rhye's world map.

 

[dojoboy]

So before one asks someone to have perspective, one needs to ask if there are multiple perspectives and which one is he coming from. I'm sorry I don't mean to be mean but it's very important to make these distrinctions because saying "you have something now just be happy" still doesn't always cut it.

Are there multiple perspectives? Or, are there multiple opinions?

The perspective is, Aspyr gained control of the mac publishing rights to Civ when MacSoft let their rights expire. Aspyr determined releasing Civ3 Complete would be a good business decision. Right now, it's the #2 best seller over at the MacGameStore. Now, having greased the wheel, Aspyr is looking to profit from a mac version of Civ4. Mirroring this, is a mac gaming community that is eagerly awaiting Civ4.

Unhappiness over the absence of an editor for Civ3 Complete is understandable. But, Apsyr, on several occassions, informed the mac community that an editor would not ship with Civ3 Complete. And, it has been alluded to that an editor for Civ3 Complete was still possible.

 

[Blue Monkey]

Aspyr determined releasing Civ3 Complete would be a good business decision. Right now, it's the #2 best seller over at the MacGameStore...Aspyr is looking to profit from a mac version of Civ4.

Calling something complete when it clearly isn't is not a good business decision if you want repeat customers.

Apsyr, on several occassions, informed the mac community that an editor would not ship with Civ3 Complete.

The only place I've personally seen this is postings here by you and Brad; if Aspyr made the announcement let me know the url so I can go see what they actually said.

And, it has been alluded to that an editor for Civ3 Complete was still possible.

I actually saw a man fly over a building with a rocket pack back in the sixties. Given present technology flying green sheep with marsupial DNA are possible. As far as I know I can't buy either item at any price.

I justified getting a PC in aid of the Cisco certifications for which I am studying; in actuality it's overwhelmingly most frequent use will be to run the C3C editor. So by the time I get through installing Timbuktu Pro, I'll be able to design a scenario on my Mac for the mere cost of $1200. I'll take the best I can get; don't expect me to say "goody, goody, I can finally play on a map someone else made years ago".

 

[Brad Oliver]

Bungie and Blizzard proved that simultaneous or near simultaneous releases can and do work and can be profitable, even before Mac OS X had all the tools it has now (like Xcode).

You mean back when development tools on the Mac didn't suck? ;-)