[Balancing] Coinage civic

Nimek

Nimek

Emperor
Joined
Jul 7, 2010
Messages
1,208
Now coinage civic is some kind of tragedy. When i changed from barter to coinage i droped from above 200 gold per turn to almost -50 per turn so its 250 gold per turn diff.

And what coinage civic give me? Option to spend gold to buy units or buildings. It is that option worth 250 gold per turn? What is the reson to make this civic so useless? What we can do with it?
 
Coinage? Pfft, Slavery is far superior, and you get to buy buildings with gold with Patrician too (which you should use as well).
 
Nimek said:
Now coinage civic is some kind of tragedy. When i changed from barter to coinage i droped from above 200 gold per turn to almost -50 per turn so its 250 gold per turn diff.

And what coinage civic give me? Option to spend gold to buy units or buildings. It is that option worth 250 gold per turn? What is the reson to make this civic so useless? What we can do with it?
Click to expand...

Right, you dropped in gold. The amount isn't as interesting as a possible percent you dropped. What is also interesting is what you gained in other areas, like science if you had 100% science, or in Commerce total if not.

Civics are not all just "better" than earlier ones, they are different and give different bonuses and penalties. For instance with Barter you can not have any Foreign Trade Routes. With Coinage you can (as long as no other civic you have prevents them and other civs can have foreign trade routes too) and that can more than make up for any loss in gold.

The loss in gold doesn't have to be that high either, depending on what you have income from, what Barter Only buildings you have built that will be disabled, how many other +gold buildings you have built, what other civics you change to at the same time or shortly after, and a bunch of other things. You might just have picked a less than optimal time to switch, not a bad time, just not perfect. But that's very hard to do. *smile*

Cheers
 
I agree with BG's assessment. But I kind of agree with Nimek too, even moreso after Draz's post.

Coinage needs to be better (as do more of the Civics in competition with Slavery) so the AI will Not stay on Slavery for 3/4's of the game (or the Player too!)

Everybody that uses Slavery won't even try to use the other Civics because of all the Bonuses Slavery provides. And this is even after 3 attempts (Civic re-balancing and restructuring under Eldrinfall and ls612) to reduce Slavery's OP strengths.

We have No early Civics in Slavery's category that can even compete with it. So you either join the Slavery "heyday bandwagon" and reap tons of gold and other benefits, or you avoid Slavery and try to maintain any gold + balance by careful Civic choices coupled with building Every Gold producing Bldg/unit etc you can.

It's like trying to sail a ship with all the passengers and cargo on one side. Very dangerous situation and makes balancing anything to do with gold outside of Slavery skewed and skewered.

JosEPh :p :/
 
Honestly, at this point I think the problem is at least as much with Barter as with Slavery.

Barter is a no-sell to me because it has -1C on cottages. This makes Slavery a functional +1C for Cottages on top of all its other benefits. Why is Barter -C on cottages? Even without that, it's not like it would be a great civic once... basically anything else... became available.

Coinage I actually don't have much of a problem with. Switching to it, I do lose a bit of money initially at 100% research. But cottages start producing more even before they can upgrade , and the Treasury makes up for that lost gold long before my prehistoric surplus is lost. IIRC, a Financial leader can start getting bonus commerce from river cottages under Coinage before they upgrade to Hamlets. As a Financial leader, I'll run it fairly late to keep getting +1C on cottages.

Is it weaker than Slavery? Yeah. Is it costly, especially for a large empire? Yeah. I don't think it's weak, though.

Admittedly, I've never seen a 250 gold/turn drop from it - for me it's usually closer to 50. I can only assume you've got a massive empire to have that severe of a drop, and in that case the Treasury should help more since it's +10% gold in each city.
 
This civic is obsolete, it is being replaced. It would be already if my computer was working. We will be using CivPlayer8's Advanced Civics as the normal civics for c2C as soon as I can get my machine to run Civ.
 
There is a "Currency" group. But "coinage" civic who knows, I have not been able to play civ in over a week. It currently looks like my new graphics card does not play nice with the 3GB switch.
 
Dancing Hoskuld said:
It currently looks like my new graphics card does not play nice with the 3GB switch.
Click to expand...

That sounds odd, can't you launch the game at all or what's the problem? Have you tried other games to verify it's not some driver issue/broken GPU (yes, that sometimes does happen even with brand new GPU's)?

The switch shouldn't affect your GPU's performance at all.
 
Without 3GB switch I can get on to the computer and these forums no problem. With 3Gb switch everything slows down, I can see the screen being refreshed and a page down on a document. This is much better than two days ago when a page down on this forum or a document would take 2 seconds.

I can play other mods without the 3GB switch on but get an error (see) with it on. One more try and then I am giving up and upgrading the whole machine to Win7! Which I can't really afford.
 
Yeah that's definitely not right, it may be pretty tricky to pin down the exact cause (could be both software and hardware). I'd probably try a fresh install of the OS or just throw money at the problem (a good excuse as any for buying a new rig! :p) but I can understand if neither of those solutions seem too appealing.
 
draz said:
Yeah that's definitely not right, it may be pretty tricky to pin down the exact cause (could be both software and hardware). I'd probably try a fresh install of the OS or just throw money at the problem (a good excuse as any for buying a new rig! :p) but I can understand if neither of those solutions seem too appealing.
Click to expand...

On my 2rd install of the OS.:cry: Second new hard disk also.

Edit It is the /3GB switch. Without it everything runs fine but I can't run C2C. With it I cant run Civ!
 
Dancing Hoskuld said:
On my 2rd install of the OS.:cry: Second new hard disk also.

Edit It is the /3GB switch. Without it everything runs fine but I can't run C2C. With it I cant run Civ!
Click to expand...

Try /2.7GB switch instead of 3. Should be sufficient to run C2C with and might help everything else to run fine too.

Cheers
 
Hydromancerx said:
Your son-in-law play C2C too?
Click to expand...

Actually no he doesn't, But he is a top notch computer technician and could solve DH's dilemma. He worked for IBM for awhile in the Virtual Machine Ware Division and also for Catepillar IT dept. (He taught me how to build my own computers). My daughter used to play Civ II, Text of Time, and CivIV/ BtS as did my 3 other children. My 2nd son and I used to play early RoM lan games.

JosEPh
 
Dancing Hoskuld said:
On my 2rd install of the OS.:cry: Second new hard disk also.

Edit It is the /3GB switch. Without it everything runs fine but I can't run C2C. With it I cant run Civ!
Click to expand...

There's two ways to set up the switch according to the thread on the topic and we've had to use both of them over the course of the number of laptops my wife has had to work with. I think its Dells that require the more obscure method. But I'm not sure. All I can say is read a little further in on that thread to find the second method and try that.
 
DH, how much memory does your new card have? If it has got a decent amount then it's not surprising it would cause probs w the 3gb switch. The 3GB switch changes how Windows splits its 4gb address space -- normally, windows gives 2 to the running program and keeps 2gb for itself. With the 3gb switch, windows keeps only 1 gb and programs get 3 gb. But if you have a video card with, say, 1 gb of memory on it, then windows needs 1gb just to "talk" to the video card! That leaves windows with no space for anything else and it's not going to run at all. In general I think u will run into trouble with the 3gb switch if u have any more than 512MB video card memory, and maybe even with 512 mb.

Like bluegenie suggested, try setting the switch to something less than 3 gb (but more than 2 gb.). If you keep lowering it eventually things will work OK, and hopefully that will still be enough for c2c to run. If the computer doesn't work right at 3.7, try 3.5, or 3.3 if necessary.

The real solution, tho, is to get a 64-bit OS...
 
damgo said:
DH, how much memory does your new card have? If it has got a decent amount then it's not surprising it would cause probs w the 3gb switch. The 3GB switch changes how Windows splits its 4gb address space -- normally, windows gives 2 to the running program and keeps 2gb for itself. With the 3gb switch, windows keeps only 1 gb and programs get 3 gb. But if you have a video card with, say, 1 gb of memory on it, then windows needs 1gb just to "talk" to the video card! That leaves windows with no space for anything else and it's not going to run at all. In general I think u will run into trouble with the 3gb switch if u have any more than 512MB video card memory, and maybe even with 512 mb.

Like bluegenie suggested, try setting the switch to something less than 3 gb (but more than 2 gb.). If you keep lowering it eventually things will work OK, and hopefully that will still be enough for c2c to run. If the computer doesn't work right at 3.7, try 3.5, or 3.3 if necessary.

The real solution, tho, is to get a 64-bit OS...
Click to expand...

You are a bit late;) I went win 7 on Friday. Still finding that I have not loaded software that I need.
 
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