Beta 9 Talk

[3Miro]

I think the mod is awesome! For example the choice of resources is nice. Though I'm a little bit confused why are there gems in Estonia - do they represent amber? At least nowadays amber is much more common in Latvia. In middle ages Estonian economy flourished based on piracy (the famous Eastern Vikings of Saaremaa) and later on salt transit. The only resources we had were timber (especially oak wood for ships after deforestation in Europe) and wheat/barley/rye (some even called Estonia the granary of Sweden).

I would suggest changing the province borders in Baltics too. Saaremaa (seu Ösel) should be under Estonian province, Estonian province's eastern border should be in the center of lake Peipus and following the river Narva. Historical Curland should be under Livonia. Well, the best way to demonstrate it, is to draw it myself. I based these borders on maps in Wikipedia's article Livonia, mostly to show pre-Crusades tribal borders.

Spoiler :

Although I agree, that regarding the Polish UHV conditions, the current Livonian northern border (except for Saaremaa - the Polish didn't conquer Saaremaa) is good too.

Oh, boy, Oh boy. Someone from the Baltic region. Since we cannot find anyone from Lithuania, I am going to appoint you in charge of the Lithuanian CityName map. They currently use the Polish one, which is bad.

Are you interested in helping?

 

[civ_king]

It would be greatly appreciated if there were stability maps for the civs

 

[3Miro]

It would be greatly appreciated if there were stability maps for the civs

What do you mean? Ctr + Mouse Hover over the provinces is supposed to be exactly that.

 

[civ_king]

What do you mean? Ctr + Mouse Hover over the provinces is supposed to be exactly that.

I mean so you could see the stability of civs you aren't playing so you don't gift a bad city to your vassals

 

[3Miro]

I mean so you could see the stability of civs you aren't playing so you don't gift a bad city to your vassals

I will think about it. Stability changes with time, so it is no as clear cut as adding a .png file to the reference folder.

 

[civ_king]

I will think about it. Stability changes with time, so it is no as clear cut as adding a .png file to the reference folder.

WHat do you mean changes with time? Do you mean that when it hits certain times (like 1500) it changes or do you mean on conquest of a city in the province, total control of a province, birth of a country?

 

[Baron03]

I downloaded beta 9, all the zip files are correct but when I play RFCE its an old version. The change log is there with the file but when I play the game it's an old version

 

[civ_king]

So, I'll try to make a provinces map, but how do I read (#how I read)
t[civ]Core #Solid, lose stability if other civ has
t[civ]Norm #Solid, doesn't lose stability if other civ has
t[civ]Outer #OK
t[civ]Pot2Core #when conquered change to Core
t[civ]Pot2Norm #when conquered change to Norm
t[civ]Desire #No idea
?

 

[3Miro]

I downloaded beta 9, all the zip files are correct but when I play RFCE its an old version. The change log is there with the file but when I play the game it's an old version

Make sure you delete the old RFCEurope folder in Beyond the Sword/Mods. After that you should add the new folder form the .zip file.

 

[3Miro]

So, I'll try to make a provinces map, but how do I read (#how I read)
t[civ]Core #Solid, lose stability if other civ has
t[civ]Norm #Solid, doesn't lose stability if other civ has
t[civ]Outer #OK
t[civ]Pot2Core #when conquered change to Core
t[civ]Pot2Norm #when conquered change to Norm
t[civ]Desire #No idea
?

Core and Norm should be set only if you start with those (i.e. Byzantium). Outer is Outer, OK to have.

Pot2Core = Potential to Core: when you first get a city in it, the province changes to Core.

Same for Norm 2 Core.

This has to do with the fact that you lose stability if a rival has cities in your territory. You don't want to lose stability early on when you are still growing, but once you get territory, you should keep it.

Core and Norm are almost identical, the only difference between those two is that if you lose a city in Normal, then the penalty is smaller. Only a few provinces should be "Norma", like Ireland and Scotland for the English, Provence for the French and so on.

Also note that when new players spawn, old players "lose" some provinces. Many of the Byz provinces become Outer or None after the Arabs and Bulgarians show up.

 

[civ_king]

Core and Norm should be set only if you start with those (i.e. Byzantium). Outer is Outer, OK to have.

Pot2Core = Potential to Core: when you first get a city in it, the province changes to Core.

Same for Norm 2 Core.

This has to do with the fact that you lose stability if a rival has cities in your territory. You don't want to lose stability early on when you are still growing, but once you get territory, you should keep it.

Core and Norm are almost identical, the only difference between those two is that if you lose a city in Normal, then the penalty is smaller. Only a few provinces should be "Norma", like Ireland and Scotland for the English, Provence for the French and so on.

Also note that when new players spawn, old players "lose" some provinces. Many of the Byz provinces become Outer or None after the Arabs and Bulgarians show up.

So, does Pot2[Core/Norm] work if the city has been gifted or culture revolted?

How do you fix the strategy layer?

 

[Baron03]

I deleted the old folder and unzipped the new one into the mods directory and still nothing. Most of the UB are written as TXT_CIV_Building. Is there a folder in the new zip that is misplaced?

 

[3Miro]

I deleted the old folder and unzipped the new one into the mods directory and still nothing. Most of the UB are written as TXT_CIV_Building. Is there a folder in the new zip that is misplaced?

No, there is nothing misplaced. Check to see if the unzipping created double sub-folder, i.e. RFCEurope/RFCEurope (there should be only one).

 

[3Miro]

So, does Pot2[Core/Norm] work if the city has been gifted or culture revolted?

How do you fix the strategy layer?

The Potential is triggered on any kind of city acquire, it makes no difference if it is trade or gift (which is trade also) or conquest.

What do you mean by "strategy layer". The AI is completely oblivious to Stability (well almost, it has some clue for the stability civics, but that's it). The AI behavior is controlled via the war/settler maps.

 

[civ_king]

Wallachia needs to be reassigned from Russia to Turkey on the provinces

The Potential is triggered on any kind of city acquire, it makes no difference if it is trade or gift (which is trade also) or conquest.

What do you mean by "strategy layer". The AI is completely oblivious to Stability (well almost, it has some clue for the stability civics, but that's it). The AI behavior is controlled via the war/settler maps.

The strategy layer, zoom all the way out then one of the icons is strategy layer, it allows you to draw on the map, I use it for planning growth and laying out provinces

 

[MessageMan]

Why was East Anglia made a province and a England UHV requirement? If you flip York, there's no room to build a city in between York and London.

Spoiler :

The Copper east of Monmouth and the two squares above it; why are they part of Yorkshire and not Wales?

 

[yogiebere]

Awesome 3miro, I'm so excited!

Also, there is still a mess up in the moscow stability map. One of the provinces in like northwest Ukraine (I think south of White Rus) is unstable when it should be stable (surrounded by mostly stables and a few OKs)

 

[merijn_v1]

Merjin - thanks for keeping the dream alive... looking forward to tommorrow's update

BTW: I really like the idea (mentioned in another thread) of a Northern Crusade UHV condition for Germany...

I see 3Miro is back. I think it's easier to leave the patch and release a whole new beta next weekend.

 

[merijn_v1]

Actually you could go into settler maps and decrease the settle probability a lot for Burgundy.

On sicily: rice 1W Palermo, sugar on Palermo.

Merge Malta with Sicily if possible, merge Rhodes with Crete, merge Northumbria with Yorkshire

Increase food bonus of Ivory by 1 (to a total of 2)

Add fish to Iceland (2S of Sulphur)

Estonia & Livonia ok for Sweden

A radical fix for the anoying Burgundian Toulon is to give that tile a very low value to settle for the Burgundians. Should we do it?

Sicily already has tons of food. (Wine, Wheat, Fish and Clam) More food will make it too OP.

Already done for the next version.

If you build the city on the right spot, you can grow a city of 14-15 pop in Iceland. I think that's enough, so it doesn't need an extra food bonus. BTW, on the tile you mentioned is already a resource, AA.

Ok for me.

 

[3Miro]

Why was East Anglia made a province and a England UHV requirement? If you flip York, there's no room to build a city in between York and London.

The Copper east of Monmouth and the two squares above it; why are they part of Yorkshire and not Wales?

There is no need to build a city in East Anglia, just make sure you cover the entire province with your cultural borders (between York and London this is somewhat easy).

English provinces need some improvement. I am putting this on the "todo" list.