Beta Unstable

ok ill do that, yes i have the newest update

it just makes things so limited. I feel like moscovy or spain or large civs like that are going to have serious issues.

If I only settle stable spots why am i having so many issues? (it seems wayyyy too strict)
 
more arabia issues:
 

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ok ill do that, yes i have the newest update

it just makes things so limited. I feel like moscovy or spain or large civs like that are going to have serious issues.

If I only settle stable spots why am i having so many issues? (it seems wayyyy too strict)

It is not just about what you settle. Expansion has to do with that, the rest has to do with how you manage your cities/economy and civics. The idea is that you have a more direct control over stability by building special buildings (Manor House, Courthouse, Castle ...), if you don't build those, you will run into trouble.
 
There is a problem with showing the dates of the foundation of religions (religious advisor), timeline/city foundation/wonders (info screen). they appear as TEXT_KEY_AGE_MEDIEVAL. in the corporation advisor the dates are normal though.
 
There is a problem with showing the dates of the foundation of religions (religious advisor), timeline/city foundation/wonders (info screen). they appear as TEXT_KEY_AGE_MEDIEVAL. in the corporation advisor the dates are normal though.

merijn_v1, your department, what is wrong with the Medieval Text keys?
 
Okay, I stopped my Bulgaria game (the clash between me and the Ottomans looks scary).

My civilization

I made a decent empire: I had all of Moesia, Wallachia, Thrace, Macedonia, Serbia, Illyria and Greece. I had Thessaloniki and Constantinope (guarded by one Horse Archer on start!). I also had cities in Hungary (Belograd), Moldova (Bholgograd or something), NW of Anatolia (Nicea and the city west of Constantinople). You may say I over extended.

I think there was two keys to my relative stability (only Illyria declared its independance, once): 1) Orthodoxy; the stability bonus was, in the end, invaluable (100 faith); 2) I built Manor Houses, Courthouses and Castles in as many cities as possible. I also didn't change my civics much, only thrice: at start; then to get Religious Law and some other civic; then to get Imperialism (which helped too).

What happened in the world

I was surprised Byzantium didn't crumble after I took Constantinople. I'm not sure it's a bad or a good think historically? They did crumble later on, maybe due to the Seljuks.

The Arabs were leading but collapsed around 1100; my guess is on the crusade. I think the Venetians took Jerusalem; they also paid a heavy price for it since they went civil war! Never saw Venice crumble before.

Hungary eventually crumbled as well, due to Austria I think. The Mongols were coming but they didn't do much to Hungary... Maybe me having Belograd (a core province of them I believe) played with their stability?

Cordoba wasn't collapsed when the Turks spawned and Isabella diverted two crusades on them (Cordoba and Sevilla). Not sure they'll survive the loss of both.

Final thoughts

There seems to be an issue with spread out civs like Venezia and Genoa (which had bad stability too).

One thing I'd ask for though is to not make the mod too historical. I actually liked to see Venezia collapse or to see Cordoba still kickin'. I still dream of a muslim Iberia! Most likely won't happen but it's a nice, alt-historical thought.

I'd also like to have a "+X Faith points" tooltip for religious buildings. Also, Belfry and Reliquary don't seem to give points; I can understand it being for balance but it's not very intuitive. I'd suggest making FP a variable value like in SoI (decreasing slowly). Not sure how that'd turn out though.

I like the new stability model. It's a bit harsh for now. But I like the everpresent need of building stuff in the city if you want to expand.
 
That one I don't know about. Why did the cities flip one turn earlier, they are supposed to flip on the second turn ... This has nothing to do with recent changes, I will have to investigate further.
Could the autoplay have hit the -1 mark? Thus delaying the flip? Last time I played Arabia, I also had Sour has the holy city.
 
yeah I actually recall that happening, didn't know it made the flip earlier though.

Alright I'm having civic stability issues. I have feudal monarchy, feudal law, serfdom, manorialism, state religion, and subjugation. Yet I have -12 | 4 and 1 star. I thought these were all fairly "feudal" and would be good civics together yet I'm having serious stability issues. Also is the "4" from my courthouses?
 
He he, I just collapsed trying a game with Bulgaria. Good job on succeeding. I did France with the new Patch.

The new Stability is supposed to be hard, but maybe it is a bit too hard. I introduced the code to make Byzantium collapse, that was one thing missing.

Good point on the -1 turn too. I will find the reason for that ... eventually.
 
I think it is too hard. You used to be able to expand to about -30. Now you can go only about -5 without losing cities. Maybe it should be more like -10 or -15 because you have to be VERY strict. I couldn't even destroy tarsus or caesara as arabia or else the stability would cause me to collapse. By the way, Byzantines are very very powerful in my game. They have about 15 units on Tarsus by 1000 A.D.
 
Playing a game as England and they're really good. You get the Island to yourself and plenty of time to fulfill the UHV. Now I'm not saying it's easy, France and Germany collapsed and the Independents were really strong huge stacks patrolling their borders. Burgundy is the other superpower besides me. I have a larger empire(all UHV provinces) and they have a huge military with 2 vassals Portugal and the Norse(Hungary was one but they collapsed). Lithuania is getting killed by Poland and their first UHV still doesn't work(I tried after patching). Spain and Cordoba collapsed leaving Portugal to the Iberian. Venice also conquered Jerusalem and collapsed themselves and Arabia. Bulgaria respawned three times and collapsed again and again. The Ottomans might have problems, they just spawned took over their core areas, converted to Orthodox and they are unstable. All in all it's still really fun and I think the new stability system is great. I might actually win with England if I can survive Burgundies onslaught.
 
Playing a game as England and they're really good. You get the Island to yourself and plenty of time to fulfill the UHV. Now I'm not saying it's easy, France and Germany collapsed and the Independents were really strong huge stacks patrolling their borders. Burgundy is the other superpower besides me. I have a larger empire(all UHV provinces) and they have a huge military with 2 vassals Portugal and the Norse(Hungary was one but they collapsed). Lithuania is getting killed by Poland and their first UHV still doesn't work(I tried after patching). Spain and Cordoba collapsed leaving Portugal to the Iberian. Venice also conquered Jerusalem and collapsed themselves and Arabia. Bulgaria respawned three times and collapsed again and again. The Ottomans might have problems, they just spawned took over their core areas, converted to Orthodox and they are unstable. All in all it's still really fun and I think the new stability system is great. I might actually win with England if I can survive Burgundies onslaught.

wow this is a crazy game! thanks for the feed back.

alright I'm confused about the techs. As Arabs I'm about done with all the "cheap" techs about 1000. Aristocracy took 2 turns and the next cheapest tech after that is civil service I believe at like 15 turns. Is this just for the arabs or is there a tech "cliff" for all civs?

EDIT: also comparing 2 techs

civil service - about 6000, 11 turns
clockmaking - abot 4300, 10 turns

isn't that weird?
 
sorry for all the posting...

the byzantine empire is REALLY rigged. They have tons of territory lots of tech tons of military and are more stable than me (I was arabia)
 

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Some techs are harder to research according to the date. This was implemented so that tech development would follow a certain timeline.
 
I will try Arabia next, but I just did Bulgaria. While the Byz are hard, they are not invincible. You should build as many Manor Houses, Courthouses and Castles. Also, get Classical Knowledge and start prosecuting to clean your cities from foreign religion.

This will be far from perfect, but overall, so far so good.
 
Arabia:

UHVs: Not terribly difficult, just expanded slowly with Ghazi and it worked well. Getting that extra few % was a stretch but that's just how it should be.

Stability: Not as difficult as before. Once I got castles, it wasn't hard to keep +10 stability (even with numerous north african cities). Yeah your suggestions on stability really helped 3miro; I can't be nearly as aggressive as before. I like the new provinces, however I don't like how strictly you must play to avoid stability collapse.

Other civs:
Byzantines - very powerful (in my game they were definitely too powerful but others have said they are manageable). They took everything southeast of Ragusa (taking one traditionally Bulgar city and that one Venezian coastal spot near the timber island). They even got Konstanza! All the Mus barbs went south to me so they didn't take any sort of hit (and no plague as of yet)
Bulgaria - very weak (I vassalized) and muslim and well as Kiev being muslim
Cordoba - died in a timely manner and actually built an additional city in Africa! I call it a win
Genoa and Venezia - still very weak, however Genoa got Malta (still haven't got Sicily!! It needs to be on their settler map!)
All the others - I don't want to drone on details but others are doing surprisingly well, Burgundy doesn't suck ass, France is balanced. Germany, Poland, Kiev, Norse, Hungary all chugging along like normal. Overall not too bad; still a lot of fixes needed of course.
 

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:goodjob:

The point here is to prevent things like HRE from France to Russia to Jerusalem. The AI Stability is still not fully balanced, but it should be bearable.

There was yet another bug allowing Arabia to Vassalize Bulgaria. Now you can only do that if you say capture Constantinople (or get territory close to Bulgaria).

I am running one more test for stability and I will post Beta 7 (give it an hour or two).

(fixed Lithuania UHV too)
 
I am running one more test for stability and I will post Beta 7 (give it an hour or two).

Hey 3Miro! I'm a little sick but got back on modding
Just dl-ed the latest revision, and will test how the new stability works soon

How important is it to release Beta 7 tonight?
I can finish my map changes and leader update in a couple hours
If we wait with Beta 7 until tomorrow night, those can be incorporated too
 
Just dl-ed the latest revision. Will test how the new stability works soon
How important is it to release Beta 7 tonight?
I can finish my map changes and leader update in a couple hours
If we wait with Beta 7 until tomorrow night, those can be incorporated too

Lets get Beta7 now, we have done semi-stable version now. We will get Beta 8 next Saturday, with fixes for the inevitable bugs and with the new maps.
 
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