Boat airlift.

[ElliotS]

Late game moving your navies can be insanely tedious, often requiring 10 turns to go from one battle to another, whereas land troops can airlift there very quickly.

Do you think long boat movement times is a problem?

Do you think the correct solution is to allow boats to be airlifted?

Does anyone have a better idea or other thoughts?

Thanks @briantjack for getting me thinking about this.

 

[briantjack]

Late game moving your navies can be insanely tedious, often requiring 10 turns to go from one battle to another, whereas land troops can airlift there very quickly.

Thanks ElliotS. While I do support the notion that boat movement isn't very fast in the late game, I don't think allowing boats to be airlifted is necessarily the best solution, but it's thinking in the right direction. However, allowing such airlifts would allow a city in a protective cove to build lots of warships that could then be moved to the front line.

 

[briantjack]

Could some technologies (e.g., Nuclear Power) provide extra movement points for the late-game, in the same manner that embarked units get extra movement?

Could a specific technology provide naval units with an extra command (call it, Portage) that "packs" the unit into a special module (like a SS module) for transport across roads/railroads to a destination city for "unpacking"?
https://www.awesomestories.com/asset/view/Ancient-Greece-Moving-Ships-Over-Land-
https://www.quora.com/Did-the-Ottom...er-land-during-the-conquest-of-constantinople

 

[LukaSlovenia29]

I like the idea of certain technologies and certain buildings granting additional movements to ships.

I find airlifting tanks and other non-infantry (non-personnel) land units gimmicky and would prefer it to be limited instead of expanding airlifting.

 

[bigcat88]

The boat movement in late game is a problem, but airlift is not a solution )
Maybe +1 movement somewhere starting from information era or in end of atomic era.

 

[Moi Magnus]

Gabezo already says that in order to have pathfinding works correctly, unit speed cannot be modified by technologies. However, we can still directly increase the speed of late game ships.
However, I'm not sure it is a good idea for war since ranged ships can attack and move.

 

[ElliotS]

Gabezo already says that in order to have pathfinding works correctly, unit speed cannot be modified by technologies. However, we can still directly increase the speed of late game ships.
However, I'm not sure it is a good idea for war since ranged ships can attack and move.

This was my thoughts.

 

[briantjack]

I like the idea of certain technologies and certain buildings granting additional movements to ships.

Thanks for the reminder. I should have shared this earlier.

See the National Wonder Collection by framedarchitecture + CPMC by me because the National Sea Academy unlocked at the renaissance era will grant double movements to all naval units when moving through the ocean.

 

[briantjack]

Gabezo already says that in order to have pathfinding works correctly, unit speed cannot be modified by technologies. However, we can still directly increase the speed of late game ships.
However, I'm not sure it is a good idea for war since ranged ships can attack and move.

How does pathfinding work differently for embarked units, which get bonus movement from discovered techs? Is that hard-coded into the base game files?

 

[Beniito]

I'm a sucker for realism, and simply airlifting a giant destroyer or aircraft carrier just doesn't make sense! however I do like the "dismantle then assemble" option. It also makes it more balanced if dismantling then assembling took some turns.

a bit off topic, but I've always had this idea this idea lingering in the back of my head. We have cargo ships, and we have caravans, what if we had air cargo trade routes ??

 

[void_genesis]

Would it be possible to make one unit a "leader" that the human can control on the way to the battle front. Other units then would have a "follow leader" command. That way you can keep your navy together during movement to deal with any unexpected enemies along the way.

 

[briantjack]

I'm a sucker for realism, and simply airlifting a giant destroyer or aircraft carrier just doesn't make sense! however I do like the "dismantle then assemble" option. It also makes it more balanced if dismantling then assembling took some turns.

From the appearance of the historical accounts, the boats moved at a much slower pace across land than they did across the seas. Perhaps, if the Portage suggestion is turned into reality, that packaged unit could be limited to 1 or 2 movement points per turn.

Thinking on the historical accuracy further, the portaging of boats didn't happen just at cities. (I'm not suggesting I could code this, but I'm just suggesting how it might be done.) The Portage command could only be applied while the boat is in coastal waters. The unit turns into a module (like described earlier) and moves to land and then into some other coastal tile -- much the same that air units (like the Helicopter) move -- before being deployed (by spending another movement point).

a bit off topic, but I've always had this idea this idea lingering in the back of my head. We have cargo ships, and we have caravans, what if we had air cargo trade routes ??

This is a great idea. This could open up landlocked cities to trading with island CS and cities on other continents.

 

[Beniito]

Thinking on the historical accuracy further, the portaging of boats didn't happen just at cities. (I'm not suggesting I could code this, but I'm just suggesting how it might be done.) The Portage command could only be applied while the boat is in coastal waters. The unit turns into a module (like described earlier) and moves to land and then into some other coastal tile -- much the same that air units (like the Helicopter) move -- before being deployed (by spending another movement point).

Hmm, I was thinking along the lines of a building that allows you to do this!
call it, a shipyard ? if you have a ship yard in the city, you can build naval units faster, and it allows you to dismantle and them assemble then.. it would also be more along the lines of airlifting units. (as both cities need airports, then but cities need shipyards to be able to assemble the moved unit)

This is a great idea. This could open up landlocked cities to trading with island CS and cities on other continents.

Especially with corporations and franchises, there have been many instances where I want to open a franchise in a Civ's territory that im on good terms with, however I couldnt because I was either in Japan or Australia and they were in the middle of Europe with no way for me to establish a trade route with them.

 

[briantjack]

Hmm, I was thinking along the lines of a building that allows you to do this!
call it, a shipyard ? if you have a ship yard in the city, you can build naval units faster, and it allows you to dismantle and them assemble then.. it would also be more along the lines of airlifting units. (as both cities need airports, then but cities need shipyards to be able to assemble the moved unit)

I think there's room to do both.

 

[ElliotS]

@Gazebo is any of this possible code wise?

 

[Beniito]

We should open a new thread, and post all our ideas, even if they sound too stupid to implement!

 

[Gazebo]

@Gazebo is any of this possible code wise?

Not really, no.

Best you could do would be to increase movement speed with a late-game building (such as the Seaport). But it hardly needs the buff.

You guys do realize that airplanes and modern land travel are faster (much faster in most situations) than boats, right?

G

 

[ElliotS]

Not really, no.

Best you could do would be to increase movement speed with a late-game building (such as the Seaport). But it hardly needs the buff.

You guys do realize that airplanes and modern land travel are faster (much faster in most situations) than boats, right?

G

Yeah, but boats IRL don't need to be micromanaged across the world by Trump's tiny hands. Also getting a tank from one continent to another is at best the same sped as a boat IRL. (given that you can't airlift a plane IRL.)

I just think boat transport is insanely tedious and takes too long late game, and people seem to agree.

Is it possible to only increase movement via a building when not at war? Or only at full health? Something to avoid destroying late game combat but still noticeably impact transport speed? Because it takes less than a year to get a ship from anywhere to anywhere IRL now, and like 10-20 years in game at 1 year per turn later.

 

[Gazebo]

Yeah, but boats IRL don't need to be micromanaged across the world by Trump's tiny hands. Also getting a tank from one continent to another is at best the same sped as a boat IRL. (given that you can't airlift a plane IRL.)

I just think boat transport is insanely tedious and takes too long late game, and people seem to agree.

Is it possible to only increase movement via a building when not at war? Or only at full health? Something to avoid destroying late game combat but still noticeably impact transport speed? Because it takes less than a year to get a ship from anywhere to anywhere IRL now, and like 10-20 years in game at 1 year per turn later.

Transport (embarked land unit) speed or naval unit speed?

G

 

[ElliotS]

Transport (embarked land unit) speed or naval unit speed?

G

Either? Both?