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Bombardment of settlements in C3C 1.22

Discussion in 'Civ3 Strategy Articles' started by justanick, Jun 28, 2019.

  1. justanick

    justanick Chieftain

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    That is indeed a bit confusing. My orginal testing from 2013 does not explicitly refer to the case of simulated walls(but by implication it does). It seems i added it here as what i considered common wisdom. So now i am a confused. When exactly do simulated walls reappear after "destruction"? Also i like to point out that i did refer to C3C 1.22. Other versions may differ, but C3C 1.22 is the one version that matters unless you explicitly refer to say PtW or an even lesser version.
     
  2. Jivilov

    Jivilov Chieftain

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    @ Lanzelot: Yes these were towns of a Great Wall-owning Civ (Portugal in this case). Whether or not that refutes justanick's rules is uncertain; my OS is Windows 10 which might have something to do with the discrepancy.

    @ justanick: My version is Civ3 Complete 1.22 playing Conquests (Epic Games from 4000 BC) with Random setup for everything except map size (Standard).
     
  3. Lanzelot

    Lanzelot Moderator Moderator

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    Definitely not: the executable code is still the same old binary from 2004, bit by bit. And if it can be executed by Windows 10, then it must be executed the same way as it always was. The only differences during execution can be in Windows operating system libraries that are loaded by the process at runtime (graphics libraries, sound libraries, memory management, network libraries in case of multiplayer, hard-disc controller etc. etc.)
    But the "rules of the game" are defined in the Civ3 executable itself (and in the .ini/.biq files that are installed with it), not in any Microsoft operating system libraries...!

    We know that there have been significant rule changes regarding the bombardment rules between PtW and C3C. (And perhaps also between the different patches 1.0, 1.15, 1.17 and 1.22.) If we disregard walls for the moment, the behavior was like this: in Vanilla/PtW artillery was first destroying buildings, and only if there were no more buildings would then damaging units. In C3C first units are damaged, and once all units are red-lined, buildings are destroyed.

    But since 1.22 (which came out in 2004), Firaxis has no longer changed the code, so the rules must be fixed since then.
     
  4. Lanzelot

    Lanzelot Moderator Moderator

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    And it matched with what I remembered from my own observations as well, So I'm very confused, too.

    Perhaps the following could be an explanation: the "rule" as you stated it above, is not a fixed rule, but a probability distribution!
    So instead of something like
    it is something like
    (And of course we also have the "miss probability" that needs to be taken into account.)

    So to someone conducting a small test series, it may look like a "fixed" rule, if he is "lucky" and always lands in the 95% or 90% bucket.
    But now with more people conducting tests on different machines, we also get alternative results. (Note: the random number generator is an operating system function... ;) So here we may indeed get different results on different OS versions, different hardware etc.)
     
  5. justanick

    justanick Chieftain

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  6. jarred!

    jarred! Chieftain

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    My tests were conducted on the town with the Great Wall, and on a town with simulated walls due to another town in the empire having built the Great Wall. Buildings were destroyed in both cases, and units were injured once all buildings were destroyed (I only tested the latter on a town with simulated walls and not on the Great Walls town.).

    It seems the walls are immediately restored, at least they are restored before the town with a simulated walls is bombarded or attacked again.

    And the .biq attached to the OP of the link does not test this directly, as it's the modern era, the Great Wall is obsolete, and the AI town we attack does not have a walls.
     
  7. tmn

    tmn Chieftain

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    I was unable to reproduce that without the Great Wall bug.

    I've also tried to check for the Great Wall bug past Metallurgy as reported here, but couldn't reproduce it either.
     

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