Bonus resource yields and improvements

[mzprox]

What do you think about them?

http://civilization.wikia.com/wiki/Tile_improvement_(Civ6)

I find some of them quite dissapointing. I got used to that deer for example gives food. Even more with camps. now? : +1p, and then camps only 1 gold, until much later when they give one more p and g. There won't be food sources on tundras.

There were already topics about sea resources.. they are weak and even having many of them doesn't justfy building a city just because of them, while in civ4-5 it could work well.

It's strange that pastures give the same bonus on horses, sheeps and cattles. Also plantations bonuses should be more diverse depending on the resource I think.

 

[homan1983]

I think deer are on forests which also provide an extra yield. Unlike other improvements, camps don't remove the feature.

 

[mzprox]

After steel lumbermill will be +2p, camp ill be +1p+1g after mercantilism and getting one more gold much later, so lumbermill will be better on deers. The main problem is that it should give food

 

[KrikkitTwo]

The improvement itself should give the same result.
However, the bonus resources themselves should have greater results (deer should give 1 food, maybe+1 with tech/building)

 

[JuhQman]

I find it very strange that forests gives as good yields as bonus resorces do. Something really isn't right there. Balance-wise it's very strange that a forested grassland hill gives better yields than a grassland stone.

 

[mzprox]

Camps on ivory should give lots of gold, camps on deer should give food. Pastures on horse should give production, on sheep gold, on cattle food.. I don't think this would make the game more complicated.

 

[HecatesLover]

You guys are neglecting that all the resources also count as an amenity (except for the build pre-requisites like Horses or Iron). This is the new happiness mechanic. So that Deer is probably not an ideal tile but having the camp there increases the amenity count in 4 cities (last I heard it was 4) by 1. This means you not only want a wide variety of amenities but multiple copies as well if you have more than 4 cities. Higher pop cities need more amenities to avoid penalties and high amenities do give bonuses.

 

[Babarigo]

Deer isn't a luxury but a bonus resource so no it doesn't increase amenities.

 

[MadDjinn]

You guys are neglecting that all the resources also count as an amenity (except for the build pre-requisites like Horses or Iron). This is the new happiness mechanic. So that Deer is probably not an ideal tile but having the camp there increases the amenity count in 4 cities (last I heard it was 4) by 1. This means you not only want a wide variety of amenities but multiple copies as well if you have more than 4 cities. Higher pop cities need more amenities to avoid penalties and high amenities do give bonuses.

no, there's a difference between luxury and bonus resources (and strategics).

 

[Seek]

Yeah, as it stands now, I think it won't be long for the meta to evolve into a "harvest everything" mentality, it's too easy to replace bonus resources with traditional improvements that have about the same (or greater) total yield. I think the only reason we haven't seen harvesting much is 1) early access players have a strong civ5 mentality and 2) there are precious few buildings or adjacency bonuses for them.

2) is really odd to me, as I'd have thought they learned from civ 5's mistake at release where iirc all buildings were flat bonuses (no +1p on pastures with stable, no +1f for certain resources on granary, etc). These sorts of effects helped give a city's terrain even more "personality" - why not double down on it?

 

[Babarigo]

2) is really odd to me, as I'd have thought they learned from civ 5's mistake at release where iirc all buildings were flat bonuses (no +1p on pastures with stable, no +1f for certain resources on granary, etc). These sorts of effects helped give a city's terrain even more "personality" - why not double down on it?

There is the water mill which gives 1 food to wheat and rice. There is also the adjacency bonus to water resources from the harbour although it's not exactly the same. But I agree we should have more building like those because in the end game I've seen many times where bonus resources are just removed for a district or farm because they are not very strong compared to those.

 

[JuhQman]

Well. If they released buildings increasing tile yields now then what types of buildings could they release in add-ons

 

[stealth_nsk]

Overall this thread looks like trying to balance game which people here didn't play. If bonus resource could sometimes have less yield than a normal tile - I don't see any problem with it.

Well. If they released buildings increasing tile yields now then what types of buildings could they release in add-ons

Buildings in Civ6 are restricted by limited space. Maybe we'll see a couple of extra districts in expansion, but I wouldn't expect to have significant amount of resource-related buildings in them.

 

[JuhQman]

Overall this thread looks like trying to balance game which people here didn't play. If bonus resource could sometimes have less yield than a normal tile - I don't see any problem with it.

Buildings in Civ6 are restricted by limited space. Maybe we'll see a couple of extra districts in expansion, but I wouldn't expect to have significant amount of resource-related buildings in them.

That's true. But they could also either have more buildings per district, thus forcing players to decide which ones they value more, or have more buildings be located in the city centre.

 

[stealth_nsk]

That's true. But they could also either have more buildings per district, thus forcing players to decide which ones they value more, or have more buildings be located in the city centre.

Yeah, I expect alternative buildings to be much more common in expansion.
City center has limited space too, since all buildings now need to be visible on the map.

 

[Eagle Pursuit]

You could have a Stone Works and Smelter as alternatives to the Workshop that give bonuses to quarries and mines respectively.

Or a later Steel Mill alternative to the Factory that boosts mines.

 

[KrikkitTwo]

Overall this thread looks like trying to balance game which people here didn't play. If bonus resource could sometimes have less yield than a normal tile - I don't see any problem with it..

I think the big problem is the harvesting. It would be good if bonus resources gave a bigger actual bonus compared to harvesting them (even if it was delayed either by a building (or just a tech... if the tech can give +1 food to a plantation, why not +1 food to all deer tiles)
....part of the problem is the farms, they are Very good late game, so bonus resources would tend to all be harvested as everything turns into farms or districts (and luxury/strategic resources)

 

[stealth_nsk]

I think the big problem is the harvesting. It would be good if bonus resources gave a bigger actual bonus compared to harvesting them (even if it was delayed either by a building (or just a tech... if the tech can give +1 food to a plantation, why not +1 food to all deer tiles)
....part of the problem is the farms, they are Very good late game, so bonus resources would tend to all be harvested as everything turns into farms or districts (and luxury/strategic resources)

Aren't bonus resources become better with time too? For example, Pasture gets +1 Production and 0.5 Housing immediately, +1 Food with Exploration, +1 Production with Robotics. It maybe not as good as Farm cluster, but surely deserves to stay in many places.

 

[KrikkitTwo]

Aren't bonus resources become better with time too? For example, Pasture gets +1 Production and 0.5 Housing immediately, +1 Food with Exploration, +1 Production with Robotics. It maybe not as good as Farm cluster, but surely deserves to stay in many places.

Well all "regular" improvements are worth 3 (start at +1 gain two more +1 with various tech/civics)

Farms go from +1 to +7 (max, actual might be +4/5)

and given that some of the + for non farms are gold, the farms tend to do better.

 

[stealth_nsk]

Farms go from +1 to +7 (max, actual might be +4/5)

If they are nearby. There will be farm clusters, district clusters, water, mountain ranges, but I also assume there will be some single tiles between them which are better with regular improvements.