Bring back Cheat Mode!

[Sub]

Wow its tied right now, 120 - 120. Anyways... Cheatmode should come back I think. It makes the game a lot of fun for some people. If it was in, you could use the cheats if you wanted to and you could just ignore them if you didn't. No harm done, both sides are happy...

 

[rickb]

Well this discussion is completely moot: "Since the world builder can be launched at any time during a game, players can "add rivers, place tiles, resources, roads, improvements, cities, units, and nearly anything else that appears on a map," says Barry Caudill in his second Developer Diary."

So there that should make everyone happy. There is no "cheat mode" because it's now called "world builder".

Man what a ridiculous discussion this has been. The very fact it will be so mod friendly means that, of course, you'd be able to change anything at any time. It annoyed the heck out of me when they changed Civ 3 so you couldn't change things in saved games because I'd always forget to mod something the way I liked it and wouldn't discover it until late in the game when the unit or whatever became available. Of course, I wound up editing the files anyway once I found the file format info. Even if it's not mod friendly, the fact the files and code our on your machine means you'll always be able to "cheat", it's just a matter of how much effort.

"You shouldn't be allowed to cheat because I don't like it and I know what's right for everyone", it's just this kind of thinking that gets us things like DRM and laws against drugs and pornography.

 

[sir_schwick]

"You shouldn't be allowed to cheat because I don't like it and I know what's right for everyone", it's just this kind of thinking that gets us things like DRM and laws against drugs and pornography.

Amen brother!

 

[kasmasnou]

We can see that YES and NO options are both very popular...

Maybe an option in game settings to let it appear or not could be a solution? If someone wants to play honest, he can. If someone wants to use cheats to play or create scenarios, he can. All satisfied, no problem anymore!

 

[hclass]

"world builder" does not cheat (e.g. allow one to start playing with a reveal map), so basically it is for those who is not clever enough to enjoy a cheat mode game... or those who play a game not for fun but for virtue

There is no "cheat mode" because it's now called "world builder".
...

There is no "cheat mode" because Firaxis is going to put that in an expansion 3 months after Civ4 is out and make their money 1 more round.
The expansion title "Civ4: The Cheat"

Don't get cheated

 

[Akka]

No Problem Akka, i'm glad you have age enough to do that. It's obvious that neither I nor you are going to give up our statements because of this dialogue, even if it last forever. So, i think the solution is to settle this matter and stop being repeatedly boring...

The only difference is that I have a good reason for wanting a cheat mode (being fun for some, and above all allowing extensive modding and testing), while the anti-cheat-mode have NO real argument (the only being "I don't want to cheat, so everyone should be deprived of it", which is a big zero argument).

Anyway, as it has been pointed, the world builder include anything that is necessary, so the point is moot, and modders of the world can rejoice and be reassured that some "I can't help myself to cheat if I can so let's punish everyone for that" didn't got their chance to ruin the game for everyone else

Man what a ridiculous discussion this has been. The very fact it will be so mod friendly means that, of course, you'd be able to change anything at any time. It annoyed the heck out of me when they changed Civ 3 so you couldn't change things in saved games because I'd always forget to mod something the way I liked it and wouldn't discover it until late in the game when the unit or whatever became available.

Gosh, so true... How many games were ruined because of a single space left in one of the unit's description file, or a ";" rather than a "," or other tiny little things that crashed the game and forced to restart from scratch each time...

God how I hated Firaxis for this stupid modification !

 

[Tank_Guy#3]

I think I posted on this thread in the past, but I'm all for bringing it back. I liked giving the enemy every advantage he could get. This is a little OT, but did anyone else like the advisors in Civ 2?

 

[Minesweeper]

I think that a cheat mode shopuld be added, however the game will not be scored, and that game could not be submitted, I know at times, believe it or not, Civ to some, can get a little well, drawn out. So this might get a wider fan base in, who would then discover the fun of civ eventually without cheats, and for others it would open them just to the civ experience.

Cheats should never be allowed in Multi-player games!!! I stress this very much.


Mathias

 

[Flak]

Since the World Builder can be launched at any time during a game, players can "add rivers, place tiles, resources, roads, improvements, cities, units, and nearly anything else that appears on a map," says Barry Caudill in his second Developer Diary. He also goes on to say that, "Players can determine which buildings are in the cities, how many people live in any city, what each city is producing, what each Civ has researched. They can also establish who is at war and each AI’s attitude toward every other Civ.

It is very important to the modding community that a Debugging Mode be included, so you can switch off the FoW (otherwise known as the "Fog of War") and watch how the AI behaves and plays.

Sid Meier's Civilization IV: Pre-release Information


It's Decided!

Cheat mode is coming back! Placed in the form and implementation of the World Builder and a Debugging Mode. I really do think it was a good idea to not only bring this back, but change the name. I think a lot of people got the wrong idea.

I was myself going to have this be one of my first mods to the game once the SDK was released (since it would certainly require that level of interface). Nice, I can concentrate on a few other interesting ideas I've had once the SDK comes out.

This is very good news indeed. I wonder if a mod couldn't put a symbolic vote into the poll for Firaxis?

 

[PeteT]

Flak:
I was myself going to have this be one of my first mods to the game once the SDK was released

Well you could still mod in a messagebox that appears when someone opens the WorldBuilder. The message could be:

Every time you cheat, God kills a kitten.

Maybe that'll satisfy the people who are so against 'cheat mode'.

 

[Comrade Pedro]

The only difference is that I have a good reason for wanting a cheat mode (being fun for some, and above all allowing extensive modding and testing), while the anti-cheat-mode have NO real argument (the only being "I don't want to cheat, so everyone should be deprived of it", which is a big zero argument).

The question here, thinking abstractely, is a battle between liberty and control. The point is to give or not much or less importance to the fact that someone cheats. In a more protective perspective, if someone cheats it will cause reactions on other players, like jealows or even unfair competition. Of course all of this is a question of giving or not importance to that fact, but , giving an example, what if everyone decided from this moment to now on tell only lies to each other? Nobody says that its forbiden, but certainly it won't be such usefull

I'm afraid, in my opion, that i strongly disagree with you that the anti-cheat concept has zero or little arguments. Every concept has arguments. So it's wrong to say that this one has no arguments at all, just because you don't understand or you don't acept the argument.

 

[AbuHab]

. . . Every concept has arguments. So it's wrong to say that this one has no arguments at all, just because you don't understand or you don't acept the argument.

I think we're starting to drift off topic, but certainly you aren't claiming that all arguments are equal? Some arguments, quite simply, suck, and can therefore be legitimately characterized as "non-arguments."

 

[Comrade Pedro]

Sorry for distancing the matter at hand, but i think all arguments are equal: none are better or worse than the other, they are just on diferent perspectives. How can you know, for instance, that your convictions and the concepts you think that are correct are truly the best, if someone else tells you the contrary? What is the prove that you have that your concepts are the right ones, and the other "sucks"?

 

[hclass]

I'm afraid, in my opion, that i strongly disagree with you that the anti-cheat concept has zero or little arguments. Every concept has arguments. So it's wrong to say that this one has no arguments at all, just because you don't understand or you don't acept the argument.

Sorry for distancing the matter at hand, but i think all arguments are equal: none are better or worse than the other, they are just on diferent perspectives.

From my own concept or perspective which unfortunately is different from yours, (my argument is the same with Akka's) - *the anti-cheat concept has zero or little arguments

Would you want to treat my argument as equally or differently?

It does not matter what is your answer, since according to your own statement saying all arguments are equal, it then is easy to conclude that, your argument which argues that "someone has a wrong argument" is wrong

Since your argument is wrong and mine/Akka's is right, so not all arguments are equal!

Please, continue argue...

 

[Dominus Romae]

Cheat mode should be brought back. Really, it was a great help when you still were in Chieftain.

 

[warpstorm]

I suspect that players who cheat to win at Chieftain are actually slowing down their progress through the skill levels.

 

[Dominus Romae]

I suspect that players who cheat to win at Chieftain are actually slowing down their progress through the skill levels.

I learned many AI strategies with the cheat mode, so I could face AI civs better.

 

[Tunch Khan]

There should be a cheat that takes away cheats from AI! So we can play in Deity mode and stand a chance.

 

[Akka]

I suspect that players who cheat to win at Chieftain are actually slowing down their progress through the skill levels.

Well, and then so what ?

 

[Comrade Pedro]

Since your argument is wrong and mine/Akka's is right, so not all arguments are equal!

The argument is wrong for you...but it's right for other people. So who's got the reason? Basically nobody, because discussions aren't made for winning or losing, but to expose the two ideals.