Can Anyone Lose The Korean Scenario At Settler?

[iggymnrr]

I've had to give up on this. China is a monster at the low levels. Furthermore the scenario is rife with bugs: Chinese units attacking Jap units in wajos may cause a crash, slow building the H Castle may cause a crash (like if Machu does and maybe Japan,) if wajos are destroyed the Jap spawn point becomes the tile Hiroshima sits on creating spontaneous flipping of the city, the Korean UA does nothing unless the Japs control any of your cities but not if the Manchu do, there is no notification if war with the Manchu breaks out, and some embarked units do not complete there orders like sending a H'chawatever to a land tile (it may park for eternity by that tile in the water.) Despite these drawbacks I was finally able, on chieftain, for China to get ahead on score. If you think this was easy it was not. For example:

Spoiler :

That's quite a build up to get China ahead on score. I had to take out the two Jap isles early, destroy wajos, gift these isles to China while Manchu had 3 of my cities as puppets, donate units to China to fight Japan with siege assist from me, surround Manchu puppets when at war, donate units to Manchu to fight China late, gift northern cities to Manchu and declare war in the ending. All that was to get China ahead on score: ~9800 to ~9100. How does one get Japan or Manchu going on score at the low levels? Can anyone do it?

 

[Yzman]

In the Korean scenario topic someone posted how they did it. Remember that Korea and China share a score essentially so both must be below Japan. Lose Seoul but keep your northern cities and crank out cheap units. Japan will get 50 points for each unit they kill...make them kill as many of your units as possible.

 

[iggymnrr]

In the Korean scenario topic someone posted how they did it. Remember that Korea and China share a score essentially so both must be below Japan. Lose Seoul but keep your northern cities and crank out cheap units. Japan will get 50 points for each unit they kill...make them kill as many of your units as possible.

Maybe at diety but at settler China moves too fast and the wajo bug may prevent completion of the scenario.

 

[Martin Alvito]

This has to be the strangest skill-based objective I've seen in a while.

I haven't played the scenario, but if it's possible to declare war on China then forcing the desired outcome would be very easy. (You could knock them over swiftly and then starve all of your cities except the capital so that the AI rolls them with Medieval/Renaissance units.) Since you've opened the topic, I'm going to assume that's impossible.

Have you considered blocking China's ability to reinforce? If you spammed enough units in their territory to lock up movement on the units they produce, the remainder of their horde would get owned elsewhere. That should in principle lead to the adversaries having a unit advantage, which it (might?) be able to convert into a win.

Can you pillage an ally's territory? That might also help.

Basically, I'd try to be the worst possible ally that I could. I'd try to make the US-Pakistan alliance look like the US-GB special relationship.

 

[MadDjinn]

I wonder what would happen if you kept declaring war on the Manchu. Give them a reason to actually come down. Then again, that might leave more units for China to kill.

One thing you could do is line the roads from Beijing to the north with units. If you block out the river-side roads and enough area to lock them down, they'll have to go with a naval invasion, which might lose them a few units.

 

[iggymnrr]

I wonder what would happen if you kept declaring war on the Manchu. Give them a reason to actually come down. Then again, that might leave more units for China to kill.

One thing you could do is line the roads from Beijing to the north with units. If you block out the river-side roads and enough area to lock them down, they'll have to go with a naval invasion, which might lose them a few units.

I've been wondering about that. Getting cheiftain Wu focused on Japan was no picnic. She won't attack what she can't see. And she sees my former cities all too well!! By turn 15 or so she has stuff ready to take cities back. Maybe DoW Machu right away? Send a scout their way? It's just that she can eat up the continent so fast that the wajo bug may come into play ~turn 65 or so.

 

[chgrogers]

I just won my first Diety win as on the Korean Scenario because the AI, Japan and Manchu, is so buggy when attacking after all the Korean cities are taken.

I watched them stare at a Chinese city for 5 turns when they could have easily taken it if they attacked with units. Instead they just sat on a hill fully healed getting destroyed by the cannon in the city.

I declared war on Manchu within the first couple turns of the game but all that succeeded in doing was feeding China's point lead.

It is ridiculous that number of units Japan had and they never moved them to attack. But I think they are right. Next game pull back to North Korea use the Lib GE to build PT to crank out an initial defense then feed the AI scouts until they explode with Joy. Filling china with Scouts will help I think with block reinforcements to defend against manchu. Maybe all the roads have scouts and the primary invasion cities but then the AI may go after them first.

 

[iggymnrr]

I declared war on Manchu within the first couple turns of the game but all that succeeded in doing was feeding China's point lead.

Manchu is horrible at settler taking out those barb-fest camps. But killing barbs don't add to score. Wu also takes a couple policies in honor so exploring north of China should show her new camps and side track her. I think a person could use one of the starting turtles to go find Japan to create more targets. Scouts can be used to destroy the wajos and then its a matter of keeping Japan in control of Seoul. Actually a person can retake every Korean city but Seoul and feed Japan scouts for breakfest, lunch and dinner. I might try that.

 

[chgrogers]

I would build the wonders in the Korean Cities. If you ignore them than China will build them. Having the PT to give you enough production to keep Japan from taking your cities and to feed his appetite for fresh scouts. Near the last 20 turns just allow him to roll into you last cities to a major points boost. My plan for my next attempt.

 

[iggymnrr]

This has to be the strangest skill-based objective I've seen in a while.

I can't believe it took me a long time to lose at this level. But I finally did it.

I finally figured out how to slow down the Chinese at settler and deal with the wajo bug which, as it turns out, is the same as the citadel bug. I opened with scout/scout/cannon in Seoul on scouts which got extra mobility. One went to north of China the other to Manchu. (A couple other cities got a scout or 2 before falling.) Cannon got chopped and 2 muskets bought before Seoul fell. I set up a Chinese/Jap killing zone, either side must cross river:

Spoiler :

The cannon is in a citadel and care had to be taken to avoid the bug (reloading.) If units (even my own) had to fight out side it, there was a chance for the game to crash. Not always, but it was best to avoid this problem. Shoot first, ask questions later.

China slow up early going after barbs and had trouble figuring out how to get through to Seoul. Around turn 75 or so Wu started putting units in the water. Wajo bug looming. No problem. DoW Manchu and take out wajos and surround Seoul pronto and sit on it. Seoul represents a 10,000 point swing, depending on ownership.

Whole map was explore by turn 45 so Wu could see every wrong decision. Scouts generally terminated in Tokyo.

 

[nokmirt]

Are the new DLCs worth buying? How is this scenario it looks intense?

 

[iggymnrr]

Are the new DLCs worth buying. How is this scenario it looks intense?

Korea is pretty good and the scenario is intense. I haven't played the wonder one yet so can't help there.

 

[Cheeseisgood]

Are the new DLCs worth buying? How is this scenario it looks intense?

The best pack out of the DLC, definitely. Get the Korea and Ancient Wonders combo, the Korean Civ is fun to play, and a great challenge to keep up with if they're your AI enemy. The new wonders add a lot to the early game, and ease the Stonehenge/Library rush. I've only played the Korea Scenario, which was great fun, but I've been told the Wonders one is just as good. High quality DLC.

 

[nokmirt]

The best pack out of the DLC, definitely. Get the Korea and Ancient Wonders combo, the Korean Civ is fun to play, and a great challenge to keep up with if they're your AI enemy. The new wonders add a lot to the early game, and ease the Stonehenge/Library rush. I've only played the Korea Scenario, which was great fun, but I've been told the Wonders one is just as good. High quality DLC.

Nice to hear, I just downloaded Civ V again along with the DLC package deal. First I want to try this ancient world scenario, then I'll move on to the Korean scenario.

 

[Yzman]

I just lost it rather easily on chieftain. I just suicided mass scouts. Japan had a score of 15000 at the end. I let all of my cities get taken too.

 

[iggymnrr]

I just lost it rather easily on chieftain. I just suicided mass scouts. Japan had a score of 15000 at the end. I let all of my cities get taken too.

Grats. Once it dawned on me that Seoul itself was worth 10000 points to Japan, it was easy. Keep China from retaking it. Suicide scouts really means you get to kill more units and have fun.

 

[nokmirt]

I am playing my first game on Diety. So far as the Ming, I have just successfully invaded south Korea taking back one Jap coastal city above Seoul. With my Northern war with Manchuria over, I have units pouring south into Korea. Then I have steady reinforcements coming across the sea. I want to take back Seoul next. This has been one hell of a battle, most fun I have had with CiV yet in a scenario, or ever. The AI is putting up a great fight. I noticed it still does not escort its sea invasion forces with warships yet, but hopefully firaxis can remedy that soon.

Another note of interest is that the Korea AI is really doing a great job using its Hwachas. I have seen them destroy the Jap front line along the river with Pyongyang again and again. Horrifying losses to Japan units of musket and samurai just disappearing.

If anyone is interested in this war from 1592-1598, watch a show called, The Immortal Yi Soon Shin on Youtube. The show has 104 episodes on the Admiral's life. The battle graphics are not the best but still well done. I am on episode 5 and the show is addicting, and pretty well acted.

Here is a link. The first four episodes talk about the end of the war, after that it flashes back to tell the rest of the tale, of Yi Soon Shin's life, and Japan's invasion later on.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P8KmdF-F6uI

 

[SeniorBirdDog]

SeniorBirdman in Steam Forum (AKA SeniorBirdDog in this Forum) posted on how to lose as Korea in the Scenario. Basic strategy was to offer as little resistance as possible to the Japanese invaders by cashing in forces as quickly as possible throughout the game (including Righteous Army units as they appeared). If unable to cash in, deleted the ground and naval units. Korean cities had to engage when attacked, but did not fire at targets of opportunity. Production was set to nonmilitary things. Because of the alliance with China, got to watch all the skirmishes and battles between Japan and China and China and other forces(e.g., barbarians). These events were very entertaining. In the end, had to slow down the advance of massive numbers of Chinese to keep China from outscoring Japan. Japan had captured all Korean cities, but China recaptured one. Japan ended with top score and won. Probably could have tweaked it for a higher Japanese score. Why make the loss an achievement goal? My best guess is that it is because it is not that easy to accomplish. All my prior motivation was to learn how to win. To lose, I had to discard that. Try thinking that the Korean driving goals are to minimize loss of life, minimize duration of attacks on cities, and maximize wealth. Think about the agreement involving Paris leading up to the quick surrender of France to the invading German forces early in World War II.

 

[FeiLing]

Seems like they did fix a lot of Bugs since the OP was posted.
I played it on Prince difficulty just last week, because on Settler China will be too strong and generate too many point or actually win the game without be doing anything. On higher difficulties Japan will spawn many many more units than they do on middle difficulties like Prince. And a lot of y units means a lot of points to get. This is how I actually made Japan win. I've retaken all but one of my cities, develop them a bit so they have enough production to finish a scout in one turn and for about 50 turns I've build a scout every turn in every city and send them to suicide towards the Japanese island. 420 Scouts in total, each of them giving Japan 50 points which makes up to 21k points. Ignore Manchu - they'll decalre war a few times on you, but Peace is good. Otherwise they'll cause China to gain points. What I did not do but might be possible: At peace times with Manchu you may be able to gift them all your cities. However I'd suspect China as well as Japan to roll over them then sooner or later, so it might only be a viable takctic towards the end of the game - simple to shave off a few more points (probably around 1500-2500) from your score by losing all your cities except Seoul and all your land tiles. The Scout bombardment though all game long still seems necessary. And actually it is awfully tiring to produce and move so many units around all game long. Really really tiring. It's a really hard achievement. Steam doesn't say only 0% of all CiV players have gotten it (I translate that as less than 0.05% as some other achievements do say 0.1%) .

However that is subject to change as I started a thread to share savegames, that will people earn achievements when they load that savegame and play one more turn. All Korean Scenario Achievements are ready for download by now:
http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=454424

 

[SeniorBirdDog]

A lot of this is a repeat, but doing so for clarity. In the Steam Civ V Hall of Fame, SeniorBirdman has an achievement at the bottom of his HoF list. Score was 170. Achievement was Lose as Korea in the scenario. It was not a Victory. It was a Defeat. Difficulty level was Settler. How do I know this? Two good reasons. First, I just looked at the Hall of Fame List for SeniorBirdman. Second, I played the game (I am SeniorBirdman in the Steam Forum; I am SeniorBirdDog in the CivFanatics Forum: Why? Because I was not successful when I tried to set up my account as SeniorBirdman in the CivFanatics Forum. SeniorBirdDog was my next logical choice because the aircraft I flew as a Forward Air Controller in Vietnam and Laos from 1965 to 1966 was sometimes, albeit mistakenly if I am correct, referred to as a Bird Dog. If this is not convincing enough, Lose as Korea is not one of the 14 Locked Achievements remaing for SeniorBirdman to have all 176 current achievement squares filled.