'Cause I'm the Taxman

[Silu]

First time I actually sat down and looked at the save, nothing much to add except tiny micro details:

- Down south I'd cancel the tundra forest being chopped, it won't benefit much really and voids a tile that could be a perfectly good lumber mill later.

- Zigzagging covers much more ground when sea-exploring than a straight line, this can be almost a significant boost to the map power when trading maps.

- Next GP comes from Bibracte so might as well use some specialists instead of vanilla forests.

- Could have upgraded some of the Gallics (like the G3s) to Maces though point is moot if we a) stop the war b) take peace to rally

- Can renegotiate Clam->KK for 1 extra gpt (yeah, scraping the bottom of the barrel )

On a more thorough look Stalin's 8 Cuirassiers don't look that threatening. If Tolosa built a Stables and we took Theo we could make Formation Jumbos there even before Gunpowder. Gunpowder will cost about 1600-1800g if I'm looking correctly.

 

[Rusten]

Think I'm still against stopping the war.

Another downside to signing peace is that he'll upgrade the 3 knights in our territory. At the moment they're easy pickings -- we should send some WEs over there.

I suggest moving our stack to meet up with the vulnerable trebs+gaellic stack and then move across the river next turn if nothing special happens (for instance the loss of all of our units ). We can head for/capture Yekaterinburg while building up our forces before taking on the major cities.

Yekaterinburg should be poorly defend and if we're lucky Stalin will move some stray units towards it for us to kill. Also, the tiles next to it are hills which means our stack should be safe (guerilla+natural protection)

Can't think of any situation where I'd avoid chopping a tundra forest at this point in the game due to lumber mills later -- the 30 hammers are too good. I didn't check this though, only looked at the front for now.

Move Tolosa longbow to the captured city -- it's useless at its current location.

 

[babybluepants]

@Rusten, what did you mean? Did you make some moves from the save?

@Silu, I guess we're following Rusten's ceasefire-redeclare plan then... I guess I should've upgraded some units then; I was kind of single-minded in saving towards the next couple of techs... Theo would drop us to +11 and another DOW to +10. That's cutting it a bit close IMO... Do we want the next GP out of Bibracte? I thought we were aiming for a GP... Zigzag: Sure. I figured we were near the southern edge of NW already. I thought I'd beeline there.

EDIT: cross-post with Rusten, reading now...

 

[Rusten]

No, the mishap was a RL accident.

It involved blood and pain, but I'm fine now.

 

[Silu]

^ If we're going with the redeclare plan then no Theo right away since +10 - 1 (from hidden default Noble+ human peaceweight) would drop us to Pleased. Though after we get Gunpowder we could well use Theo for 5 turns at least since not like a temporarily Pleased Sury matters.

If we don't take any kind of peace then Theo could be taken right away; one more thing favoring not taking any kind of peace.

 

[bestsss]

Courage guys, I am confident you can win this war.

But... I hear no plans about the new continent.
Are you going lit (get that HE at last)->gunpowder (can broker it if lucky)->music (so you can build culture in the new cities)->philosophy->nationalism->military tradition
and rock the old world?

Or going for astronomy and colonization of the new lands?

 

[Silu]

^ If we subdue Russia now we can do pretty much whatever we want. I don't think we'll be rushing to colonize the new world, without the possibility to beeline stuff like Astro or Communism. With the GLH it's a valid option but not really current right now. Terra games are 99% of the time won or lost in the old world anyway.

Tech plan seems to be Gunpowder -> Lit -> Depends on trade opportunities, at least that's how I see it

So, looks like the conversation is going towards not taking any peace and hoping he doesn't blast our stack with all of his Cuirs while we limp back (and change most every siege build to WEs)

 

[babybluepants]

I agree with Silu regarding NW. I don't see how we can make any long-term plans there, given that we can't guarantee getting to the relevant techs (Astro + either Communism or corporations) in a timely manner.

Do we wanna complete the bank in Bibracte, or build one in Athens, or just crank out WE's everywhere for a bit?

Are we following Rusten's suggestion to go after Yekaterinburg asap, or dropping back to Yaroslavl'? I'd be inclined to drop back, but I've been wrong every step of this war.

Is theocracy a consensus? I personally like having some diplo cushion with Sury, but I'll agree that theo is big here. I guess I'm reluctantly for.

 

[Silu]

^ IMO Bank in Bib&Athens is fine, as long as we crank the military production up pretty much everywhere else, and after the Banks in those 2...

We really can't defend without our SoD so I'd head back with it, but not to defend Yaro from inside the city. He might take Yaro easily after which we could equally easily recapture it ad infinitum and whittle down his forces - this might actually be the best way to get rid of his Cuirs.

About Theo, well what do we need that diplo cushion for? If he drops to Pleased due to anything, we can change back to OR for trading with a click of a button, there's really no need to stay Friendly 100% of the time (at least now that he's warring). Being SPI and staying in OR while building massive military is just dumb if changing doesn't even change any attitudes for the time being

 

[Rusten]

Maybe we should look for another player or two again

1: Rusten
2: RRR -> skipped until further notice
3: ungy
4: Silu
5: BBP
6: EP -> still around?

I agree that we should revolt to theo btw.

 

[Rusten]

Let's stick to the votes of those who've posted recently and seen everything.

In that case going on with the war wins (Silu, Rusten). Not sure where you stand BBP, but it looks like you're fine with both.

Heading to Yekaterinburg -> no (Silu, BBP) [yes, Rusten]

So we'll just drop back. I know I said I was fine with holding the game a bit, but that bit is definitely over now -- I want to keep it moving.

If we're going to get any banks make sure we do it in OR.

 

[Emperor Peter]

Still around, I looked at the save and think we should continue fighting Stalin, we haven't done enough damage yet to leave him be.
Best way to deal with the cuirassiers is whipping elephants. With stable and theo they are 1 xp away from 3rd promo i believe, so they're strong enough.

 

[Emperor Peter]

I don't think we want Yekaterinburg, better to get Moscow and Novgorod. This also gives us better terrain to lay siege from.

 

[babybluepants]

Ok, so I guess we're sorta agreed on: complete the two main banks, revolt to Theo, switch all treb builds to WE's, and just keep cranking those out, retreat for now. I'll get GP next, then Lite, and keep an eye out for other trades as they open up.

I'll see if I can play tonight, but maybe tmr...

 

[babybluepants]

Got caught up playing another game tonight. Now I don't have much time. Played a few turns and I'll continue tmr...

I took out a stack of Stalin's at the cost of a few cats and a WE, maybe half what we saw in St. Pete. Doesn't look like he's coming after us beyond that. I'll accumulate some more troops and head for St. Pete.

Question: do we wanna join the war against Joao? Sury came asking.

 

[Rusten]

Yes, don't refuse any of his demands unless it's something awful. We might want to sign a cease fire/peace treaty with Joao ASAP though, to avoid him feeling outnumbered.

 

[babybluepants]

Ok, I played 10t. Uninspired and hasty set, due to sleepiness. I probably should've held off, but really got into civ last night...

1240 AD
Switch all mainland cities except Bibracte to WE's. I should've started a bank in Athens, but I'm still not sure what to expect from Stalin.
Drop the main stack 1 back to join other units.

1250 AD
Stalin sends a stack towards Yaroslavl'. There's about 8-10 units on the hill 1NW. I decided to take it there, with the sacrifice of 3 catapults, as I'm not sure the Yaroslavl' defence will hold. Lose 1-2 other units, but kill all. I have half a mind to go after St. Pete immediately, but really have to wait for more WE's, to make it a sure thing. Drop everything back to Yaroslavl' to get rid of unit supply.
Sury asks us to cancel deals with Joao. I accept.

1260 AD
Set Athens to build a bank. Needs a couple of turns, but that aligns nicely with a round of whipping in island cities.

1280 AD
Adopt Theocracy, after whipping a bunch of buildings. The island cities are getting pretty awesome now that they have harbors and some multipliers.

1290 AD
Sury comes asking us to join the war with Joao. I was taking a short break here, so I posted the question, but actually just DOW'd Joao anyway. Unfortunate, as Joao is the only one we could potentially trade GP to, but what can you do?

Trade for Gunpowder. That sh*t is expensive.

Joao takes back Braga for the umpteenth time. I guess he's not getting too weak. I've been watching this area with the scouting chariot, and it's looking like a really stupid war.

1300 AD
Decide it's time to go capture St. Pete and move the stack forward. Upgrade a couple of G3 GW's to maces next turn. They can catch up in. I'm a bit short on money after the GP trade.

1310 AD
I traded for Literature.

Set Athens to build a library. Is that our first one ever? I was in favour of NE in Vienne, but since the vote seemed to be tied and the captain likes Athens, that's where it's going. Haven't run priests that much in Athens, btw, as I was growing it, then whipping a bank, then re-growing. Bibracte's next in line for gpp, with most likely a GM. The city governor is driving me nuts this set, keep seeing random spies and engineers assigned everywhere.

1330 AD
We capture St. Petersburg, with its 33gpt Hindu shrine. Sweetness. It was bloody, though. I had to sacrifice quite a bit of siege and lost some maces and WE's. I wanted to spare some siege so we can go right after Moscow, but figured that capturing St. Pete is first priority and we need to preserve the WE stack in case he comes back at us with a whack of Cuirassiers.

We also get a GG. I settled it in Bibracte, which is pumping out a unit a turn now, so I figure that's ok. Maybe I should've stored it and consulted with you guys...

This is our main stack atm. Needs to heal a bit.

We need siege now. I've been single-minded in getting WE's this set, which I think is ok, but we'll need trebs for Moscow. Maybe switch the closest cities to trebs now.

Forgot to take a screenie of the tech. We can have Drama for 385g and Music for 770g. I haven't checked trades this turn IIRC, so maybe something else has opened up. Stalin just got Astro, everyone has Education now... I'm not sure what we want next. Stalin actually has the more interesting techs.

Joao still refuses to talk. We have quite a bit of WW now... I think that's about it.

Oh, and we discovered America!

 

[babybluepants]

Forgot the save...

 

[Silu]

^ Yay, looking very good Didn't have a chance to look at the save yet, will post more later...

 

[Rusten]

Nice going BBP, does anyone still regret going to war?

Looking at the save I can understand why you suggested Vienne for NE, it's a good location as well.

1: Rusten
2: RRR -> skipped until further notice
3: ungy
4: Silu
5: BBP -> just played
6: EP -> up

Speak up if that's the wrong order.