'Cause I'm the Taxman

12 gold? Try 50 :) Remember, we have the GLH and Colossus (well, the latter maybe for ½ turns more). I'd rather take Theo than Vassalage at least, we are mainly building units for now anyway. There's not that much infra to be built except in the newly captured cities, and many of those don't have our religion.

Setting up a draft city is a fair point. Maybe Vienne would work for that? It has sucky production to get it running but ample food since it was our #2 choice for the NE city as well.
 
well, you forgot the units costs that are multiplied by the inflation.

imo: OR/vassalage is stronger than Bureaucracy/Theo. (although Theo is cheaper than OR).
OR keeps spreading your religion and getting much better whips, which you should. Plus you dont need religion for the units.
 
Huh - I never realized Vassalage free units linearly grow with the amount of cities. Kinda noobish of me I guess but not very often it's a favorable civic at this point. Or at all.

After Colossus obsoletes, in Vassalage we'll get 1 gpt less than now (and indeed exactly 12 less comparing Bureu/Theo to Vassalage/OR) and 14 less :hammers:/t in Bibracte, and gain the OR benefits. In light of that, and the fact that we have exactly 1 monastery I'm now also a firm believer of Vassalage/OR :p

Sorry for doubting you :worship: :mischief:
 
Maybe Vassalage/Theo even? But I'd have to look at the save and see what cities have Buddhism. With CHM we'll be very close to the 3rd promotion -- just 1 battle and it's there.

Edit: Although most of our units will come from Bibracte which already has 2 settled GGs, so I reckon it's not good.
 
you have 2 settled GGs in the HE capital, so it's 3 promos where it really matters, OR still better imo.
I'd spread Buddhism 1st to the new cities and Theo/Vassalage might be good w/ Cavalry, lvl4 off the gate is strong.
 
Since the old hag has MT as well, Cavs could be ours next turn as well by the way. That's definitely another possibility, though delaying Astro is probably a bad idea if we need to hunt down Stalin from the end of the world. Taking Astro + Nat leaves us with 1400g and MT will be somewhere just a bit over 2600g - in 3 turns we could easily have Astro+Nat+MT. Maybe adopt Vassalage now, churn out a bunch of Treb/Rifle, take Theo on top of that 5-10 turns later and start powering out Cavalry until we're the last man standing? :lol: Only hitch in that is that Sury is 2 techs away from Infantry (and already has Airships), should he go that way. Maybe we should play it safe without massive horsie excursions with civics and all.

This all somewhat depends on where the damn moustache man is hiding, maybe I should take the peace as proposed in ungy's last SS and post results without ending the turn already? Do we agree about that? :)
 
Here he is, pretty much the "optimal" place for him to be except the city site is crap:

stalinhide.jpg


22 tiles from our nearest city, I think we should get there easily in 10 turns with 2 full galleons if we trade for Astro this turn :) With such a conveniently placed food resource I doubt he can escape anywhere else, provided he didn't have any other settler galleons en route... Though even if he does he's probably settling near this one.

Fun fact: our gpt rose by 125 from peace due to greater happiness, before the massive micromanagement to reorganize the buggers that I didn't do yet.
 
I notice you didn't swap back to Theo, this should probably be done now to get those Accuracy Trebs everywhere if nothing else. We have still a 2 diplo point buffer with Sury and Friendly without OR.
I think I should've done on my set:smoke:--I did spread the faith a bit but not aggressively enough (Stalin actually killed a missionary on my last turn--didn't think the old boy had it in him).
I have to say I didn't consider the vassalage/OR combo--maybe spread aggressively, whip infra then switch back?

I'm in favor of globe/draft--especially with spiritual that's a really powerful combo and our happiness is great once we get rid of Stalin.
 
So, open questions:

- Tech path? Astro right away I guess to hunt Stalin, or should we wait a couple turns if he breaks free? After that it's Nat->MT, Nat->Chem->? or Chem->? perhaps. Ideas?

- Set up a draft heaven? I think we could since Nat is becoming more lucrative by the minute. My candidate is Vienne with a Fish, irriRice and a couple of farms. Slight lack of production to get it up is an issue. EDIT: Duh, what am I thinking. Massive whip overflow 4tw

- Civics? I guess we're agreeing on Vassalage/OR for now, and we could probably go Nat/Theo later, when the faith is spread, infra is built and globe theatre done.
 
I'd take astro right away--we likely have a fairly short window where our rifles will rule so we should take advantage of it.

There's a Russian galleon n near the tundra--there wasn't a settler in town before it left but it could have one.

Plan sounds good to me--I'd get the globe started
 
Hello team!

I finally have web access again!!! Will catch up asap.
@Silu: don't wait for my input though as it could take some time seeing the number of games I have to look at :)

Now, I will execute an eekdance in front of my computer, as happy I am to be plugged again! :lol:

:eekdance:
 
Sounds good Silu. I Don't know enough about the 'by choice' vassal setting to know whether we should wait a turn or two on Astro. 1-2 turns of waiting shouldn't slow us down so might as well try? Our galleons can get +2 movement (circumnavigation and flanking+the other promotion).

Agree on Globe. Stack massive whip anger while getting the wonder.

And nice to have you back RRRaskolnikov. :)
 
T228:

Took the peace as noted already. MASSIVE micro rearrangement after dozens of citizens got back to work from street rioting.

Tech path didn't raise strong feelings so I'm following my nose here. I notice Sury already got Communism ~5 turns ago. While I was thinking about Astro now or later, our GE and the slight chance to get the Kremlin popped into mind. It was the small thing that tipped me to take Astro right away, after which I remembered we'd need ~ 4.5k more prerequisites for it in the form of Education and Liberalism :( Oh well, not a biggie. Though Astro did take our gpt down by around 140 as thought.

After that anticlimactic start, I upgrade some Galleons, both for troop ferrying and using the couple of Settlers we have sitting around.

Revolt to Vassalage, -5gpt. Cheap as pie.

Yekaterinburg will probably flip over to Sury but that's quite inconsequential, though it does have a settled GG and a GP.

T229:

SB Gets Steam Power, so I don't think we can kill him without Infantry.

Everyone and their mama has Chemistry so I buy it. Might as well, Nat won't be useful for a little while longer and at least it gives us a handful of hammers while opening Steel if Sury decides to get it. Alternative is Education->Liberalism->Scimet->Communism; that will take well over 10k gold probably and is not that urgent. Joao doesn't have Military Science btw, good news for us. Should he go there we should probably get Cavs. Scimet->Physics for blimps is also possible.

T230:

Stalin's last stand is less than epic.

taxman31png.jpg


Joao speeds up research, 6 turns left on Steel. 8 on our peace. Stalin also actually finishes a tech with the single unimproved city! (RP)

Good news(?), Sury's culture blocks Joao completely from counterattacking on land. Means he can only counterattack with a navy, so should leave troops in the Bibracte area and be ready with scouts.

Nothing is happening in the world. Not a single UI notification.

T231:

Woopsie, Sury is weehorn. Don't know when he went into it. He has tons of units everywhere too. Need to hurry up to avoid him capping Joao, that would be pretty bad for us. Saving cash for now to bribe him to peace if need be, though he got Steel as well this turn. Oh the choices... Well, we don't have enough cash for Steel yet so no choices to be made.

Sury is also cherry picking the coziest new world spots as you can see:

taxman32png.jpg


T232:

Aww, Sury heard my criticism and stole my handpicked spot on the southern new world this turn :(

T233:

Sury declares on Joao, and would want over 4000 gold (don't know how much) for peace. Cavalry, Rifle and Cannon against Muskets and Trebs. :p I think we should aim to try to bribe him to peace... I don't see Joao lasting very long. Neither peace or steel can be gotten on the table with our current cash still. 5 turns left on the peace.

He's even making our Astro useless by attacking Stalin! Damn that Sury... If Stalin wouldn't break free that would mean quite a surefire capitulation shield. I saw that navy detachment of his en-route, but I automatically thought it was a settler party. D'oh, should have noticed it had stacked (2) Galleons which can't mean anything else than an invasion AFAIK. Well, picking Astro was right in the sense that Stalin didn't break free voluntarily.

Traded SB's new world Wheat with Crabs.

T234:

We have 4780g, Sury is willing to take peace for 4500g. Steel is 4375g. I don't really know what's the way to go here so I stopped. Sury has Artillery already. He's teching like a speed devil with his 19 cities and all the gold we are feeding him.

If I should choose right away I'd probably wait until Sury eradicates Stalin and then bribe him to peace, hoping Joao doesn't bend over immediately. Waiting will probably make the peace price higher though. Haven't seen a big-ass SoD of Sury's. It might have been trapped in Coimbra, preventing the upgrade of siege engines to Cannons (now he can make Artys wherever he wants obviously). No vision to make sure.

taxman36png.jpg


---

I feel like things were spiraling out of control for the whole turnset (5½ turns). Sury's teching is insane and our state-of-the-art army is nigh-useless soon against anyone but Joao.

With the settlers I was aiming for mainly the Gold and Whale spots on the northern landmass, along with the Wheat the barb cities have. Unclaimed happy and health is the main benefit of those colonies. There's a third settler boat on its way, probably to grab some site on the southern one. Our Rifleman boats are a tad on the useless side now that Sury attacked Stalin. They could grab those juicy looking barb cities though. Maybe we should after all set our sights a bit more on the new world?

The GE, well I doubt a lot we'll be getting any worthwhile world wonders with it. My vote is on rushing Ironworks to Moscow (though obviously we don't have either Steel or Steam Power yet). It has 2 settled GGs and potential for 40+ base production. Another GP will pop next turn.

Our land army is around 20 Rifles, 15 Trebs and 10 Phants within striking distance. Should be enough to make ~quick work of Joao if we get the chance, he's still lacking anything useful (though he gets Cannons in 2).
 

Attachments

We've been feeding Sury cash all game -- what did you expect? ;)
This variant is a lot tougher than one might think, but we should be able to bring this one home.

Rushing Ironworks somewhere sounds good, I do that in a lot of games.

More comments later. I take it you want more turns after the consult?
 
We've been feeding Sury cash all game -- what did you expect? ;)

More comments later. I take it you want more turns after the consult?

I expected a lot, yes, but not quite sure I expected Artillery-in-3-turns-at-this-stage lot. :) Not sure if he could have gotten Steel in a trade. I'm happy this is a SG, if I was playing this solo I'd be at the stage where hey-civving-is-fun could start turning into damn-I'll-be-mad-if-I-lose-this :lol: But yeah with this team I'm confident we can nail this.

I could do the few turns after the consult. We still have forced peace so it won't be anything mindblowing either way.

Cool, we finally got rid of those santa hats on smiley faces.
 
We can win the game I think w/o tackling Sury if we can eliminate SB and Joao.
However, if Joao vassals to Sury then not so easy.
So it seems like we want to buy peace and watch Sury fly through the tech tree while we whack the others.
 
Also remember that we can tech trade with Sitting Bull after accepting his capitulation. Ideally we'll do this with techs, but even if we're forced to buy it's better to do it with him than with Sury. SB has at least 1 city in the New World IIRC, so we can vassal him without worrying about cultural pressure.

Note: This will end our tech trading with Sury (not friendly) so this needs to be timed well.
 
Also remember that we can tech trade with Sitting Bull after accepting his capitulation. Ideally we'll do this with techs, but even if we're forced to buy it's better to do it with him than with Sury. SB has at least 1 city in the New World IIRC, so we can vassal him without worrying about cultural pressure.

Note: This will end our tech trading with Sury (not friendly) so this needs to be timed well.

There's a chance it doesn't end it, after all we have +17 diplo with Sury so with a +3 vassal we'd still be "real" Friendly. We could tell him to adopt OR etc. But agree in the sense that I'd rather not count on that.

I'd still like to get input on the current situation, namely there's a couple of options I see:

- Bribe the peace NOW, and eat the trouble and intermittent unhappiness (before we can kill Stalin) when we declare in 5 turns.

- Bribe the peace when Stalin dies (probably next turn) or take it immediately if Sury gets a Portuguese city, if possible. Slight risk here of instant capitulation or massively risen peace bribe cost.

- Buy Steel for IW and Cannons, and bribe peace at first opportunity, approx. in 6-10 turns.

- Option D, explain :)

I'm torn between the first two. Something to be remembered is that bribing to peace doesn't cause a 10 turn forced peace. So in the worst case Sury DoWs again 2 turns after we bribe him to stop. There's no risk free choice here :)
 
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