Caveman 2 Cosmos

[raxo2222]

Though that never got beyond an initial draft. Guniea Pigs is the South American Region, no rabbits in Oceania that sort of thing.

Looks like regional resource spawning was meant to be equivalent of animal spawning here.
Watery maps can mean, that resources may not spawn at all.

 

[Thunderbrd]

As a small QoL improvement, is it posible to make Properties always show in the same order between cities?

Not how it was setup and I wouldn't be skilled enough to change AIAndy's setup on that.

 

[Dancing Hoskuld]

Looks like regional resource spawning was meant to be equivalent of animal spawning here.
Watery maps can mean, that resources may not spawn at all.

Resource placement is a map generation thing. Animal Spawning came later as did the spawn regions. The problem with the Animal Spawning is that animals would not spawn on resources if the bonus is in the wrong region. That is what the stuff I was starting working on was supposed to address by replacing spawn region inapropriate bonuses with appropriate ones eg horses, sheep and pigs in Oceania with kangaroos.

The Seal and Walrus stuff only relies on north-south coordinates not regions and came before Animals Spawning which is why we thought that doing this post map generation might work.

In hind sight is would have been better if we had used the map regions (not the same as spawn regions) for animal spawns rather than Earth map coordinates. Given Earth has three continents we would have used the largest map region to represent the largest Earth continent (Africa, Asia and Europe) the second to represent the Americas and the third to represent Australia. Then have any large islands for the ecologically special Earth island habitats like Madagascar, New Zealand, the Galapagos Islands etc.

 

[jiallombardo]

Another question -- there is an (originally) Neanderthal city of Lka in the south of the map. Why isn't it connected to trade network? I've researched Seafaring, and even if I were not to, it could be connected to other cities on the big continent by coastline.

One more question in addition -- is there a special mechanic that causes burnt forests to appear? For example, in the save file I linked, near the city of kwaBulawayo there is a burnt forest with a lumbermill -- obviously, it was a proper forest at some point, but for some reason it became burnt...

Update -- just had it happen again, there was a forest + lumbermill with an Apple resource near my city, and suddenly the forest is burnt and the lumbermill is gone. The Event Log didn't have any details on that. What's happening?

 

[jiallombardo]

Can anyone please comment on the burnt forests? It's really getting annoying, I mean, forests probably have a (very low) probability to burn down, but on Eternity that really causes most of them to go "poof". Is there any way to put them back (and have improvements on them later)? Or any way to tweak settings, so the forests don't burn down?

Also, one more observation -- The Gate of Ishtar world wonder says it establishes contact with all civs on the same continent, but I'm playing the Alternate Earth map, and it established contact with minor barb civs that established on another planet (there is an earth-like patch of land on that map, and barbs settled there).

 

[raxo2222]

Also, one more observation -- The Gate of Ishtar world wonder says it establishes contact with all civs on the same continent, but I'm playing the Alternate Earth map, and it established contact with minor barb civs that established on another planet (there is an earth-like patch of land on that map, and barbs settled there).

LOL looks like space part needs to be separated from Earth with ocean tiles too.

 

[Somebody613]

LOL looks like space part needs to be separated from Earth with ocean tiles too.

Also, one more observation -- The Gate of Ishtar world wonder says it establishes contact with all civs on the same continent, but I'm playing the Alternate Earth map, and it established contact with minor barb civs that established on another planet (there is an earth-like patch of land on that map, and barbs settled there).

Martian contact ESTABLISHED!
MWAHAHAHA!!!

 

[Dancing Hoskuld]

Can anyone please comment on the burnt forests? It's really getting annoying, I mean, forests probably have a (very low) probability to burn down, but on Eternity that really causes most of them to go "poof". Is there any way to put them back (and have improvements on them later)? Or any way to tweak settings, so the forests don't burn down?

Also, one more observation -- The Gate of Ishtar world wonder says it establishes contact with all civs on the same continent, but I'm playing the Alternate Earth map, and it established contact with minor barb civs that established on another planet (there is an earth-like patch of land on that map, and barbs settled there).

1. I would have thought this would have only happened if/when you got the forest fire event. Perhaps it has not been integrated with that and just set to random?

2.This may just be a bug caused by land areas being next to space. The code that does the contact (Python, I think) needs to be changed to take into consideration all "gap" terrains.

LOL looks like space part needs to be separated from Earth with ocean tiles too.

In theory you can have multiple terrains that open up for trade and passage at differing times. This should be looked into first and then the adjustments made.

In normal Civ IV you have three

• coasts and rivers for trade
  
• oceans for trade
• oceans for movement

In C2C there needs to be more. As far as I can see we just need to have techs that open up movement but not trade. This is possible.

 

[jiallombardo]

1. I would have thought this would have only happened if/when you got the forest fire event. Perhaps it has not been integrated with that and just set to random?

Thanks for commenting! I have events off in the game I mentioned, but forests just keep burning for some reason...

 

[Thunderbrd]

In theory you can have multiple terrains that open up for trade and passage at differing times. This should be looked into first and then the adjustments made.

In normal Civ IV you have three

• coasts and rivers for trade
  
• oceans for trade
• oceans for movement

In C2C there needs to be more. As far as I can see we just need to have techs that open up movement but not trade. This is possible.

This would be domains you're looking to differentiate and yes it's possible to do but would take some coding to smooth our the new domain definitions - it's not quite so simple as one might imagine by defining a new one in the xml.

That said, I've known for a while we'll need to do that for space stuff to be done right. Even with Multimaps.

 

[jiallombardo]

1. I would have thought this would have only happened if/when you got the forest fire event. Perhaps it has not been integrated with that and just set to random?

Ok, so I looked up and found the code that governs this -- it's WoodlandCycle.py . It looks like there's just too many ways for the forest to get burnt, and looks like it's been tweaked very recently, I'll check it out.

Update: it appears that the SVN version is broken. I'm getting "save file format incompatible. TERRAIN_SPACE not found"...

Update2: looks like changes to TerrainInfos in 11143 are incompatible with now-defunct space maps. Reverting 11142 restored my save game functionality, hopefully, the tweaks to WoodlandCycle.py will be enough.

 

[jiallombardo]

Also, one more question -- why was "Hide obsolete worker actions" removed from BUG?

 

[Thunderbrd]

Also, one more question -- why was "Hide obsolete worker actions" removed from BUG?

Causes major problems with routes and more.

 

[Toffer90]

Thanks for commenting! I have events off in the game I mentioned, but forests just keep burning for some reason...

Forest burning probability was reduced a lot recently on SVN, what version are you on?
Edit: Nevermind, didn't see this:

... and looks like it's been tweaked very recently, I'll check it out.

Update: it appears that the SVN version is broken. I'm getting "save file format incompatible. TERRAIN_SPACE not found"...

Update2: looks like changes to TerrainInfos in 11143 are incompatible with now-defunct space maps. Reverting 11142 restored my save game functionality, hopefully, the tweaks to WoodlandCycle.py will be enough.

The newest woodlandCycle.py won't cause issues if merged into any SVN version from this year at least.

 

[jiallombardo]

Forest burning probability was reduced a lot recently on SVN, what version are you on?
Edit: Nevermind, didn't see this:
The newest woodlandCycle.py won't cause issues if merged into any SVN version from this year at least.

I thought about doing that, but the corresponding commit also has XML updates and cpk / dll updates that accompany it (and I have no way to reverse-engineer the latter two), so I was cautious and didn't touch it. As I understood, the major tweaks were done in 11142, and the latest version just added a notification.

 

[Dancing Hoskuld]

This would be domains you're looking to differentiate and yes it's possible to do but would take some coding to smooth our the new domain definitions - it's not quite so simple as one might imagine by defining a new one in the xml.

That said, I've known for a while we'll need to do that for space stuff to be done right. Even with Multimaps.

No not really related to domains but they might help.

 

[Thunderbrd]

No not really related to domains but they might help.

That's how trade is separated but my considerations on these separations is less about trade than it was about 'area' definition separations, and that would need to be done through adding a domain or two. It will also differentiate the operational theaters of future units.

 

[raxo2222]

That's how trade is separated but my considerations on these separations is less about trade than it was about 'area' definition separations, and that would need to be done through adding a domain or two. It will also differentiate the operational theaters of future units.

Yeah, those are about area definition - those act like all terrain X was covered with routes.
Orbit prevents trade between Earth - space colonies, but you can allow it at Astrogation Navigation - there is route placing unit, that can go to Orbit and place route here.

 

[Dancing Hoskuld]

That's how trade is separated but my considerations on these separations is less about trade than it was about 'area' definition separations, and that would need to be done through adding a domain or two. It will also differentiate the operational theaters of future units.

Nope. DOMAIN_WATER = coast and ocean (plus sea in C2C). Different techs define when you trade along coast and rivers, sea and ocean. It just needs to be extended to orbital, heliopause etc.

 

[Toffer90]

I thought about doing that, but the corresponding commit also has XML updates and cpk / dll updates that accompany it (and I have no way to reverse-engineer the latter two), so I was cautious and didn't touch it. As I understood, the major tweaks were done in 11142, and the latest version just added a notification.

Yeah, that's true.