CFC Off Topic Turned Me Into a Fascist

[Princeps]

Hitler didn't kill anywhere close to 30 million unless you want to blame all the combat casualties of WW2 on him

Oh yes he did. Double that most likely.

It was his aggression.

And he would have continued to kill more: read general plan east, which called for the extermination of enormous populations in the east.

Then you can start playing the blame game ie the French from 1919 which fueld the Nazi rise

The Nazis arose to power due to several reasons. Blaming the French is absurd.

You could also blame the Communists who tried a revolution in 1920 in Germany as the German far right was a reaction to that.

Of course we can today say that the communists in Germany erred, but that's because were wiser now due to knowing that fact.

Blaming the German communists is riducolous, because the communists never intended for the Nazi regime to rise and massacre 60 million people. That was not their plan and there was no way from the to know that the National Socialists were that murderous. If they had known, they would have probably ganged up with the Social Democrats and Liberals and others in stopping the NS party.

You can blame the German nazis for what they did. They planned it and carried it through, and they had to be fought to the bitter end.

How many people did Hitler kill in peacetime compared to the commies, and don't forget about the 10-40 million Mao killed off, or the pre and post Stalin death toll and Pol Pot, and North Korea. Not many died in Fascist Italy, Spain or Romania by comparison.

And also, Mao's and Stalin's regimes weren't that different from the Nazi regime. Also, WTH? The difference between 10 and 40 million is more than Australia.

 

[aelf]

Hitler didn't kill anywhere close to 30 million unless you want to blame all the combat casualties of WW2 on him. Then you can start playing the blame game ie the French from 1919 which fueld the Nazi rise.

Why not take it back to 1914 and decide who's at fault from there?

I say Germany!

You could also blame the Communists who tried a revolution in 1920 in Germany as the German far right was a reaction to that.

Wow, so if someone tickles you and you punch him really hard, you're just legitimately reacting? Reminds me not to get too near to fascists.

How many people did Hitler kill in peacetime compared to the commies, and don't forget about the 10-40 million Mao killed off, or the pre and post Stalin death toll and Pol Pot, and North Korea. Not many died in Fascist Italy, Spain or Romania by comparison.

So you mean the Holocaust was totally war-time collateral damage?

 

[mechaerik]

You also apparently forget that Hitler also tried a coup. His also failed, but he came back later didn't he?


@Huayna Capac357: you listen to SoAD?

 

[Dachs]

I say Germany!

 

[Zardnaar]

The war made the Holocaust that much worse. Jews were persecuted in pre war Germany but they weren't widely exterminated. I've already claimed multiple times the Nazi racial policies and aggression was a mistake. Any future Neo fascist state IMHO needs to be an isolationist one a'la Switzerlands foreign policy. Hitlers goal of destroying Communism was admirable, but the implementation was horrifically wrong. German troops were often initially treated as liberators, but they screwed it up by persecuting non Germans. Communism has killed far in excess the entire casualties caused by WW2. IN the USSR alone 20-30 million is a conservative figure with 60 million from 1917-1991 being bandied about including the death toll in occuppied in eastern europe. More than a few Soviet massacres were blamed on the Germans as well- see Katyn Forest massacre. Most of the fascist dead were casualties of war, with the exception of the holocaust and others in eastern europe essentially murdered by food confiscations and the like.

 

[Cutlass]

It is kinda interesting to see peoples reactions to my views even though the commies and socialists killed far more people than the Nazis ever did. Social experiment see what happens if you walk down the street wearing a swastika t-shirt or a hammer and sickle one. So much for liberal tolerence and understanding huh? I love me some double standards.

Liberialism 101.

1. Give me more government money.
2. I'll do what feels good, blame someone else for the consequences of my actions.

Yeah, you aren't even remotely interested in finding out what a liberal is, are you?

 

[Zardnaar]

Why not take it back to 1914 and decide who's at fault from there?

I say Germany!



Wow, so if someone tickles you and you punch him really hard, you're just legitimately reacting? Reminds me not to get too near to fascists.



So you mean the Holocaust was totally war-time collateral damage?

The German empire consisted of a sauage factory in Africa while the English one spanned the world. I don't think the English and French are entirely blameless, and even if the Germans won WW1 would a German dominated Europe have been any worse than an English/French one? No holocaust, no Stalin, no Communism in Russia, no Hitler. I'll make that trade in return for the French once again getting stomped a'la 1871. England should have stayed out of it, wars over 1914/1915 or so, French lose some border territory and pay some money- less than the cost of fighting WW1 most likely and you avoid several million dead.

 

[Zardnaar]

Yeah, you aren't even remotely interested in finding out what a liberal is, are you?

I live in opne of the most liberal countries in the world. Alst government screwed us up very good. 4 million people, 10 billion deficit, essentially bankrupt sometime in 2020-2030, probably no pension for me when I reach retirement age sometime in 2143 at this rate.

 

[Cutlass]

I live in opne of the most liberal countries in the world. Alst government screwed us up very good. 4 million people, 10 billion deficit, essentially bankrupt sometime in 2020-2030, probably no pension for me when I reach retirement age sometime in 2143 at this rate.

And what has that to do with you not having even the vaguest clue what liberals are?

 

[Zardnaar]

I know full well what a liberal is and they're destroying this country.

 

[TopDog]

No, they're not. And we are not really one of the most liberal countries in the world.

 

[Ecofarm]

Tell em, Zard. Those damned liberals are wrecking everything!

They're insanely irresponsible!

 

[mechaerik]

Corporations are far more irresponsible. Obsessed with profits, their only allegiance is to the Almighty Dollar. Their desire for a quick buck leads to irresponsible business practices, which can do horrible thing to the economy. It makes everything more unstable and harms smaller, weaker local businesses.

 

[Tekee]

I know full well what a liberal is and they're destroying this country.

I think Facism is much more tolerant of an open mind (not this Atheism = open minded like liberals say, since this is constricting openmindedness into Atheism)
But Fascists have more opinions! more different opinions, they are the real open mindedness!

Imagine being a liberal but diverging on ONE aspect of their dogma, I diverged on their opinion that gays should be treated equally! (in reality they should be treated superior to non-gays) I intead suggest that gays and non-gays should not be a difference, you should not be able to see or hear a difference division between men and women.
The liberals have a very real totalitarianism amongst themselves...
They will not accept that they are destroying their country. The only solution is MORE liberalism.

It makes everything more unstable and harms smaller, weaker local businesses.

This is an example of Liberalism, a Fascist would have a brotherhood with his own people. Anyone who thinks not or is a parasite is forbidden and cannot call himself a real nationalist (socialist... though not as important as Nationalist)

 

[Imperialmajesty]

Why not take it back to 1914 and decide who's at fault from there?

I say Germany!

That is a myth propagated by the Allies so they could have someone to blame that wasn't themselves, and the Germans as the crux of the Central Powers and the country that did the most fighting for the Central Powers was an easy target to assign blame.

Who is truly is to blame is much more complicated. It is tempting to say the answer is simple, that the assassination of the Arch-Duke set of a series of entangling alliances. That is simply not true. The treaties signed by by the European powers were defensive treaties, and as such, all the declarations of war were not required by the alliances. Perhaps the leaders during that time misinterpreted the treaties, but I highly doubt it.

 

[Tekee]

That is a myth propagated by the Allies so they could have someone to blame that wasn't themselves, and the Germans as the crux of the Central Powers and the country that did the most fighting for the Central Powers was an easy target to assign blame.

I think that Germany is not the only example of Facism! Russia is too! The Tsar and Pan-Slavism was a great Nationalist ideal! And Russia was allied with France and England.

 

[mechaerik]

I think Facism is much more tolerant of an open mind (not this Atheism = open minded like liberals say, since this is constricting openmindedness into Atheism)
But Fascists have more opinions! more different opinions, they are the real open mindedness!

Imagine being a liberal but diverging on ONE aspect of their dogma, I diverged on their opinion that gays should be treated equally! (in reality they should be treated superior to non-gays) I intead suggest that gays and non-gays should not be a difference, you should not be able to see or hear a difference division between men and women.
The liberals have a very real totalitarianism amongst themselves...
They will not accept that they are destroying their country. The only solution is MORE liberalism.

I'm not an atheist.

Also, today's conservatism is just yesterday's liberalism. The concept of individual responsibility (which I see conservatives spout a lot) came about from the Enlightenment, as did the concept that all men, even the leader (king in those days) of a nation are equal. All people male or female, rich or poor, are equal in the eyes of almighty God.

This is an example of Liberalism, a Fascist would have a brotherhood with his own people. Anyone who thinks not or is a parasite is forbidden and cannot call himself a real nationalist (socialist... though not as important as Nationalist)

I'm not quite sure how you got this from my post. I oppose large corporations that exploit the poor, of any country. I do support local businesses, who could be considered brothers, as my own people.

 

[Imperialmajesty]

I think that Germany is not the only example of Facism! Russia is too! The Tsar and Pan-Slavism was a great Nationalist ideal! And Russia was allied with France and England.

I give up, why did you quote my post?

 

[Tekee]

I'm not an atheist.

Also, today's conservatism is just yesterday's liberalism. The concept of individual responsibility (which I see conservatives spout a lot) came about from the Enlightenment, as did the concept that all men, even the leader (king in those days) of a nation are equal. All people male or female, rich or poor, are equal in the eyes of almighty God.




I'm not quite sure how you got this from my post. I oppose large corporations that exploit the poor, of any country. I do support local businesses, who could be considered brothers, as my own people.

Yes yes! We must return to Romantic times and Enlightened times!! Rulers dabbled with these ideals and created the greatest empires! Truly propelled ourselves!
Economics are outside of the narrow range of scope I look at through fascism, I just want good economics I don't care about details I just want results... whatever works. Without sacrificing ourselves of course.

 

[Gustave5436]

Feel free to refute my claims or provide a link I can read. I'm not exactly making up fairy stories am I? The "west" has become a pack of morally bankrupt, lazy, me first, cretins. Nice one liners though.

"I agree"

LOL.

http://dwardmac.pitzer.edu/Anarchist_Archives/

linky

It would be beautiful if at least the Commies that support it would go there.

Most communists, being anarchists and atheists, would rather not live in a totalitarian dictatorship under the cult of Dear Leader.

Fascists, however, love those things.

Zard, liberalism = belief in an open society with a free market

All libertarians are liberals, but not all liberals are libertarians.

All libertarians are socialists, and while libertarianism is a combination of the socialist and liberal traditions, it is diametrically opposed to liberalism. Liberalism being a capitalist, authoritarian ideology.

Hitler didn't kill anywhere close to 30 million unless you want to blame all the combat casualties of WW2 on him. Then you can start playing the blame game ie the French from 1919 which fueld the Nazi rise. You could also blame the Communists who tried a revolution in 1920 in Germany as the German far right was a reaction to that. How many people did Hitler kill in peacetime compared to the commies, and don't forget about the 10-40 million Mao killed off, or the pre and post Stalin death toll and Pol Pot, and North Korea. Not many died in Fascist Italy, Spain or Romania by comparison.

Clearly fascism is better than Bolshevism because Hitler didn't kill as great a percentage of his own people that Pol Pot did.

Nevermind that Nazism and Khmer-rouge-ism are about the most evil ideologies ever to exist, the fact that Nazism is by this one measure superior to the Khmer Rouge means that fascism is the best ideology there is and total annihilation of individual liberty would be the best thing to ever happen to human civilization.

I think that Germany is not the only example of Facism! Russia is too! The Tsar and Pan-Slavism was a great Nationalist ideal! And Russia was allied with France and England.

Absolute monarchy =/= fascism.

Pan-Slavism was just Russian Imperialism.