I don't know. We can't even be sure about stirrups (like MC said).Merc said:
It's not really easy to trace the transmission of technologies across Asia into Europe, since records on such items aren't really common.
Chinese History Workshop
- Thread starter Knight-Dragon
- Start date
It's not really easy to trace the transmission of technologies across Asia into Europe, since records on such items aren't really common.
Al Zan
King
XIII can you tell me if there was any contact between the Ottoman Empire and China?
Today? Probably somewhat towards the 'yes' side, due to the prior Sino-Japanese War in the 30s and 40s and earlier Japanese aggression.Azadre said:
Tomorrow, probably not, as 'Japanmania' continues sweeping across Asia (along with 'Koreamania') and affecting the young.
In medieval times, the two did fight in at least 2 phases. 1 - during Hideyoshi's invasion of Korea around the 1580s (?) when Ming forces moved south fr Liaodong to aid the Koreans. 2 - during the waku (dwarf) pirates attacks along the Ming coast. Actually most of these pirates were Chinese... But probably not sworn enemies, since the Chinese were threatened by other, more dangerous enemies... to the north and north-east.
There shld be. But I do not personally know of any.Al Zan said:
There was actual contact, embassies and the like, betw the Tang and the Byzantines earlier. No reason why not for the Ottomans and Chinese... Esp since both Ottoman and Chinese vessels were active in the Indian Ocean.
citizen001
Banned
Have you read all the chinese classics XIII?
I can't read Chinese; not that well, having went to a national school in Malaysia... 
Though I know the Chinese characters in your sig reads as sanguo yuanyi or somewhat - the Romance of the Three Kingdoms.
Though I know the Chinese characters in your sig reads as sanguo yuanyi or somewhat - the Romance of the Three Kingdoms.
Stefan Haertel
Title
Not directly. If I remember correctly there have been wars between China and the Arabs over Central Asia. Since the Arabs 'base of operations' (if you want to put it that way) was the (at that time) Persian parts of Central Asia, it seems likely that there was Persian participation. XIII can probably tell you more about this conflict than I ever will.
Thru middlemen mostly. Chinese traders headed into Xinjiang; fr there Central Asian or Persian or whatever traders passed the Chinese goods on until they eventually reached the Med AKA the Silk Road. Most of the profits were gleaned by the middlemen, like the Parthians. They certainly weren't going to encourage Roman or Chinese merchants fr going all the way in either direction...storealex said:
Another route was by sea - Roman traders were reaching India by sea (fr Egypt and the Red Sea) by the 1st century CE. There were Chinese records of a probable Roman trade group arriving in China and presenting 'tribute' to the court. But the trade was almost entirely conducted by Indian or SE Asian vessels bringing the Chinese goods westwards, until where the Romans could get at them (in Indian ports).
By the time the Chinese themselves went onto the high seas and sailed all the way to the Red Sea (the Song dynasty), the empire of Rome had receded into Anatolia.
I'd already mentioned the battle at the Talas River.Stefan Haertel said:
But it's an Arab army - not Persian, whatever its base of ops.
Stefan Haertel
Title
Didn't see that, sorry 
The army was Arab, no question, but does that mean they couldn't have used Persian volunteers or 'volunteers'? It seems quite uneconomical that they would have imported every single soldier from Arabia
The army was Arab, no question, but does that mean they couldn't have used Persian volunteers or 'volunteers'? It seems quite uneconomical that they would have imported every single soldier from Arabia
Perhaps. But I'd already mentioned the Mongol analogy too - when the Mongols invaded Persia in the 13th century, they probably brought some Chinese troops along. I know at least that Hulagu had some Chinese explosive 'experts' to help blast the Assassins out of their mountain stronghold in N Persia (though no idea whether they're effective).Stefan Haertel said:Didn't see that, sorry
The army was Arab, no question, but does that mean they couldn't have used Persian volunteers or 'volunteers'? It seems quite uneconomical that they would have imported every single soldier from Arabia
Dann
Green bug
Perhaps not so soon. Some 20 somethings and teenagers here are still rabidly anti-Japanese. Especially those from the interior and the north. The forums are full of rehashed articles about that war and the slightest faux pas by showbiz people (like wearing a kempeitai costume while blowing a sax during a performanceXIII said:
) get blown all out of proportion by the local media. Hopefully the kids growing up with daily doses of Doraemon and Pikachu nowadays will grow up with less historical baggage.
Gr3yL3gion
Voice of Madness
Just a clarification? Did a chinese princess ever married to a Malay kingdom?
You mean the Sultan of Malacca being bequeathed with the Princess Hang Li Po?Gr3yL3gion said:
Though the Malays presented it as a true fact (I actually learnt this in school!), the truth is there's no mention of it in any Chinese records. The more probable explanation was it was the daughter of an important Chinese merchant.
citizen001
Banned
XIII said:I can't read Chinese; not that well, having went to a national school in Malaysia...
Though I know the Chinese characters in your sig reads as sanguo yuanyi or somewhat - the Romance of the Three Kingdoms.
for a person who was schooled in malaysia, you know quite a bit about chinese history. also, you can get the chinese classics in english.
I read a lot of Western studies on China...citizen001 said:
And yes I know. I did read the Water Margin and Romance, in English, long long ago.
Dann
Green bug
I've read The Art of War, The Water Margin and Romance of the 3 Kingdoms. In Chinese! 
At various times tried reading the other classics: Dream of the Red Chamber, Journey to the West, Xi Xiang Ji. Never finished any. Lost interest because no wars, too mushy, etc.
Finished reading The Golden Lotus though. No wars but plenty of er... you know. groucho
@XIII
Have you seen the TV series of Rot3K or The Water Margin?
At various times tried reading the other classics: Dream of the Red Chamber, Journey to the West, Xi Xiang Ji. Never finished any. Lost interest because no wars, too mushy, etc.
Finished reading The Golden Lotus though. No wars but plenty of er... you know. groucho
@XIII
Have you seen the TV series of Rot3K or The Water Margin?
Depending on which ones. I *think* I'd seen one on the Romance when I was young - it was a HK production. In these times, seemed that they prefered to have more modern scripts, like the jingyong adaptations. 
But I had played the KOEI Romance games.
But I had played the KOEI Romance games.
