Civ Accurate Maps

Sukritact, could you point me to the place where the vanilla maps are stored? A folder or something? Either I am seriously handicapped and can't find them or it requires some extracting. I'd like to make some maps of my own for a bunch of new civilization mods that lack high-quality pics. I know I could just watch the maps you uploaded in the first post and examine the technique and proper size, but I'm asking out of curiosity :) I must admit that I've been using your accurate maps for a long time, as they add so much delicious flavour to the game!
 
Sukritact, could you point me to the place where the vanilla maps are stored? A folder or something? Either I am seriously handicapped and can't find them or it requires some extracting. I'd like to make some maps of my own for a bunch of new civilization mods that lack high-quality pics. I know I could just watch the maps you uploaded in the first post and examine the technique and proper size, but I'm asking out of curiosity :) I must admit that I've been using your accurate maps for a long time, as they add so much delicious flavour to the game!

It needs to be extracted. Use dragon unpacker and the maps are found in resource/dx9/UITextures.fpk. The maps will be in .dds format though so you'll need an add-on to open it.

I actually advise that you start with a significantly larger file so the map can be used for the DOM image.
 
It needs to be extracted. Use dragon unpacker and the maps are found in resource/dx9/UITextures.fpk. The maps will be in .dds format though so you'll need an add-on to open it.

I actually advise that you start with a significantly larger file so the map can be used for the DOM image.

Thank you for your help! I'm not making new civs myself, but I wanted to help others out a bit. I've always used Paint.NET for saving .dds images (mostly Empire Total War and Mount&Blade flags, banners etc.), as the GIMP addon never worked for me. And I agree with your notion about the larger image. I have some experience with pesky clients and they always want to resize things, larger image means less quality loss - always comes in handy :)
 
Thank you for your help! I'm not making new civs myself, but I wanted to help others out a bit. I've always used Paint.NET for saving .dds images (mostly Empire Total War and Mount&Blade flags, banners etc.), as the GIMP addon never worked for me. And I agree with your notion about the larger image. I have some experience with pesky clients and they always want to resize things, larger image means less quality loss - always comes in handy :)

Glad I could help. Please do tell me when you're done making the maps, I'd love to see what you come up with!
 
I don't want to be picky or anything, but I noticed there were a few errors in the Greek for Greece and the Byzantine Empire (e.g. in Greek it's Μέγας Αλεξανδρος (lit. Great Alexander), not Αλέξανδρος ο Μέγας (lit. Alexander the Great)). If you need any help with the translation for Greek, I can help.
 
I don't want to be picky or anything, but I noticed there were a few errors in the Greek for Greece and the Byzantine Empire (e.g. in Greek it's Μέγας Αλεξανδρος (lit. Great Alexander), not Αλέξανδρος ο Μέγας (lit. Alexander the Great)). If you need any help with the translation for Greek, I can help.

Someone from Thessalonique provided those translations:


And with a terrible syntax. Blame Google translator for that.


It should be:

Οι Κατακτήσεις του Μεγάλου Αλεξάνδρου
or
Οι Κατακτήσεις του Αλέξανδρου του Μέγα.(More poetic)

and you've written: γύρω στο 335-323 π.χ
That means: at about 335-323 BC.
Is that you are trying to say? If so, better use: 335-323 π.χ περίπου.
Although i doubt that this is the meaning of the original text.

cities:
Αλεξάνδρεια
Ιερουσαλήμ
Περσέπολις
Θήβαι

Although if you could correct the Byzantine Map that would be great.
 
Hey there. I was looking at your Egypt map and I figured I can help you with some more accurate names.

Note: I'll be constantly referring to the Gardiner Sign List. Here's a version online: http://www.ancientegyptonline.co.uk/Gardiner-sign-list.html e.g. if I refer to sign A1, go to the website, click on A. Man and His Occupations, and then look at sign A1. I figure this is the best way I can describe to you how to spell words. There is also no "J" category. That's not a problem with the website. The sign list has no J. I don't know why.

Note2: Egyptian has symbols that represent one letter, two letters, and three letters (rare.) So you should be careful when making these words. Example: currently, Egypt in your map reads "T3ty". While "T3ty" is one name for Egypt, it's actually spelled vastly differently (using bi-alphabetical symbols).

Note3: Egyptian language has no concept of spaces, new lines, or punctuation in their typography.

1. Egypt

Ancient Egyptian has (to my knowledge) four different names for Egypt. The one you chose means "The Two Lands". I think we should use Kmt, which means the Black Land, because it is the only version out of the four that I know that can be turned into an adjective (that is to say, it is the root of their equivalent of "Egyptian". I think it's the most accurate. It's spelled I6, X1, O49. There are variants but this is the most concise. When spelling it out, X1 will be placed about O49 and both symbols together will be about the same height as I6.
http://www.teenwitch.com/hieroglyphs/pict/goldenkmt.jpg
It looks like that picture, BUT WITHOUT THE BIRD. The bird makes it a different word.

2. Memphis.
The Egyptian name for Memphis was Mn-nfr. Spelled Y5, N35, F35, I9, D21, O24 (with the large base), O49. Y5 on top of N35, I9 on top of D21. Basically: first this image http://www.ancient-egypt.org/language/_glyphs/mn.gif, then this image http://www.ancient-egypt.org/language/_glyphs/nfr1.gif, then O24 and O49.

3. Pi-Ramesses

This is an interesting one. You were right about putting the word house and then Ramesses name after it. However, I'm not certain what part of Ramesses II royal titulary would have been a part of the city name. If it was the part of his name that means "Ramesses" then that is spelled N5 (with a short vertical line [Z1] directly underneath), F31, S29, M23. Basically: http://ib205.tripod.com/19thdyn.html
If you look at #3 Usermaatre Ramesses II, there's two cartouches (circles with hieroglyphs inside.) The bottom cartouche contains "Ramesses" (among other things). Starting with the circle with the dot inside and the line underneath all the way to the right (the end of the cartouche) is the name "Ramesses". So to get the name Pi-Ramesses, you add "Ramesses" to the end of the heiroglyph of house plan (which is O1). You may also add a small vertical line (Z1) under neath the house plan if you wish.

4. Thebes.
Thebes was called W3st. It is spelled R19, X1, O49. X1 is written on top of O49. I can't find a good picture for you, I'm sorry. But this one shouldn't be too hard. X1 is a loaf of bread (a semi circle) and O49 is a crossroads (used in Egypt and Memphis as well). R19 looks like a real jerk to draw.

I've only just started looking into this, so this is all I have so far. I should be able to get suitable names for the rest of the map, as well as a more suitable blurb in the bottom left corner. I'll try to keep you updated.

Jeez, and I thought my hieroglyph books were useless!

I also have a grammar on the Oneida language, which is an Iroquoian language. It uses a latin alphabet with some special characters. I may be able to translate some of that map, but I'm not confident.

---EDIT:

5. Asia

The Egyptians appeared to not have a word for Asia. I think we should use the word i3btt, with means "The East" in vague terms. It's spelled E17, X1, X1, N25. That's two X1s (loaves of bread). Both X1 are placed side by side and on top of N25. Both X1 next to each other should be the length of one N25. More to follow.

6. Qadesh

Called qds(with a little hat). Spelled Aa28 (not A28. Big difference. Aa is "unclassified"), D46 (not D46a), N37, N25. D46 and N37 are written on top of each other.

7. Hittites

Can't find a word for "Hittites" but I can find a word for "Hatti", which was the name for the land of the Hittite Empire. It was called h(with curve)t3. Spelled Aa1 (not A1), X1, U30, G1, N25. Aa1 is written on top of X1. (More accurately, X1 is written under Aa1).

8. Assyria

Called issr. Spelled M17, S29, M23, G43, D21, Z1. Z1 is written under D21. (Z1 is small vertical line.)

9. Babylon(ia).

Can't find "Babylon", found Babylonia: the name of the empire which contained Babylon. Called sngr. Spelled Aa18 (notA18), N35, W11, D21, Z1, N25. J18 is on top of N35, W11 is on top of D21. Z1 is on it's own this time.

10. Africa

Africa appears to be derived from the name of an Egyptian Pharoah, Kh-Afre (possibly Afre-Kh). This is what the internet tells me, but I cannot find a source by an egyptologist which asserts this. I also can't find a word similar to Kh-Afre or Afre-Kh which means "Africa" or anything close to it. So, I think we should use the generic term "The West". The ancient Egyptians appeared to have many words for "the West", so I chose one that appears to be used the most frequently: imnt. Spelled R14, X1, N25. X1 is written about N25.

11. Assur

I cannot find an Egyptian name for the city Assur. However, the name of the city Assur was also the name of the deity associated with it. Furthermore, some academics equate Assur the god with the egyptian god Osiris. See: http://books.google.ca/books?id=vYI...s&pg=PA91#v=onepage&q=is ashur osiris&f=false
Therefore, I think we should put the Egyptian name for Osiris as the name of that city, which is Wsir. Spelled Q2, D4. The Q2 is written on top of the D4. There are many variant spellings, but my book tells me this one is the most common.

--------12. BLURB--------

Original: at the time of Ramesses II 1279 BC to 1213 BC

I'm not certain how to do a construction like this in ancient Egyptian, where you talk about a time frame. I do know how to the Egyptians would talk about a specific year, though, so I'm going to invent a construction that should work for out purposes. (Basically, the Egyptians say "the Xth year of the reign of [Pharoah titulary]", but they can't say, to my knowledge, "from the Xth year to the Yth year of the reign of [Pharoah titulary], but we're going to pretend they can.)

Since Ramesses II was born in 1303 BC (according to wikipedia), then the regnal years correspond to 24th and 90th. So our phrase is going to be "Regnal Year 24 to Regnal Year (not a legitimate construction in egyptian, btw) 90 under [Ramesses II] (actually somewhat different name, but the point is the same)".

h3t-sp-24 r h3t-sp-90 hr Hm n(y) [Ramesses II name]. Spelled (written in parts because it may be confusing, sign lists in brackets represent numbers):

Part 1:
M4, X1, O50, [V20, V20, Z1, Z1, Z1, Z1]. X1 written over O50. Two V20s written next to each other over four Z1s written next to each other.

Part 2:
D21. Simple enough.

Part 3:
M4, X1, O50, [V20 TIMES 9]. X1 written over O50. The nine V20 signs are arranged in a 3 x 3 box.

Part 4:
Aa1 (not A1), D21, U36, Z1, N35. Aa1 written above D21. Z1 written above N35.

Part 5:
Ramesses' name. The name you have for Ramesses on the map is correct. (You can also find it here: http://ib205.tripod.com/19thdyn.html). It is not his complete Royal Titulary, only two parts of it. The top part is his "King of Egypt" name, and the bottom part is his "Son of Ra" name. The Son of Ra name is usually what historians refer to the Pharoahs as, but it seems like Ancient Egyptian texts more often reference the King of Egypt name. In fact, it is rare to find a reference to a Pharoah without the King of Egypt name, although you can find several references without the Son of Ra name. That being said, I think we should exclude the Son of Ra name, to save space, and only include the King of Egypt name. [The top part: the plant, the loaf of bread, the bee, the loaf of bread, and the cartouche). I won't spell it out with symbols because there's already a good enough picture for it.

Part 6:
Laudatory Epithets.
All references to Pharoahs in Royal Titularies end with several laudatory Epithets, like "Slayer of Hittites" or whatever. These take up too much space, but we should probably include the most basic laudatory epithet, which is "given life". (di cnh). Spelled X8, S34.

--------END 12. BLURB-----------

13. Nineveh.

I can't find a name for Nineveh, however it is speculated that Nineveh is derived from Nina, one of the names of the deity Ishtar. "The origin of the name Nineveh is obscure. Possibly it meant originally the seat of Ishtar, since Nina was one of the Babylonian names of that goddess." I found that on wikipedia on the page for Nineveh, and therefore I also found it on about 20 other obscure websites, word for word. I don't have a word for Nineveh, but I do have a word for Ishtar (istr), so we might as well use that.
Spelled: M17, S29, X1, U33, M17, D21, Z1, A40. Z1 is written under D21. X1 gets its own spot this time (not under or over anything).

14. Damascus

I can't find a name for Damascus, but Wikipedia lists T-ms-ḳw as the egyptian spelling on its page for Damascus (see: etymology). Based on this information, I can create a crude approximation of what the egyptian name for Damascus might have been.

X1, F31, N29, Z7, O49, Z1. Z7 is written under N29, Z1 is written under O49.

NOTE:
Greece has no equivalent. There's pretty much nothing we can use to label "Greece", since Greece at the time was a collection of city-states and tribal areas. I noticed you didn't include the term "Greece" on your map, and I think we should leave it out.

That about sums it up. If anyone has any more accurate names, please feel free to correct me. I think these names are accurate enough, to the point that if any ancient egyptian time travels to our present to play Civ 5, perhaps they will recognize some names of the map, before their head explodes from culture and technology shock.
 
Iroquois Map:

1. Oneida

Ukwehuwé·ne.

Well, it looks like I've jumped the gun here. I've looked through my books and I can't find any more information. I can't really help much more on this.
 
No problem. I hope you didn't find my post confusing. I understand you're going to have to do a lot of looking up what each symbol is, but I can't think of any better way of explaining the symbols to you, since all my resources are in paper form and I don't have a scanner.

If you are confused by anything I've written, please feel free ask me for clarification.
 
Your maps look very interesting.

For the Dido map, the last time I checked (ignoring the use of English with Phoenician letters), Phoenician is written from right to left, as with most Semitic languages.

For the Augustus map, Mare Nostrum should be written as MARE NOSTRVM.
 
Very good works, but, no Ethiopia?
 
Nice job!

One thing struck me when playing Siam the other day: there are no cities indicated in their territory on the map (EDIT: but many outside their borders)! It's like saying "none of the important cities were ruled by Siam". That, along with the indicated relatively short timespan of their empire in the DOM speech, leaves an underwhelming impression. Seems like you are in a good position to polish the Siam image :)
 
Nice work!
I just wanted to say that in the Arabian map, you wrote bank of Egypt (بنك مصر) instead of Egypt (مصر). Just liked to point this out.:)
 
Nice job!

One thing struck me when playing Siam the other day: there are no cities indicated in their territory on the map (EDIT: but many outside their borders)! It's like saying "none of the important cities were ruled by Siam". That, along with the indicated relatively short timespan of their empire in the DOM speech, leaves an underwhelming impression. Seems like you are in a good position to polish the Siam image :)

I actually made an alternate map of Siam a while back (I was trying to duplicate the style they used for the Netherlands):
Spoiler :
siams.jpg

Never thought to upload it though

Nice work!
I just wanted to say that in the Arabian map, you wrote bank of Egypt (بنك مصر) instead of Egypt (مصر). Just liked to point this out.:)

Thanks for that, I'll correct it when I get the time.
 
Just some pointers for Sweden here:
  • "Den Svenska Stormakten" (The Swedish Empire) might look better in the upper left than "Sverige" does, it's not wrong per se, but the swedish empire controlled more than what would have been considered Sweden. However the "Sverige" on the actual map looks right.
  • Gustavus Adolphus' full Swedish name is "Gustav II Adolf"
  • "År 1611-1632 e. Kr." (year 1611-1632 AD) would look a lot better, and be grammatically correct; "Av 1611-1632" means "of 1611-1632".
  • It's Norska Havet, not Norskehavet, in Swedish (Norskehavet is the Norwegian and Danish name)
  • Don't forget the umlaut on Älvsborg ;)
  • Livonia is called "Livland" in Swedish.
  • Instead of "Område Tillsätts i X" it should be "Område Erövrat X" or "Område Erövrat År X" (Erövrat = Conquered, "tillsatt" in this context doesn't feel quite right to me)
  • Gdansk was still called Danzig in Swedish back then.
Hope I was of help!
 
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