Civ VI Leader Pass 2

[Yorke]

My problem with her agenda is two thing: 1) It was already Wilhelmina's agenda and 2) it's one of the worst agendas in the game.

I agree with you on being same as Wilhemina's agenda as it is now, but I actually wanted it tied to trade deals from the diplomatic screen instead of trade routes - it would manage to keep the CiV meme while bringing something 'new'.

I like Wilhelmina's agenda even though she can be annoying. Very predictable behavior, good partner early game if close to you, good enemy if far away from you (at least hostile) and she can be bribed with trade routes whenever you need/want Wilhelmina as a diplomatic wildcard across the board.

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

I agree with you on being same as Wilhemina's agenda as it is now, but I actually wanted it tied to trade deals from the diplomatic screen instead of trade routes - it would manage to keep the CiV meme while bringing something 'new'.

Sure, I could live with that. I just don't need two of the same thing.

 

[Aurelesk]

tbh, the more I think of a Gandhi persona, the more I like it. Didn't know of his role on Ambulance Corps on South Africa [so I went to read the Wiki, ofc] (and the outfit is dope, would be great to see him younger and on uniform), but immediately come to mind this persona be called "Deterrance" with some kind of support bonus (basically Gilgamesh but not related with pillage/exp, but with some kinda of healing and some extra if both has same religion?) and an agenda that builds armies but won't declare war, only defend from it. The og one then can be called Pacifist or Peacekeeper like his agenda and maintain the same aspects.

As much I really really want new different Indian leaders, I also agree that we should 'use and abuse' Gandhi now

Or would it be redundant?

edit: "deterrance" Gandhi would trigger so much the paranoid agenda leaders if neighboor but (maybe?) literally do the opposite of chandra

Well, here the answer. I couldn't find a proper ability for Ambulance Corps Gandhi. Sometimes, the ideas have to stay as ideas... or being so convoluted it ends betraying the initial idea? So I went out of my ways and tried to do something a little different. So here a Leader Pass #2 tentative!

List of the 6 Packs with their respective leaders:

Spirit of Independence Pack
America: Abigail Adams
The Netherlands: William the Silent
Japan: “Zen” Hojo Tokimune

Shadows of Asia Pack
Khmer: Neang Neak
India: Nur Jahan
India: “Stretcher” Gandhi

Champions of the Faith Pack
Spain: Isabella
Ethiopia: Ezana
Kongo: “Enlightened” Mvemba A Nzinga

Great Emperors Pack
France: Napoléon
Germany / Hungary: Maria Theresa
Rome: “Dictator” Julius Caesar

War and Peace Pack
Russia: Catherine the Great
Russia: “Maritime” Peter the Great
Brazil: “Voluntário da Pátria” Pedro II

Empires of the New World Pack
Aztec: Acamapichtli
Inca: Huayna Capac
Maya: Pacal II

Pack #7: Spirit of Independence

Abigail Adams (America)
Wife and mother of Presidents, Abigail Adams, who was called Mrs. President by her political enemies, was a proponent of equality of sex and races at a time slavery was still in practice. She wrote numerous letters to John Adams, who took her advice.
Letters of Advice:

Farms receive +1 Gold and provide a minor adjacency bonus toward Campus. Cities with a Library receive +0.5 for every Population and +1 Amenity. +10% Gold and Production in Ecstatic cities.​

William the Silent (Netherlands)
Nicknamed “Father of the Fatherland” by his people, William the Silent was the leader of the Dutch revolt against the Spanish Habsburgs that set off the Eighty Years’ War which resulted in the formal independence of that once known as the United Provinces.
Act of Abjuration:

Your Grievances against other Civilizations decay half as fast, and none are generated when denouncing a Civilization. Casus Belli does not require a 5 turns delay. +1 Combat Strength when fighting against a Civilization for each 50 Grievance against them.​

Hōjō Tokimune “Zen” Persona (Japan)
This prominent Shikken of Japan history is not only known as leading the Japanese forces against the invasion of the Mongols led by Kublai Khan, but also for spreading Zen Buddhism. It is said he was so committed to his faith that he “took the sonsure and became a Zen monk” on the day that he died.
Bushido:

+100% production toward Encampment, Holy Site and Theater Square. Buildings in the Encampment receive +1 Amenity. Gain Culture and Faith equal to 10% of the unit's cost when a non civilian unit is created.​

Divine Wind: (“Shikken” Persona, updated)

+25% Production towards districts adjacent to Coast, rising to +50% when targeted by a Declaration of War. +5 Combat Strength to Naval and Land units in shallow water tiles or adjacent to Coast. Hurricanes and Tornadoes deal no damage to your districts, improvements and units, and deal double to warring enemy units within your territory.​

Pack #8: Shadows of Asia

Neang Neak (Khmer)
According to legend, this pirate Princess of the Naga clan attacked a foreign merchant ship but was so impressed by their bravery, she proposed to marry their leader. Widely claimed as the first monarch of Cambodia, the union led to the foundation of the matrilineal monarchy of Funan.
The First Monarch:

Plundering a Trade Route consumes 1 Movement and doesn’t end the turn. Coast and Lake base terrain yields are doubled. Harbor, Commercial Hub, Holy Site and Theater Square adjacent to those tiles gain +2 to their yield.​

Nur Jahan (India)
Twentieth wife and chief consort of the Mughal emperor Jahanfir, Nur Jahan was a more decisive and proactive empress than her husband. She is considered by certain historians to have been the real power behind the throne for more than a decade, up to issuing coinage struck in her name.
Sun among Women:

Domestic Trade Routes provide 2 Gold for every Specialty District at the Origin, and 2 Culture. +1 Trade Route for each Wonder in your Empire.​

Gandhi “Stretcher” Persona (India)
Everybody knows this famous Indian anti-colonial nationalist who employed nonviolent resistance for India’s independence from British rule. But did you know he went to South Africa for 21 years, initially to represent an Indian merchant in a lawsuit? His venture in South Africa led him to play a role in the Boer War, in which he created the Natal Indian Ambulance Corps for the British to use as stretcher bearers.
Ambulance Corps:

Enjoys Open Border with every Civilizations and City-States in the game. +5% Culture, Faith, Gold, Production or Science for a Cultural, Religious, Economical, Military or Scientific Alliance respectively to both Civilizations. Land units heal at the end of every turn, even if it moves or attacks inside your territory or allied territory. Allied land units behave the same.​

Pack #9: Champions of the Faith

Isabella I of Castile (Spain)
First monarch to be referred to as the “Queen of Spain”, she was, alongside Ferdinand II of Aragon, responsible for the completion of the Reconquista, the Spanish Inquisition and the financing of Christopher Colombus’s 1492 voyage to the New World. This led to the establishment of the Spanish Empire, and making Spain a major power in the world.
El Dorado:

+10 Combat Strength to units within 4 tiles of a Natural Wonder. Mines and Quarries provide Gold equal to half of their Appeal.​

Ezana (Ethiopia)
Not much is known about the Kingdom of Aksum, an ancient kingdom located in what is now Eritrea and Ethiopia, but Ezana is one of the best documented rulers. He embraced Christianity, conquered the Kingdom of Kush and is credited for erecting several stelae and obelisk.
King of Aksum:

Monuments provide +1 Great Prophet point and +2 Loyalty, and are built or repaired in half the time. Religious pressure on adjacent cities is 50% stronger.​

Mvemba A Nzinga “Enlightened” Persona (Kongo)
Best known for his vigorous attempt to convert Kongo to the Catholic faith, Mvemba A Nzinga was a pragmatic ruler, welcoming Europe and scientific innovation, but ultimately refused to adopt Portugal’s legal code and sell land to prospectors.
Selective Modernizer:

International Trade Routes receive +1 Science for every follower in this city when trading with a city sharing the same Religion.​

Religious Convert: (“Tradition” Persona, updated)

Holy Site adjacencies, Shrines and Temples provide Food and Gold instead of Faith. Enjoy all Beliefs of any Religion that has established itself in a majority of his cities. +2 Movement to all religious units, and they can be bought with Gold at half cost. Great Prophet points and Great Prophets cannot be earned.​

Pack #10: Great Emperors

Napoléon (France)
This famous military commander rose to prominence during the French Revolution and led successful campaigns during the Revolutionary Wars. Initially First Consul of the French Republic, then crowning himself as Emperor of the French, he defeated numerous Coalitions against France from countries, who feared the spread of Enlightenment ideas… or the Revolution of their people.
Monarchy, Republic, Dictatorship:

Can change policy without paying Gold. Each time a new Government is picked, face a Revolt either it is the first time or not. Revolts only last 1 turn, with yields reduced by 50% instead of 100%. +7 Combat Strength when facing a Civilization with a different Government. +50% Tourism modifier if the Government is shared.​

Maria Theresa (Germany & Hungary)
King of Hungary in her own right, and Holy Roman Empress by marriage, Maria Theresa was the only woman to be ruler of the Habsburg dominions. Inheriting a vast yet precarious Kingdom and struggling to deal with the rise of Prussia, she secured her kingdom and expanded its influence far more than any contemporary would have bet.
King and Empress:

Governors require 2 less turns to establish. Government Plaza and their buildings provide 2 Governor Titles instead of 1. A free Diplomatic slot is provided to any Government once The Enlightenment is discovered.​

Julius Caesar “Dictator” Persona (Rome)
General and statesman, Caesar led the Roman armies in the Gallic Wars which greatly extended Roman territory. Instead of stepping down from his military command as the Senate was asking for, he crossed the Rubicon, began Caesar's civil war and became the “dictator for life”.
For Rome’s glory:

Capital city ignores District slot restriction. Cities with a Domestic Trade Route toward the capital have +50% Production toward districts already built in the Capital.​

Pack #11: War and Peace

Catherine II (Russia)
After coming to power after overthrowing her husband, Catherine the Great was inspired by the ideas of the Enlightenment. It led to the founding of many new cities, universities along with large-scale immigration, allowing Russia to finally be considered as one of the great powers of Europe.
Nakaz:

Campus triggers a Culture Bomb. Universities gain 2 slots for Great Works of Writing and increase the accumulation of ressource in the city by 1. Great Works of Writing grant +2 Food and +2 Science.​

Peter “Maritime” Persona (Russia)
Peter’s reign was consumed by long wars against the Ottoman and Swedish Empires, which were ultimately successful and led to expansion to the Sea of Azov and the Baltic Sea. It laid the groundwork for the Imperial Russia Navy and the foundation of the city of Saint Petersburg.
Delusions of Grandeur:

Cities founded on the coast start with a free Builder. +50% Production toward Canal, Harbor and Industrial Zone districts as long as they are adjacent to the City Center. Harbor's buildings can be bought with Faith.​

The Great Embassy: (“Socialite” Persona, updated)

International Trade Routes toward other Civilizations provide +1 Culture and +1 Science when sent from a Capital city, when sent to a Capital city, and for every Diplomatic Quarter’s building at both the Origin and at the Destination. +100% Production toward the Diplomatic Quarter district and its buildings.​

Pedro II “Patriot” Persona (Brazil)
Even if Pedro II was at the head of an huge Empire, when the Paraguayan started a war without any declaration, the Brazilian Army was very small and dispersed throughout all the Empire. Capitalizing on the fervor of the Brazilian people, he enacted a decree to allow volunteers in the army.
Voluntário da Pátria:

Farms, Pastures and Rainforests provide a standard Food adjacency to Encampment, Street Carnival and Copacabana. Can buy military units with Gold and Faith at 25% of their cost, but drains 1 Population. All units can move the turn they have been bought.​

Pack #12: Empires of the New World

Acamapichtli (Aztec)
First ruling ascihuacóatl, Acamapichtli ends up as the first Tlatoani of the Aztecs of Tenochtitlan. He expanded the city’s agricultural base by expanding the chinampa system, and strengthened his position more by alliances with his neighbors than by wars. This laid the foundation of the powerful Aztec Empire we all know.
Excan Tlatoloyan:

Cities with at least 1 specialty district provide 1 Influence per turn for every City-States within 6 tiles. Gain the Chinampa improvement when Irrigation is discovered.​

Chinampa: Acamapichtli's tile improvement unlocked by Irrigation. Can be built on Marsh, Floodplain or Lake tiles, or on a Coast tile adjacent to a freshwater tile.

+1 Food, +1 Gold, and +0.5 Housing​

+1 Food if adjacent to a Chinampa, or for each adjacent Chinampa with Feudalism.​

+1 Food if adjacent Wheat, Rice or Corn, or for each adjacent of those resources with Feudalism.​

+1 Gold for every adjacent Plantation, or +2 Gold with Civil Engineering.​

Huayna Capac (Inca)
Also known as the Young Mighty One, Huayna Capac expanded the territory of the Incan empire ‘s borders south along the Chilean coast, and north through what is now Ecuador and southern Colombia.
Tawantinsuyu:

A city with a Government Plaza or a Diplomatic Quartier provides a Palace and is considered as a Capital alongside the first Capital. +2 Combat Strength for each Capital and conquered Capital under his control.​

Pacal II (Maya)
As the fifth-longest reign in history, and the longest in world history for more than a millennium, Pakal the Great was ajaw of the Paya city-state of Palenque and reigned 68 years, thanks to the Mayan calendar . Not much is known about his reign, apart from the many building programs that produced some Mayans finest art and architecture he initiated.
The Long Count:

Applies 20 free Great People points toward recruiting all current and future Great People when entering a new Era (on Standard Speed).​

I tried to not make too much reference to Civilization V abilities, but allowed myself some since, you know... they went all out on Elizabeth I. What do you think? Is there something at least decent, or everything has to be thrown away?

 

[Bonyduck Campersang]

Well, here the answer. I couldn't find a proper ability for Ambulance Corps Gandhi. Sometimes, the ideas have to stay as ideas... or being so convoluted it ends betraying the initial idea? So I went out of my ways and tried to do something a little different. So here a Leader Pass #2 tentative!

List of the 6 Packs with their respective leaders:



Pack #7: Spirit of Independence



Pack #8: Shadows of Asia


Pack #9: Champions of the Faith


Pack #10: Great Emperors


Pack #11: War and Peace


Pack #12: Empires of the New World


I tried to not make too much reference to Civilization V abilities, but allowed myself some since, you know... they went all out on Elizabeth I. What do you think? Is there something at least decent, or everything has to be thrown away?

Nice designs, but I'm disappointed that most of the leaders are either returning from Civ5 or just personas for existing leaders

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

If we must go with an alternate persona for another Indian leader, I've been more partial to the idea of giving Chandragupta a Jain Monk persona. It would also get Jainism in the game, as his preferred religion.
His ability could be Sallekhana-Has access to the Sallekhana a unique Holy Site project. This project converts the city's food output to faith while active.

 

[Aurelesk]

Nice designs, but I'm disappointed that most of the leaders are either returning from Civ5 or just personas for existing leaders

The criticism is valid. It also means you were disappointed by the real Leader Pass #1, as I tried to emulate it. It has:

• 6 Personas: Saladin (Sultan), Suleiman (Magnificent), Qin Shi Huangdi (Unifier), Cleopatra (Ptolemaic), Harald Hardrada (Varangian), and Victoria (Age of Steam).
• 8 returning leaders:
  • From V (5): Wu Zetian, Ramses, Theodora, Sejong, and Elizabeth I.
  • From IV (3): Abraham Lincoln, Tokugawa, and Julius Caesar (it was Augustus in V, I wasn't aware until very recently).
• 5 newcomers: Mbande Nzinga, Nader Shah, Yongle, Sundiata Keita, and Ludwig II.

Here we have roughly the same number:

• 6 Personas: Hojo Tokimune (Zen), Gandhi (Stretcher), Mvemba A Nzinga (Enlightened), Julius Caesar (Dictator), Peter (Maritime), and Pedro II (Patriot).
• 7 returning leaders:
  • From V (6): William the Silent, Isabella, Napoléon, Maria Theresa, Catherine II, and Pacal II
  • From IV (1): Huayna Capac
• 5 newcomers: Abigail Adams, Neang Neak, Nur Jahan, Ezana, and Acamapichtli.
• I should have picked a #19. This would be a hard task. Sargon of Akkad for Sumeria?

I had some ideas for switches:

• Napoléon (from V) → Charles de Gaule (from IV). But I came out with a very unique ability for Napoléon that cannot be given to another Leader. The "Resistance" leader is given to William the Silent, so if the switch is made to Charles de Gaule, I guess he would be a Scientific leaders, with a love for Spaceport and Nuclear Devices. I excluded leaders such as Philip Augustus (because of Eleanor), Henri IV (because of Black Queen) or Louis XIV (because of Magnificent), covering the same time period or idea.
• Catherine II (from V) → Olga of Kiev (newcomer). She was my first pick but... it would be a very bad taste to introduce her with the current event under the "Russian" civilization, even if we give her Yellow-Blue color. So I picked Catherine II. Probably the best female leaders Russia can offer... My problem being she is not very distinct from Peter (same era roughly).
• Julius Caesar (Persona) → Auguste Caesar (from V). Basically, I gave him the wrong ability. It is the epitome of "I found Rome a city of bricks and left it a city of marble". But really, Rome doesn't really need a new leader. I put it in because I wanted a Leader for each expansion: Khmer (C&S), the Netherlands (R&F), the Incan (GS), the Mayan (NFP) and Julius Caesar (LP). They had an exception with the Suleiman (2nd GS representative, with Sundiata), so I took Ethiopia (NFP) as my exception.

If we must go with an alternate persona for another Indian leader, I've been more partial to the idea of giving Chandragupta a Jain Monk persona. It would also get Jainism in the game, as his preferred religion.
His ability could be Sallekhana-Has access to the Sallekhana a unique Holy Site project. This project converts the city's food output to faith while active.

Anyone else is better than Gandhi. But most of the Persona are from Vanilla leaders, except Suleiman (which is the exception, as the Onion hat was too irresistible). Out of the 8 Personas, 7 are from Vanilla leaders: Catherine de Medici, Teddy Roosevelt, Saladin, Qin Shi Huang, Cleopatra, Harald Hardradra and Victoria are all from Vanilla, probably to sell them better without requiring any DLC.
As my exception card was picked for Ethiopia, I could only pick within the 13 remaining Vanilla leaders:

1. Frederick Barbarossa (→ Maria Theresa)
2. Gandhi (picked as Stretcher)
3. Gilgamesh
4. Gorgo & Pericles (no Greek over-representation, plus picking 1 mean you have to pick both in order to not destroy the Sparta & Athen duality)
5. Hojo Tokimune (picked as Zen)
6. Montezuma (→ Acamapichtli)
7. Mvemba A Nzinga (picked as Enlightened)
8. Pedro II (picked as Patriot)
9. Peter (picked as Maritime)
10. Philip II (→ Isabella)
11. Tomyris
12. Trajan (→ Julius Caesar).

Basically, I could only choose between Gandhi, Gilgamesh and Tomyris. But I really wanted to expand the India civilization, so I picked Gandhi: the best way to never see him again is to overuse right now so the fanbase would be tired of him.

 

[Bonyduck Campersang]

It also means you were disappointed by the real Leader Pass #1, as I tried to emulate it

I was in fact disappointed by the leader pass, but Nader Shah and Sundiata Keita were welcome surprises

Probably the best female leaders Russia can offer...

Elizabeth (Peter's daughter), Marfa Boretskaya (last leader of Novgorod) and Sophia Alekseyevna are also good choices for female Russian leaders

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

Basically, I could only choose between Gandhi, Gilgamesh and Tomyris. But I really wanted to expand the India civilization, so I picked Gandhi: the best way to never see him again is to overuse right now so the fanbase would be tired of him.

Well, I'm sure me and many others would take a non Epic of Gilgamesh, Gilgamesh.
Not sure what I'd give him though. Maybe something to do with actually building up Uruk, as a cradle of civilization?
Uruk Period-50% faster production on districts that replace farms?

 

[Aurelesk]

I will explain my thought process. I put myself under some rules:

• Persona: It should be 6 Personas, all from the Base Game leaders.
• Gender: The gender ratio should be close to 2:1, so around 6-7 female Leaders for 12-13 male Leaders.
• Expansion: It should be 1 and only 1 representative per Expansion (C&S, R&F, GS, NFP and perhaps LP?).
• Representation: All Civilization are sorted by "Continent", and we count how much Civilization, Leaders and Personas there are:
  • Africa (5C - 7L - 0P): Ethiopian, Kongolese, Malian, Nubian, and Zulu
  • America (North) (6C - 6L - 1P): American (2), Aztec, Canadian, Cree, and Mayan.
  • America (South) (4C - 4L - 0P): Brazilian, Gran Colombian, Inca, and Mapuche.
  • Asia (and Oceania) (12C - 16L - 1P): Australian, Chinese (2), Indian (2), Indonesian, Japanese, Khmer, Korean, Māori, Mongolian, and Vietnamese.
  • Europe (20.5C - 25L - 3P): Byzantine, Dutch, English (1.5), French (1.5), Gallic, Georgian, German, Greek, Hungarian, Macedonian, Norwegian, Polish, Portuguese, Roman, Russian (1.5), Scottish, Scythian, Spanish, and Swedish.
  • Middle East (7C - 9L - 3P): Arabian, Babylonian, Egyptian, Ottoman, Persian, Phoenician, and Sumerian.
• Target over-representation: Some civilizations count as 1.5 or 2 if we are going to give them more leaders, in order to not decrease the odd of the Civilization sharing the same continent to have a Leader or a Persona:
  • Big 3: American, Chinese, and Indian. They should have 3 Leaders and 1 Persona, and count as 2 Civilizations.
  • Small 3: English, French, and Russian. They should have 2 Leaders and 1 Persona. Shared leaders counts only for 0.5. Count as 1.5 Civilizations.
• Proportionality: The number of Leaders and Persona per continent should be proportional by the amount of Civilization within the continent.
• Exceptions: I can allow myself to cheat up to 2 times, mostly when I cannot find a solution to my set of rule.

After some maths, I end up with that:

Continent	Leaders	Picked	Persona	Picked
Africa	0.34	1	1.28	1
America (North)	2.81	3	0.54	0
America (South)	1.87	2	1.03	1
Asia (and Oceania)	1.61	2	2.08	2
Europe	5.09	5	2.27	2
Middle East	1.28	0	-1.20 (too much!)	0
Total	13	13	6	6

Then I try to fill the gap:

Continent	Persona	Civilization	Leader	Availability
Africa	Yes	Kongo	Mvemba A Nzinga	Base
Africa	No	Ethiopia	Ezana	NFP
America (North)	No	America	Abigail Adams	Base
America (North)	No	Aztec	Acamapichtli	Base
America (North)	No	Mayan	Pacal	NFP
America (South)	Yes	Brazil	Pedro II	Base
America (South)	No	Inca	Huayna Capac	GS
America (South)	No	Sumeria	Argon of Akkad	Base
Asia	Yes	Japan	Hojo Tokimune	Base
Asia	Yes	India	Gandhi	Base
Asia	No	India	Nur Jahan	Base
Asia	No	Khmer	Neang Neak	C&S
Europe	Yes	Russia	Peter	Base
Europe	Yes	Rome	Julius Caesar	Base / LP?
Europe	No	France	Napoléon / Charles de Gaulle	Base
Europe	No	Russia	Olga of Kiev / Catherine II	Base
Europe	No	Spain	Isabella	Base
Europe	No	Germany / Hungary	Maria Theresa	Base
Europe	No	Netherlands	William the Silent	R&F

Bold: Non negociable
Purple: Female Leader
Red: Joker / exception used.

Spoiler Explanations on the choices :

The non-negotiable:
Mvemba A Nzinga has to be picked to follow the "Base Game Persona" rule.
An America leader has to be picked to follow the "Big 3" rule.
Hojo Tokimune and Gandhi have to be picked to follow the "Base Game Persona" rule.
An India leader has to be picked to follow the "Big 3" rule.
Peter's Persona and a Russia leader have to be picked to follow the "Small 3" rule.
A French leader has to be picked to follow the "Small 3" rule.

The negotiable:
Africa: the choices are Nubia (C&S), Zulu (GS) or Ethiopia (NFP). As Mali already gained one, I picked Ethiopia.
America (North): the choice are Aztec (Base), Cree (R&F), Canada (GS) and Maya (NFP). I picked Aztec and Maya here.
America (South): the choice are Mapuche (R&F), Inca (GS) and Gran Colombia (NFP). I picked Inca. I should also pick either Mapuche or Gran Colombia here, but I rather use a Joker here.
Asia (and Oceania): Australia (C&S), Indonesia (C&S), Khmer (C&S), Maori (R&F), Mongolia (R&F) or Vietnam (NFP). As Korea already gained one, I picked Khmer.
Europe (for Persona): the choice are Frederick Barbarossa, Gorgo, Pericles, Trajan, Julius Caesar, Tomyris and Philip II. As I planned to include Maria Theresa (Germany) and Isabella (Spain), and didn't wanted to break the Sparta / Athens duality, I could only pick between Trajan, Julius Caesar and Tomyris, and picked Julius Caesar (as a Leader Pass representative?).
Europe (for new Leader): the choices are: Germany (base), Scythia (base), Spain (base), Poland (C&S), Macedonia (C&S), Netherlands (R&F), Georgia (R&F), Scotland (R&F), Hungary (GS), Sweden (GS), Gaul (NFP) and Portugal (NFP). I picked Germany/Hungary, Spain and the Netherlands.

That is how I end up with some weird pick.

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

I've decided to go more in depth with potential leaders and personas. I've changed my mind on some of the previous ones I've posted.

Pack 1: Rulers of India
Shah Jahan: Charbagh-World Wonders add appeal and +1 culture to adjacent tiles.

Muni (Monk?) Chandragupta: Sallekhana-Has access to the Sallekhana a unique Holy Site project. This project converts the city's food output per turn to faith per turn while active.

Ambulance Corps Gandhi: Ambulance Corps- All land and religious units heal at the end of every turn and heal just as fast if they were in your borders. (honestly the idea has grown on me, more for the fact that it would be a great ability for faster healing for India's religious units as well.)

Pack 2: Religious Icons
Isabella-Crown of Castile-All naval units receive experience from exploration, as if they were recon units, and may discover tribal villages adjacent to the coast. +1 Great Admiral Point when discover a tribal village.

Ezana (Ethiopia): Ezana Stelae- Monuments provide +2 faith and +1 Great prophet point per turn. 50% religious pressure from cities with a monument.

Zen Hojo Tokumine (Japan)- Engaku-ji- Encampment, Holy Site and Theater Square districts are built in half the time. These districts and their buildings each provide +1 amenity. (Shikken Hojo would have the rest of his previous ability under "Divine Wind")

Pack 3: Great Revolutionaries
Hannibal (Phoenicia): Numidian Cavalry- After clearing a barbarian outpost you have a chance to receive a unit with a free promotion which does not cost maintenance.

Napoleon (France): Rosetta Stone- Melee units are able to extract artifacts from antiquity sites. Artifacts yield +2 science and +4 when museum is themed.

William of Orange (Dutch)- Waterguezen- Naval units in your territory provide +2 loyalty per turn, and when in foreign cities cause them to lose 2 loyalty per turn. When in a city-states territory they provide +2 influence per turn.

Pack 4: Great Diplomats
Maria Theresa: (Germany/Hungary)- Royal Marriage-When in an Alliance with another civ you may send a royal child to that civ for more diplomatic visibility. You receive +2 culture (diplo favor in GS) for every royal child sent to another civ.

Ivan III (Russia): Third Rome- You may purchase land tiles with faith. Patronage of Great People cost 20% less faith.

Age of Steam Victoria (for Scotland)

 

[Caesar of Bread]

I've decided to go more in depth with potential leaders and personas. I've changed my mind on some of the previous ones I've posted.

Pack 1: Rulers of India
Shah Jahan: Charbagh-World Wonders add appeal and +1 culture to adjacent tiles.

Let‘s go Mughals!

Muni (Monk?) Chandragupta: Sallekhana-Has access to the Sallekhana a unique Holy Site project. This project converts the city's food output per turn to faith per turn while active.

Great!

Ambulance Corps Gandhi: Ambulance Corps- All land and religious units heal at the end of every turn and heal just as fast if they were in your borders. (honestly the idea has grown on me, more for the fact that it would be a great ability for faster healing for India's religious units as well.)

???

Pack 2: Religious Icons
Isabella-Crown of Castile-Naval units receive experience from exploration, as if they were recon units, and may explore tribal villages adjacent to the coast. Great Admirals are cheaper to buy with gold and faith.

Ok

Ezana (Ethiopia): Ezana Stelae- Monuments provide +2 faith and +1 Great prophet point per turn. 50% religious pressure from cities with a monument.

Amazing pick!

Zen Hojo Tokumine (Japan)- Engaku-ji- Encampment, Holy Site and Theater Square districts are built in half the time. These districts and their buildings each provide +1 amenity. (Shikken Hojo would have the rest of his previous ability under "Divine Wind")

Good pick!

Pack 3: Great Revolutionaries
Hannibal (Phoenicia): Numidian Cavalry- After clearing a barbarian outpost you have a chance to receive a unit with a free promotion which does not cost maintenance.

Meh

Napoleon (France): Rosetta Stone- Melee units are able to extract artifacts from antiquity sites. Artifacts yield +2 science and +4 when museum is themed.

NO NAPOLEON PLEASE NO

William of Orange (Dutch)- Waterguezen- Naval units in your territory provide +2 loyalty per turn, and when in foreign cities cause them to lose 2 loyalty per turn. When in a city-states territory they provide +2 influence per turn.

Nice

Pack 4: Great Diplomats
Maria Theresa: (Germany/Hungary)- Royal Marriage-When in an Alliance with another civ you may send a royal child to that civ for more diplomatic visibility. You receive +2 culture (diplo favor in GS) for every royal child sent to another civ.

Meh

Ivan III (Russia): Third Rome- You may purchase land tiles with faith. Patronage of Great People cost 20% less faith.

Nice

Age of Steam Victoria (for Scotland)

Cough Cough

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

Meh

Well North Africa needs something, if we can't get a Berber/Morocco civ. At least I didn't give him elephants and absurd early game mountain movement.

NO NAPOLEON PLEASE NO

I'd love Louis XIV but they literally gave Magnificence Catherine the bonuses I'd want for him. Napoleon at least is from a different time period than the other leaders.

Meh

Anything to get her in the game.

Cough Cough

Her background does have a lot of smoke. I considered Mary Queen of Scots, but I can't think of a compelling ability for her, since I want Scotland to have another leader.

 

[Aurelesk]

Elizabeth (Peter's daughter), Marfa Boretskaya (last leader of Novgorod) and Sophia Alekseyevna are also good choices for female Russian leaders

I don't want to be rude, but Sophia Alekseyevna and Elizabeth of Russia are closer to Peter's era than Catherine which was my main problem already for picking Catherine. It is like picking Anne of Austria instead of Louis XIV, or Louis XVI which is midway between Louis XIV and Napoléon.

I wanted to represent another period of Russia. Soviet Russia is out of question (Stalin is not coming back), so that is why I really really wanted Saint Olga of Kiev, of the Kievan Rus period.

Marfa Boretskaya is a very interesting figure, yet wasn't in charge of Russia and her rebellion didn't end well. In Civilization V, Maria I was, at best, highly mocked for leading Portugal: she is not a "greatly admired figure in both Portugal and Brazil" contrary what the Civilopedia is telling. Even Catherine de Medici, an actual regent, was seen as a poor choice (including myself before she grew on me).

Well, I'm sure me and many others would take a non Epic of Gilgamesh, Gilgamesh.
Not sure what I'd give him though. Maybe something to do with actually building up Uruk, as a cradle of civilization?
Uruk Period-50% faster production on districts that replace farms?

A Gilgamesh persona would probably a good move for marketing. Gilgabro is highly popular. I suppose they tried to replicate it with Julius Caesar who has the same body (he inherited his huge hands, which didn't felt as weird, weirdly).
But... what about another leader of Sumeria? Someone like Sargon to have a rivalry between Uruk and Akkad. There is a problem: Sumeria is very "Gilgamesh" like, as Sumerian ability is an extension to Gilgamesh. But also, if Sargon is coming, we need a new City-State replacement (Assur / Nineveh?). Which would be too much work for a Leader Pass. But at least, the ability write itself! Conquer!

Well North Africa needs something, if we can't get a Berber/Morocco civ. At least I didn't give him elephants and absurd early game mountain movement.

I agree, but Carthage is already there with Dido and her "Founder of Carthage". So there is problem for me. But I would argue that a Leader couldn't fix a lack of representation. So... they should introduce new Civilizations instead. A Civilization & Leader Pass?!

I'd love Louis XIV but they literally gave Magnificence Catherine the bonuses I'd want for him. Napoleon at least is from a different time period than the other leaders.

Also, the game introduced Catherine de Medici and Eleanor of Aquitaine. Two obscur and not "highly marketable" leaders. I am glad, because I absolutely love Eleanor as a historical figure, and I am ecstatic about her crazy ability. So really, nothing prevent to add a "overused" French leader.

I would argue that Kristina stole Louis XIV ability: just change "Queen's Bibliotheque" with either "Versailles Palace" or the "Louvre Palace", and voila!

Anything to get her in the game.

Plus, the Leader Pass introduced 6 female characters (one-third) such as Theodora, Wu Zetian, Cleopatra, Elizabeth I, Victoria and Mbande Nzinga, with 2 Persona. So if we follow the same formula, we need to introduce 6 more leaders. To be fair, we cannot go with obscur leader each time for everyone.

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

Marfa Boretskaya is a very interesting figure, yet wasn't in charge of Russia and her rebellion didn't end well. In Civilization V, Maria I was, at best, highly mocked for leading Portugal: she is not a "greatly admired figure in both Portugal and Brazil" contrary what the Civilopedia is telling. Even Catherine de Medici, an actual regent, was seen as a poor choice (including myself before she grew on me).

To be honest I considered Maria only because she could technically lead both Brazil and Portugal. I considered her having the opposite bonuses of Mbande Nzinga, to where cities not on her own continent recieve +15% more yields, mimicking how colonial Brazil during her reign was faring much better than Portugal.
But I didn't want two Marias, and Maria Theresa is by far the better choice.

I agree, but Carthage is already there with Dido and her "Founder of Carthage". So

Sure, but his original capital would be Carthage located in North Africa, instead of Tyre.

Also, the game introduced Catherine de Medici and Eleanor of Aquitaine. Two obscur and not "highly marketable" leaders. I am glad, because I absolutely love Eleanor as a historical figure, and I am ecstatic about her crazy ability. So really, nothing prevent to add a "overused" French leader.

I would argue that Kristina stole Louis XIV ability: just change "Queen's Bibliotheque" with either "Versailles Palace" or the "Louvre Palace", and voila!

I don't why he'd get the Louvre? Surprised it didn't get in as a world wonder.
Magnificence Catherine deals with court festivals, chateaus, and luxury resources and which is why I made the comparison. A "Versailles" ability to me would encompass that.

Plus, the Leader Pass introduced 6 female characters (one-third) such as Theodora, Wu Zetian, Cleopatra, Elizabeth I, Victoria and Mbande Nzinga, with 2 Persona. So if we follow the same formula, we need to introduce 6 more leaders. To be fair, we cannot go with obscur leader each time for everyone.

I didn't necessarily follow the rules. I guess I could always add in Nur Jahan instead.

 

[Aurelesk]

I don't why he'd get the Louvre? Surprised it didn't get in as a world wonder.
Magnificence Catherine deals with court festivals, chateaus, and luxury resources and which is why I made the comparison. A "Versailles" ability to me would encompass that.

The Louvre isn't the glass pyramid, it is the palace behind.

Before Louis XIV expanded the château of Versailles into a palace, the Louvre Palace was the primary residence of the French kings starting by Francis I (the father of Catherine de Medici husband). It is fitting to be a Government Plaza building. Way more than a Queen's Bibliotheque.

It was initially built as a fortress by Philip Augustus, rebuilt by Charles V (where he had his vast library), rerebuilt by Francis from a fortress to a renaissance-style château, ends up as a place to display the royal collection and residence for artists under royal patronage during Louis XIV reign, before almost becoming a full-time Museum under Louis XVI (it might need a Revolution).

I didn't necessarily follow the rules. I guess I could always add in Nur Jahan instead.

It was my rules I wanted to follow to make a "probable" Leader Pass that Firaxis could make, and it was fun for me to play that game. I shouldn't dictate my rules to other: do as you please! It is your ideas and add whatever you like!

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

The Louvre isn't the glass pyramid, it is the palace behind.

Before Louis XIV expanded the château of Versailles into a palace, the Louvre Palace was the primary residence of the French kings starting by Francis I (the father of Catherine de Medici husband). It is fitting to be a Government Plaza building. Way more than a Queen's Bibliotheque.

It was initially built as a fortress by Philip Augustus, rebuilt by Charles V (where he had his vast library), rerebuilt by Francis from a fortress to a renaissance-style château, ends up as a place to display the royal collection and residence for artists under royal patronage during Louis XIV reign, before almost becoming a full-time Museum under Louis XVI (it might need a Revolution).

I know that. But it sounds like it would be a better Govt. Plaza building for Charles V, because I would associate Versailles more with Louis XIV.

But if anyone else could have gotten a Govt. Plaza library I would have made it Ashurbanipal.

 

[Aurelesk]

I know that. But it sounds like it would be a better Govt. Plaza building for Charles V, because I would associate Versailles more with Louis XIV.

Both Versailles and the Louvre are heavily linked to Louis XIV. They are both the residence of the Kings that turned into a Museum. They also both were a Wonder in previous games. Versailles was built during Louis XIV long reign but feels more like a "Forbidden City" while the Louvre turned into a Patronage of the Arts and a place to display the Royal Collection during his lifetime. Both are eligible. The downside is that it cannot have the glass pyramids, which is now too iconic. The other downside is that it would be a "vulgar" Government Plaza's building instead of a proper World Wonder.

But it all goes to the lack of "French" Wonders. As China, Egypt and France are wonder-oriented, I find it thematic to have more wonders of those Civilization in the game. Currently, we have:

• China: 2 to 4 wonders, depending how you count. The Terracotta Army (classical), the Forbidden City (renaissance), the Potala Palace (renaissance) and the Great Walls as tile improvements.
• Egypt: 3 wonders. The Pyramids (ancient), the Great Lighthouse (classical) and the Great Library.
• France: only 2 wonders. The Mont-Saint-Michel (medieval) and the Eiffel Tower (modern).

Fun facts:

• America, England, India and Russia has 3 Wonders, more than France. They are: Statue of Liberty, Broadway and Golden Gate Bridge for America; Stonehenge, Big Ben and Oxford University for England; Mahabodhi Temple, Meenakshi Temple and Taj Mahal for India; Saint Basil's Cathedral, Bolshoi and Hermitage for Russia. But Statue of Liberty and arguably Panama Canal could be seen as "French", as the former is a gift from France to America, and the later is a failed French project that America completed.
• Eiffel Tower doesn't enjoy from the Grant Tour's Production bonus.

To be honest, they could have added the Notre Dame cathedral (but probably is in rotation with Mont-Saint-Michel). They could have added either the Louvre or Versailles, both of them should be in rotation too. Eiffel Tower is probably too iconic to be in rotation though.

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

Both Versailles and the Louvre are heavily linked to Louis XIV. They are both the residence of the Kings that turned into a Museum. They also both were a Wonder in previous games. Versailles was built during Louis XIV long reign but feels more like a "Forbidden City" while the Louvre turned into a Patronage of the Arts and a place to display the Royal Collection during his lifetime. Both are eligible. The downside is that it cannot have the glass pyramids, which is now too iconic. The other downside is that it would be a "vulgar" Government Plaza's building instead of a proper World Wonder.

Sure, but between the two Versailles is much more associated with him, at least in my opinion. But the Louvre I would expect to always show up as a world wonder with it's glass pyramid. It could be Industrial, if we go by it being open to the public, or Renaissance based off it's conversion to display the Royal Collection.

China: 2 to 4 wonders, depending how you count. The Terracotta Army (classical), the Forbidden City (renaissance), the Potala Palace (renaissance) and the Great Walls as tile improvements.

I consider Potala Palace Tibetan, so nothing to do with actual China.

 

[Evie]

I don't know that magnificence Catherine really reflect what a Versaille ability would be. It's more in line with the Chateau of the Loire of the sixteenth century (which, appropriate) - Versailles should be a much more centralizing ability that's all about focusing attention on a core location, rather than building up widespread influence, as the whole point of Versailles was making it *the* one and only center of France.

They're both abilities that should center art and splendor, but in *very* different ways.

 

[Boris Gudenuf]

I don't know that magnificence Catherine really reflect what a Versaille ability would be. It's more in line with the Chateau of the Loire of the sixteenth century (which, appropriate) - Versailles should be a much more centralizing ability that's all about focusing attention on a core location, rather than building up widespread influence, as the whole point of Versailles was making it *the* one and only center of France.

They're both abilities that should center art and splendor, but in *very* different ways.

In addition to its centralization feature, Versailles also had a very important attribute from Lois XIV's point of view: it was far enough frm Paris that a mob from the city would hav trouble getting to it. Luis had very bad memories of a Paris mob literally tearing one of his ministers to pieces before his eyes when he was a child, and wanted no chance for that event to be repeated!
At the very least, Versailles, like an Encampment, should be required to be built a tile away from any City Center . . .