Class action lawsuit

[Bast]

Do you even have the game yet? Do you know if it works or not yet? I was under the impression that people in Sydney, Australia didn't have it yet.

"Either they lied" or there are "plenty of bugs" is a logical non-starter. I wasn't deceived. Most of the people who voted in this poll don't feel deceived either.

Peep my system specs in my sig -- I have no problems.

What you have in your signature, the system you have, is way above minimum requirements. Maybe that's why it works?

 

[icecool]

You can't be serious - class action, for what

 

[abj9562]

My apologies to the forum and the moderator for being too strong and verbal against this lawsuit idea.

My main and significant points are:

1) Realize and understand what your computer is capable of.

2) Complex class A games are massive in scope and with the millions of possible combinations of hardware it is impossible to program the perfect game.

3) Thank Firaxis for responding very quickly as many companies just ignore you.

 

[Franks]

What the heck ... drama queen post

 

[Mujadaddy]

What you have in your signature, the system you have, is way above minimum requirements. Maybe that's why it works?

Because you didn't answer, I ask again:

Do you even have the game yet? Do you know if it works or not yet? I was under the impression that people in Sydney, Australia didn't have it yet.

"Either they lied" or there are "plenty of bugs" is a logical non-starter. I wasn't deceived. Most of the people who voted in this poll don't feel deceived either.

 

[vizionblind]

The gaming industry has been ripping people off for a couple of years now. TakeTwo & Firaxis have crossed a line, and I think it's time to make an example of them. Who's interested in seeing a class action lawsuit against TakeTwo and/or Firaxis?

LMAO

 

[Milan's Warrior]

I thought you weren't a lawyer?

Indeed I am not, and I have never even taken a US law course for credit (and I very much regret it)

And the hypothetical 30-person class action suit already has 130+ "witnesses" in this poll alone that don't feel PERSONALLY defrauded,

I actually am interested to learn more. Why would this objection matter? The persons who have not be fraudolently induced to purchase would just not been admitted as part of the class. Isn't all what you have to prove that the seller knew or would have reasonably suspected that the minimum requirements listed on the box did not suffice?

AND, IF YOU WON, YOU'D STILL BE RESPONSIBLE FOR THEIR LEGAL BILLS.

Really???? I did not know that! Is that true of all class actions law suits? I knew I should have taken US law courses!
(I took them in Italy, but the system is all different)

And you'd NEVER get more than your "damages," which amount to around $50, the purchase price of the game.

Well "$50+S&H" is the out of pocket loss, but what about the consequential damages? Does not the time spent on trying to fix the game count as consequential damages? A good expert witness economist could put a value on that time using the cost-opportunity theory. If there were any CivFans who made $1000 an hour in their daytime job and spent 20h trying to fix the game, then the damages would start to pile up

 

[Bast]

Because you didn't answer, I ask again:

Do you even have the game yet? Do you know if it works or not yet? I was under the impression that people in Sydney, Australia didn't have it yet.

"Either they lied" or there are "plenty of bugs" is a logical non-starter. I wasn't deceived. Most of the people who voted in this poll don't feel deceived either.

I'm not just talking about me. I'm talking about other people who've had problems.

I preordered and am tracking when I'll get my game. I should get it either today or tomorrow.

But I KNOW it would have problems because other people who have the same system specs as mine have had problems.

But I MET minimum requirements, so I should've have problems? No? Other people have met recommended requirements and are having problems? What's the deal with that?

It's not just about me.

 

[yvovandoorn]

Honestly I don't feel bad for those that are having trouble loading the game. A class action lawsuit is really pointless and won't even make it into court.

The problem can be traced back, 100% back to their computer.

I am happy to see a game where all the cheapos that decided to get cheap components to build their PC or the $599 Dell are now not able to run the game. I don't mean it as an insult, but you had it coming. It also makes me laught that people think its all about specs (2.0Ghz, 512mb, a Radeon 9600). Well first of all... who is the manufacturer of that "512MB" of system memory, or the manufacturer of that rad Radeon 9600...

Now for those that do have a nice rig (brand named system memory, decent video card producer, good motherboard etc.). Have you tried clean installing your PC to see if the problem goes away. Meaning you wipe the hard drive clean and re-install Windows. No not that Dell or HP restore CD that installs an additional 2GB worth of junk and bloatware but a Windows XP cd that just installs windows and the basic drivers. Then install all the other drivers (such as chipset, audio, video, etc etc) with the latest stable version found on the net (not the 2 year old version on that CD your motherboard came with).

Sure the devs could have tested this game more thoroughly however politics were involved in getting out this game quicker (literally... politics were involved as it was an organization that caused Take2 to lose money to get GTA:SA pulled off the shelves). Developers (who are by nature the nerdy type) just can't handle pressure, but they did release the game. However you could be happily be playing Civ IV if you had saved up a little longer or gotton a slightly slower system with better components .

I'm going to go back to playing Civ IV now on my:
ASUS P4C800-E motherboard powered by an Intel Pentium 4 3.4GHz CPU with 1GB of Corsair XMS XMS-3500LL PRO) memory.
With an ATi Radeon 9800XT made by Sapphire, SB Audigy. All installed a Western Digital Raptor 74gb hard disk.

Windows XP /w SP 2 installed, all updates for the OS installed (as of 10/29/2005).
Intel Chipset 7.2.1.1003 drivers installed
ATi Cat 5.9 drivers installed
SB Audigy 2 driver: 5.12.10.1162 installed

 

[New World Order]

You wanna refomat your HD and reinstall XP every time you get a new game ???

P.S. I can't wait untill the day your specs inhibit you form playing a potentially favourite game, so that you can go spend $4000 and be back at square one in six more months.

-NWO

 

[Milan's Warrior]

The problem can be traced back, 100% back to their computer.

Yes, but that is precisely the point. By priting system requirements on the box, the seller makes a represetation that the game will work on any machine that meets the requirements.

 

[Mujadaddy]

I actually am interested to learn more. Why would this objection matter? The persons who have not been fraudolently induced to purchase would just not been admitted as part of the class. Isn't all what you have to prove that the seller knew or would have reasonably suspected that the minimum requirements listed on the box did not suffice?

The problem with that line of reasoning, legally, is that Firaxis/Take2 only has to show that ONE SINGLE computer with the min. req's in the WHOLE WORLD is capable of running Civ4, and the case will be thrown out for lack of merit. (Then Firaxis/Take2 can sue for frivilous filing )

Really???? I did not know that! Is that true of all class actions law suits? I knew I should have taken US law courses!
(I took them in Italy, but the system is all different)

No, the hypothetical class action suit would involve the breach of contract implied by the suit. The "contract" in this case, is the license agreement that the user ACCEDES to when they install the software. In the EULA, there are many, many, MANY stipulations as to how disputes with the publisher are to be settled-- Like jurisdiction and other rules, such as picking up the publisher's court costs. (In many civil trials, however, the party "at fault" *IS* required to pay the other side's legal bills. It varies, though). I don't have the EULA right here in front of me, but I'd suspect that Firaxis/Take2 stipulates that disputes are ARBITRATED, not TRIED --- which, if true, makes the idea of a class action suit even more ridiculous.

Well "$50+S&H" is the out of pocket loss, but what about the consequential damages? Does not the time spent on trying to fix the game count as consequential damages? A good expert witness economist could put a value on that time using the cost-opportunity theory. If there were any CivFans who made $1000 an hour in their daytime job and spent 20h trying to fix the game, then the damages would start to pile up

I take it by your emote at the end you don't find this line of argument plausible. Again, the contract (EULA) undoubtedly stipulates that, at the end of the day, the user's damages are capped at the value of the product.

The reasons this thread has provoked such fiery opposition are detailed above, summed up in "ignorance of the law."

 

[grimz]

most people who bought this game are facing a ridiculous amount of frustration just trying ot get it to work. Even that Derek Smart game had fewer bugs than this mess of a game. Not to mention all the crappy packaging, mislabeled discs, and lack of manual that many of us have to put up with.

 

[Mujadaddy]

I'm not just talking about me. I'm talking about other people who've had problems.

I preordered and am tracking when I'll get my game. I should get it either today or tomorrow.

But I KNOW it would have problems because other people who have the same system specs as mine have had problems.

But I MET minimum requirements, so I should've have problems? No? Other people have met recommended requirements and are having problems? What's the deal with that?

It's not just about me.

Well, you are asking, so I was including your experience in the [set of all Civ4 experiences]. You DON'T "know" that it would have problems. Mine (between min-spec and rec-spec) didn't have problems. My friend's (waay over min-spec) didn't have problems, either. You DON'T know.

If you're worried -- don't "sign for" the game when it arrives. If you *DO* want to play it, though... keep your eye on the bug/tech support forums and put out any thoughts of a Cha-Ching Firaxis Pay Day out of your head

 

[King Flevance]

3) Thank Firaxis for responding very quickly as many companies just ignore you.

When did this happen? Are you talking about the horrible support page for the solution to 5 problems? None of which are a remote solution to the popular Chesire/dark terrain.

LOL this thread is still going.

 

[Mujadaddy]

most people who bought this game are facing a ridiculous amount of frustration just trying ot get it to work. Even that Derek Smart game had fewer bugs than this mess of a game. Not to mention all the crappy packaging, mislabeled discs, and lack of manual that many of us have to put up with.

But that doesn't mean you can SUE anyone. (Well, to be quite correct, you *can* sue, you just CAN'T expect to win)...

 

[Mujadaddy]

LOL this thread is still going.

Eh, I'm at work... Otherwise, I'd be playing

 

[Bast]

Well, you are asking, so I was including your experience in the [set of all Civ4 experiences]. You DON'T "know" that it would have problems. Mine (between min-spec and rec-spec) didn't have problems. My friend's (waay over min-spec) didn't have problems, either. You DON'T know.

If you're worried -- don't "sign for" the game when it arrives. If you *DO* want to play it, though... keep your eye on the bug/tech support forums and put out any thoughts of a Cha-Ching Firaxis Pay Day out of your head

Look I'm going to get it soon so we'll soon find out. Of course, I'm been optimistic and hoping that it all goes well.

But even if I turn out to be fine, I'm still concerned for other people. It just doesn't make sense that people with ABOVE minimum requirement computers cannot work the game.

 

[Dearmad]

This thread is hilarious!

 

[grimz]

well most of us would have been playing if the game would actually work. Instead, we're all here complaining

I now remember why I quit PC gaming last year. It's not worth the hassle; and you always get screwed by the developers/publishers. Console games are plug and play and you spend more time actually playing.

2K games are some amateur budget game publishers. They should get out of this business and leave it to the big boys like EA or Activision. At least they'll get the games out with proper labels - and I've always had no problems with getting manuals from those publishers.