Community Call to Power Project

[Ronnoc]

Where exactly does the assignstartingpoints.lau get placed at? Thanks.

Will this fix be needed for the G&K CCTP version?

 

[Old Joe]

cant wait for this mod for G&K! in vanilla G&K gameplay is soooo dull!! and AI behavior especially its just do not build a cities! i already have colonies on every continent. my social level seems unreached, but they still have two three or four cities! dumbs!

 

[chrome-rome]

Where exactly does the assignstartingpoints.lau get placed at? Thanks.

Will this fix be needed for the G&K CCTP version?

The lua file gets placed directly in the CCTP folder (Documents/My Games/Sid Meier's Civilization 5/MODS/Community Call To Power Project). It will ask you to overwrite the existing file. The fix will not be needed for the G&Ks version; it is already incorporated, and there are new additions that make the vanilla version obsolete (new resources, marsh bug fix, faster loading times,...).

Thanks Old Joe, neither can I! One good thing that has come out of this delay is that I have been motivated to go back to those techs and buildings that have wonky Civilopedia entries (or no quote in the case of the techs) and fix them up a bit. Just trying to keep myself busy

 

[Gilgamesch]

Any timeline for adding the G and K mod? Like next weekend or what ever so that all the greedy people here are happy, including me.?

 

[chrome-rome]

Well just receive news from Fires that he will hopefully have the tech tree stuff fixed up by the weekend. Add a day or so to that to add in place the new techs somewhere and make sure everything else is going smoothly, and we're looking at early next week. I will be extremely busy on Monday and Tuesday though, so if it's not out by then, it will have to wait until Wednesday.

 

[Gilgamesch]

Well just receive news from Fires that he will hopefully have the tech tree stuff fixed up by the weekend. Add a day or so to that to add in place the new techs somewhere and make sure everything else is going smoothly, and we're looking at early next week. I will be extremely busy on Monday and Tuesday though, so if it's not out by then, it will have to wait until Wednesday.

This sounds good. So we all say thank you for the hard work and you know we love you all

BTW just a point i also ask so many times of adding a prä antic phase, and with this well done work by fires ima i will not able to do it by my own. Will there
be any anyway to make a fix to start before agriculture? I will glady do it but i need some help.

 

[Horem]

BTW just a point i also ask so many times of adding a prä antic phase, and with this well done work by fires ima i will not able to do it by my own. Will there
be any anyway to make a fix to start before agriculture? I will glady do it but i need some help.

Thats quite a task, more so than adding stuff to start/later eras, you would have to rebalance everything pretty much, Units, Buildings, Tech, Wonders, the lot. The more I think about it the more I see it been a massive under taking.

Edit:
Can Use SQL for all the update stuff, be far quicker and easier to manage than XML. I'll be happy to help with the coding of it, you'll have to come up with values to suite what you feel is right. Duno how easy it will be to add an Era with Fires tech trees yet, have not seen them.

 

[chrome-rome]

Hey all. Just want to post something that I have been thinking about for the last few days. I read somewhere on these forums that Civilization 5 is a game that highly encourages specialization. I was surprised, because in my games I don't specialize too much. Sure, a city with Wheat and Fish is going to grow like a weed, but it's not like I'm specializing the city into a high pop city (excluding the beelines for the Monopoly Buildings). After thinking about it a bit, I realize that the specialization comes from the modifiers that are abundant in the base game; things like +33% gold are only beneficial if the city is already cranking out a lot of money. In comparison, flat bonuses (+10 gold) tend to encourage players to build that building everywhere that they can, regardless of the specific "role" that city should be fulfilling.

Now I'm not saying that I want to forsake one of the main design points that Decimatus, and later I, designed the CTP mod on, but I would like to see a little bit more specialization be involved in the game. I have a few ideas on how to achieve this, but they are not optimal (i.e. one idea is to limit the number of X buildings, so that only so many cities can have that building's bonus). Another possible solution would be to slowly add yield modifiers into the later eras, but this is more of a way to mask the symptom rather than treating the problem. I don't, however, want to make any drastic changes without first asking the community for their thoughts (and certainly not before we get G&Ks rolling ). This is just something I have been thinking about as a way to improve gameplay, but if everyone is satisfied with the way things are now, I won't be making any changes.

 

[Ronnoc]

I haven't played for a while and just started playing this latest version, I have to admit it seems quite balanced to me and I like it as it is thus far. Thanks for the work, it is greatly appreciated!

 

[Nutron]

Hey all. Just want to post something that I have been thinking about for the last few days. I read somewhere on these forums that Civilization 5 is a game that highly encourages specialization. I was surprised, because in my games I don't specialize too much. Sure, a city with Wheat and Fish is going to grow like a weed, but it's not like I'm specializing the city into a high pop city (excluding the beelines for the Monopoly Buildings). After thinking about it a bit, I realize that the specialization comes from the modifiers that are abundant in the base game; things like +33% gold are only beneficial if the city is already cranking out a lot of money. In comparison, flat bonuses (+10 gold) tend to encourage players to build that building everywhere that they can, regardless of the specific "role" that city should be fulfilling.

Now I'm not saying that I want to forsake one of the main design points that Decimatus, and later I, designed the CTP mod on, but I would like to see a little bit more specialization be involved in the game. I have a few ideas on how to achieve this, but they are not optimal (i.e. one idea is to limit the number of X buildings, so that only so many cities can have that building's bonus). Another possible solution would be to slowly add yield modifiers into the later eras, but this is more of a way to mask the symptom rather than treating the problem. I don't, however, want to make any drastic changes without first asking the community for their thoughts (and certainly not before we get G&Ks rolling ). This is just something I have been thinking about as a way to improve gameplay, but if everyone is satisfied with the way things are now, I won't be making any changes.

I always felt this was something missing in civ 5 and this mod as well... Wouldn't mind having what you build have more of an impact than just the build whatever without thought it feels like at the moment.

Tthe only building I feel truely has an impact and that I have to actively monitor is the happiness buildings. Everything else feels like "well i dont wanna make a unit at the moment, lets make whichever costs less turns".

 

[cihlar]

Now I'm not saying that I want to forsake one of the main design points that Decimatus, and later I, designed the CTP mod on, but I would like to see a little bit more specialization be involved in the game. I have a few ideas on how to achieve this, but they are not optimal (i.e. one idea is to limit the number of X buildings, so that only so many cities can have that building's bonus). Another possible solution would be to slowly add yield modifiers into the later eras, but this is more of a way to mask the symptom rather than treating the problem. I don't, however, want to make any drastic changes without first asking the community for their thoughts (and certainly not before we get G&Ks rolling ). This is just something I have been thinking about as a way to improve gameplay, but if everyone is satisfied with the way things are now, I won't be making any changes.

i think artificial limits on numbers of buildings would be a very poor design choice and break immersion. i agree that getting more specialization would be a great thing, but is there any reason why you can't split the difference between vanilla and previous CTP and do a mix of base yield increases and percentage bonuses?

the one way i could see being a good idea to limit overall numbers of certain % increase 'specialization' buildings would be through resources like the trade buildings.

 

[chrome-rome]

i think artificial limits on numbers of buildings would be a very poor design choice and break immersion. i agree that getting more specialization would be a great thing, but is there any reason why you can't split the difference between vanilla and previous CTP and do a mix of base yield increases and percentage bonuses?

the one way i could see being a good idea to limit overall numbers of certain % increase 'specialization' buildings would be through resources like the trade buildings.

I agree on the building limits. The short version of why there aren't any modifiers attached to buildings is so that the Governments will always give the % boost that they are meant to. For example, Republic will always gives 10% gold, period. With modifiers attached to the gold yield from other buildings, that 10% becomes a lot less. Consider a city with 100 base gold. If there is a building with a modifier present (say 15%), the gold output is 115g. Add in the bonus from Republic, and you come out to 125g, which is only a 8.7% increase. I still stand by wanting the yields to be "true," but as the modifiers are all additive rather than multiplicative, it present a little problem.

Off the top of my head I can think of two solutions: the first is to redo (again ) the way the Governments work. This is something that I want to do anyway, so it's not that drastic of a move. Unfortunately, this doesn't take care of the issue with the additive modifiers, so the other solution is: make buildings that give a certain amount of bonus yield if the city reaches a certain yield threshold. This will work like the Golden Ages, except on a much larger scale. So say that same city has a building that gives an extra 10g when the base reaches 100g. The effective yield would be 110g, which kind of gets at the 10% modifier. This kind of encourages specialization, as only cities with really focused XYZ yields would ever reap the bonus.

Of course, there are issues with this. 1) The AI would have no idea about the bonuses. The flavors could be structured as such to emphasize that the building is important, but they probably wont use it to the fullest. 2) This only masks the symptoms; it doesn't fix the underlying issue. For example, a city could only be making 60g now, but later down the line it might cross that threshold, thus gaining the bonus. Granted, this will probably happen way after a bonus of 10g is meaningful, but it is still a possibility. I'll think some more on this.

In other news, I haven't heard back from Fires since that last time, so I guess the Tech Tree is still giving him issues. Hang in there sir; we need you . This does set things back a little, but hopefully everything will get worked out really soon *crosses third or fourth pair of fingers*

 

[cihlar]

is there any way to make gov choices be additive with each other yet multiplicative with buildings?

 

[FiresForever]

Thats quite a task, more so than adding stuff to start/later eras, you would have to rebalance everything pretty much, Units, Buildings, Tech, Wonders, the lot. The more I think about it the more I see it been a massive under taking.

Edit:
Can Use SQL for all the update stuff, be far quicker and easier to manage than XML. I'll be happy to help with the coding of it, you'll have to come up with values to suite what you feel is right. Duno how easy it will be to add an Era with Fires tech trees yet, have not seen them.

Adding Eras seems quite easy, best way is probably to do

Spoiler :

<GameData>
<Eras>
<Delete/>

you can then re add in the the default eras ancient, medival, etc. but include any of your new eras in the order you want. The key is to include an <ID>value</ID> at the top of each of the eras

Spoiler :

<Row>
<ID>0</ID>
<Type>New ERA</Type>
etc....
</row>
<Row>
<ID>1</ID>
<Type>ERA_ANCIENT</Type>
etc...
</row>
<ID>2</ID>
<Type>another New ERA</Type>
etc...
</row>

You could probably just do ID updates but i prefer to scrub it all away and start fresh

Chrome now has the new G&K compatible tech tree files

 

[Horem]

You not tried SQL Fires? Sooo much easier than xml, as in a whole lot less to type/copy/paste ect.

 

[FiresForever]

You not tried SQL Fires? Sooo much easier than xml, as in a whole lot less to type/copy/paste ect.

atm i have actually been using ms access and then exporting it as an xml. There is a tutorial in the tutorial section, once its setup its quite interesting to do it that way.

 

[chrome-rome]

Big thanks to Fires for getting the tech trees set up. I had some issues with it at first, but now everything is looking like it should (forgot that Guilds was a "new" tech). Now comes the fun part of placing stuff where they should be! I work today but I'm off tomorrow, so expect it to be ready by Saturday at the latest.

I think I'm going to throw it up on Github for a few days so everyone who has been waiting for it here can play it first (and do some testings ) before it goes to the Workshop. This is for two reasons:
1) I haven't been able to play a game yet, so there may be little oversights that can only be found through playing.
2) I want the version on the Workshop to look nice. Back when Decimatus was doing Procylon's Call To Power, he would provide little updates through his thread here so that he could test out new mechanics and do bug squashing before posting the stable version to the ingame browser.

As a side note, I think this will be the first time in more than a year that any Call to Power Project has been posted for the masses (D left around April '11). Hopefully, this will bring in a nice influx of new posters

 

[Gilgamesch]

Good to hear, and thanks to fires , chrome and all the dudes who helped to get this mod working and surviving.

Will test it, and report any problems i will encounter, so far.

 

[shakaka]

I'd just like to say that I've stopped playing civ... im waiting for your mod, ive already installed gods n kings so there is no point in going back.

maybe they should just hire you or something.

 

[chrome-rome]

Thakns ! Shakaka, I literally 'ed when I read your comment. It means a lot to me.

Soo, I think I have just about everything set (but if not, I am sure you all will let me know ). I'm going to start uploading to GitHub now so everyone can play, and after the some minor things get worked out, it is off to the Workshop. I'll post a changelog of what's been changed since the last CCtP to whet everyone's appetite. I think I have about 80% of the changes documented; the other 20% or so you'll have to find out for yourselves (what really happened was that windows had an auto-restart and I didn't get a chance to save).