Conditioned Technological Development

Discussion in 'Civ - Ideas & Suggestions' started by V. Soma, Nov 6, 2010.

  1. sucksforyou112

    sucksforyou112 Superman

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    That's a good idea Pooh. But there would be rivers to sail on too! there are ways to make it so any tech could be learned without what is shown as required prediscoveries, ie horses for horseback riding. It can be we chose to ride cows, eh? :D Therefore, there should just be MAJOR detriments, not complete cutoffs, for not having horses for horseback riding- for we would have ridden stuff, just not horses. And if you see another civ with the tech/horses/whatever, then that detriment is taken away.
    To go with my example of horsebackriding:
    Nation has no horses. So Horseback riding costs 500 beakers. THen See horses. lowers to 200. (or whatever the amounts would be).
     
  2. Camikaze

    Camikaze Administrator Administrator

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    There is an issue with needing to actually see things, in that a fair few technologies reveal resources. I mean logically you'd also suffer a penalty for not seeing horses when researching Animal Husbandry, but that's an issue given that you can't see horses until after this point.
     
  3. The Government

    The Government Chieftain

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    It's a great idea, is it going to be modded soon? The thing I love about it is that it makes social policies compulsary which is actually quite a ICS killer. It makes you have to do everything which makes single headed shallow but effective strategies worthless.
     
  4. V. Soma

    V. Soma long time civ fan

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    Get me a modder :)
     
  5. The Government

    The Government Chieftain

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    One TEENSY WEENSY little problem. Writing is a very important tech and even if you are on a continents map, you could be an alone major civ on a continent seperated by ocean. Without writing, no libraries. Without libraries, astronomy will take ages. By the time you meet another civ, they'll be in the modern era and your game will be stuffed. How about extending the C to civ OR city state. If you don't have either of those then that's just rotten luck and the game won't be worth it.
     
  6. V. Soma

    V. Soma long time civ fan

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    Done so :)
     
  7. SpearMan153

    SpearMan153 Prince

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    some interesting ideas

    here's a thought:

    if you have certain complimentary techs you can get a bonus.

    say you have calendar you get a bonus to learning sailing
    or if you have sailing you get a bonus to learning calendar

    that kind of thing

    I also like the idea of tying SPs to techs. Culture and science are not idependant, a society needs the right mindset to take advantage of technological innovations.
     
  8. V. Soma

    V. Soma long time civ fan

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    Good idea!

    I might work out such stuff... but first I would need sy. who is coding...
     
  9. Camikaze

    Camikaze Administrator Administrator

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    Isn't that complimentary tech thing already in the game to some degree? I could be wrong, but I thought that you already did get some bonus if you have certain other techs. Perhaps that was in Civ4...
     
  10. Gatsby

    Gatsby King

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    This issue can be partly addressed by adding tech diffusion, which either allows you to a) research any given tech faster depending on how many other civs with whom you have open borders also have that tech, or b) increases the chances that you will spontaneously acquire that tech each turn depending on the same factors.

    However that may not fully resolve the issue, and imo you've touched on a larger issue which needs to be addressed in order for conditional technological advancement to work: the whole emphasis of the game needs to be shifted so that the focus is primarily on standing the test of time. It should be much more inherently challenging for a civ to survive in the long term, and the player should be rewarded (through score and in-game rewards) according to how long they are able to keep their civ "in the game" so to speak. This way a game can still be worth it even if you've had an isolated start and are therefore less advanced than rival civs: you are rewarded for surviving as long as you did (even if you're game ends with you getting conquered by a rival civ), and at the same time it is more difficult for all civs to survive and prosper long enough to become highly advanced and dominate the world.

    It could be argued that the industrial revolution and technological/scientific explosion of the last few centuries IRL were the result of a string of lucky historical accidents. It would be cool imo to sometimes see games where no civ ever survives long enough or becomes prosperous enough for this to happen even over the course of several millenia. There needs to be less emphasis - both on the part of game designers/modders and players - on using technological sophistication as a measure of how 'great' a civ is. Civilization is ultimately a huge collective problem-solving excercise, and the object of the game should be for leaders of civs to solve the various problems (drought, floods, resource depletion, wars, plagues, economic problems, political instability etc) which civs have to face. Technological advance should be one of a number potential strategies/options available to civs to solve any problems which might arise in the course of a game.
     
  11. THE ONLY

    THE ONLY Chieftain

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    oK, Ok, The religion Mod should include City States that will war with you if you adopt another religion. Also, if a city states has resources you can only learn those tech if you send in a diplomat into that C.S to conduct a diplomatic mission thus allowing you to come by that resource. THE IDEA COMES FROM CSD mod.:king:
     
  12. Save_Ferris

    Save_Ferris Admiring Myself

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    The ideas seem good, but what if you were in the middle of a Pangaea or a special mod? However, it could be turned off.
     
  13. V. Soma

    V. Soma long time civ fan

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    Wow, it seems that civ6 will reflect to some of the ideas here :king:
     
  14. Ciarson

    Ciarson Chieftain

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    to confront the main idea and ultimately make it better here is another idea.

    1 theoretical and practical knowledge

    for me i would divide each technology in two part.

    - theoretical knowledge: allow you to understand a technology.
    - practical knowledge : allow you, if you have the given prerequisite,to get the tech bonus (be it building, unit or better tile yield) for that knowledge.

    for example: you can understand "Sailing" even if you are deep within lands, but to be able to build the prototype of a trirem (that would allow you to build more trirem afterward) you would need a tile of water to test it on.

    NB: having the "theoretical science" allow you to research next technology.

    2 Contextual research bonus. (for the practical knowledge only).

    - each tile could give 1 bonus science if in context with the research. (like a farm by a river, for the "administration" tech)
    - when researching a technology leading to a unit upgrade, each unit that would be upgradeable ofter the research give 1 bonus science.
    - each building in context with the technology researched would give 1 bonus research.
    - each tech in context that got the "practical knowledge" researched give X bonus research.

    that way, depending on how you play your empire (cities and armies), you can aim to get some of the bonuses faster.
     

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