Converting an AI to your religion

[DarthCycle]

A feature that's been nagging me for a while now:

In diplomacy, sometimes you have the option to ask an AI to convert to your religion, other times the option is not even there. What dictates this behavior?

In many of my games, I can have a friendly (in regards to his attitude towards me) neighbor, with all his city with my religion and he has all the techs relating to that religion, and still, the option to ask him to convert to my religion is simply not there. This is frustrating since I have no understanding of why this is the case.

I don't mind that the AI might not agree to my request/demand, but at least give me the option to ask...

 

[Yoshi2942]

Could you give an example of a Religeon an Leader which this happened with? If I were to guess - it would be that the leader has a negative weight towards that specific religeon.

 

[BeefontheBone]

It would still appear as an option, but redded out I believe. Could be wrong. If it was the Grigori (who can't adopt ANY religion) then you wouldn't be able to ask IIRC (apart from anything else, this prevents the player accumulating diplo penalties from requests to change as the Grigori, although that might not be a bad thing for flavour )

 

[Maniac]

It would be nice if in Fire you could demand an AI to convert to the Order/Veil in exchange for peace.

 

[Morganknight]

I have noticed that the AI will not have the choice of converting religions if it has recently converted. Much the same way that a human player can't change religions every turn, but must instead wait a predetermined amount of time.

 

[Kael]

A feature that's been nagging me for a while now:

In diplomacy, sometimes you have the option to ask an AI to convert to your religion, other times the option is not even there. What dictates this behavior?

In many of my games, I can have a friendly (in regards to his attitude towards me) neighbor, with all his city with my religion and he has all the techs relating to that religion, and still, the option to ask him to convert to my religion is simply not there. This is frustrating since I have no understanding of why this is the case.

I don't mind that the AI might not agree to my request/demand, but at least give me the option to ask...

One of the features of Civ4 is it tries to block diplomacy options that the ai will reject anyway (its really just a time saving for the player). That doesnt mean that there aren't options that are available that the ai will always refuse, but it tries to get those off the list.

From a technical perspective every leader have a set of attitudes that he requires before he will engage in certain deals (Furious, Annoyed, Caucious, Friendly, Pleased). So one leader may require you to be friendly before he will trade maps with you (Morgoth, Faeryl), some require to to be annoyed or better (Falamar) and some will trade with anyone (Cardith).

There was a pretty substantial problem with this that Loki just pointed out and these settings were all messed up. For a lot of leaders you had to have a really high attitude to do even simple things. These attitudes should be minimums. I wnet through them all and they will all be updated for "Fire". In general you will see that less options are blocked and the AI will be willing to trade them (assuming you have something worthwile to trade).

 

[Nikis-Knight]

AFAIK, If the option isn't there, rather than red or refuesed, then either they don't have it in any cities, you haven't adopted it as your state religon, or they have switched civics/religion too recently. I believe in all other cases the option will be there, but you may not be able to convince them.

 

[vyapti]

Isn't it true that certain civs won't adopt certain religions. For instance, a good civ won't change to AV or an evil civ change to The Order? Hyboreum, I think will only follow AV.

I had the Balseraphs change to The Order once, but they had converted to Runes before, which made them neutral.

 

[Alex Encandar]

Isn't it true that certain civs won't adopt certain religions. For instance, a good civ won't change to AV or an evil civ change to The Order? Hyboreum, I think will only follow AV.

I had the Balseraphs change to The Order once, but they had converted to Runes before, which made them neutral.

The wierd thing is in the game I just played Hyboreum was following runes. I didn't find him until a good 300 epic turns after I found the other 6 so I'm not sure how they influenced him but I've never seen a neutral hyboreum before hehe.

 

[jenninymph]

One of my favorite things to do in this game is after bloodying a good AI's nose a bit, and sucking the blood of some of their most prosperous cities, is to make them fall from grace by making them adopt the ashen veil for peace.

I know Cardith at least is one that will switch with this tactic, and I've seen Hyborem in leaves and runes in the past, but he will switch to AV as soon as he gets it in one of his cities. I remember one game when, because leaves and runes come a bit earlier than the others, there were next to no evil civs left in the game.

 

[Arwon]

Leaves doesn't change alignment. In one Bannor game I played, I had Jonas Endain following the Order and actually being pretty chummy with me. It was odd, but this was a game where virtually everyone except for Hannah the Irin ended up following the Order.

 

[Chip56]

also if he doesnt have a spefic religion in any of his cities you cant bring that religion up in diplomacy

 

[Rawly]

I had exactly the same problem bugging me for hours until I realised I was trying to convert a leader with the agnostic trait.

 

[Kael]

Isn't it true that certain civs won't adopt certain religions. For instance, a good civ won't change to AV or an evil civ change to The Order? Hyboreum, I think will only follow AV.

I had the Balseraphs change to The Order once, but they had converted to Runes before, which made them neutral.

They will convert, but they are less likely too. The hard rule is that a civ won't found a religion that will change his alignment.

 

[DarthCycle]

Thank you for the feedback.

After reading all the above, and checking the civ I was trying to convert, I found out why: Auric Ulvin (Illians) is agnostic, he cannot adopt a state religion...

Every week I learn something new about this mod ... the gameplay depth is awesome.

 

[Adrogans]

Heh I played a game where Basium was evil AV and Hyborem was good Order for the enite time before I took them over. So they went to was but for completely opposite reasons from normal.

 

[Yoshi2942]

I have a question and a comment on this topic -- not even sure if it should go in this thread, but what the heck.

First the comment: In vanilla CIV IV, the Religions are all identical -- and in fact, the drawbacks of having non-state religions are negligeable at worst. In vanilla FFH, the Religions are each different and the drawbacks are severe. I found that game play is much more enjoyable by doubling the distance modifier for religion spreading and by increasing the Rand associated with the spread. All fine and well... (and I'd recommend this as a change for FFH), but... The Cult - it wants to spread.. a lot... and by making these changes it may negatively impact the cult's usefulness .... so....

The Question: anyone know how to make it so that the Cult has its own Religion spread modifier?

 

[xanaqui42]

The Question: anyone know how to make it so that the Cult has its own Religion spread modifier?

Perhaps you're looking for iSpreadFactor from CIV4ReligionInfo.xml?

 

[zyrev]

lol, same thing happened to me, I founded the Ashen Veil and ALL the other civs were converting to it except for the Grigories. I kept demanding them to convert to AV but Cassiel refused to do so.

So I declared war on them and after I wiped out their civ is when I realized that...oops they can´t convert to a religion being agnostic and all.... It is like shoot and ask the questions later.

z

 

[Dark Russell]

I took me a while to convert most civs, but it is possible. I also found that even though the Evil civs turned neutral, they still went after the good civs (in Light).