Copernicus 60AD

[GaryNemo]

Astronomy in 6 turns! How soon can we build Copernicus in Elysium?

60AD Status: 790,000 people in 19 cities. 347 gold, 30,00,70% One Scientist
With umgt changes: F5 $28 -9, Sci 69/6 Mfg=81 FS=4.5 & 3 Elvii.

I believe we need Caravans, 2 Diplomats, and $Spend IPRB!
We also need to deliver that Wine Caravan, because our real problem is lack of Mike's Chapel and Republic.

Please study Turn Thread 60AD, then please post your ideas here, and come back in a day to vote.

This poll is open 5 days, but please vote by early Saturday.

 

[Jayne]

A. We need another Trireme, not more Diplomats.

I think we need both!

C. We are $loaded!

Yes, but we could very well have Vikings on our island again. We may need money for bribery and subversion as we don't really have units for attack.

 

[Serutan]

I agree with Jayne. We should only IPRB to the extent that
we don't jeopardize our ability to subvert Viking units/cities
(we know there's at least one Horse floating around...)

 

[GaryNemo]

I believe we bribed that Viking Horse long ago. I voted:
Copernicus & Mike's are our highest priorities.
A. We need 2 Diplomats, then build a third one.
B. Hold the Wine in reserve, in case we have AI grief!
C. We have 350 gold. Spend $19 per turn on IPRB Caravans.
D. Keep 30,00,70% Max Science - recommended

I was hoping someone would post aplan to actually build Cop's. We have two Caravans in GG already, although I'd rather use only one of them. LC has nearly completed a Caravan. RC could build one, also GG BL Civvium, and Reneaux. It seems to me, with really no waste, we could be ready in barely more than 6 turns.

 

[Serutan]

Gary, we bribed the horse that was around when the Vikes
declared war. I reread Jayne's turn post, and we did *not*
bribe the horse that triggered the peace treaty.

As to Cops strategy: Hoard caravans at Elysium until we're
able to build Cops, then rush it!

 

[Octavian X]

I vote that Copernicus be completed ASAP. It should remain a priority.

 

[GaryNemo]

We can't get 3 more Caravans to Elysium in 6 turns, but maybe 4 more in less than 12 turns. MonkE worked out quite a bit of it in Turn 60AD Thread.

I was thinking of posting this as a Multi-Poll, where the first item suggests that each Citizen study the options, then vote for EVERY ONE. Instead, I'll simply post this for comment ... for now.

This is a plan to IPRB Caravans, rather than Rush Buy Cop's

Elysium, Gems Serf to Road, grows in 2 vs 4, 6 shields/turn.
LC, serf to Iron, Caravan in 1, heads to Elysium, turn 8.
  Both guards rush into LC town?
RC Silk Caravan waits in GG to build Wonder.
New GG Wine Caravan, stays on standby in Elysium for now.
Eboracum Caravan will not arrive in time.
RC Silk + LC Caravan makes 2, we need 3 more.
Gabba Gabba with 4*$11 is a Caravan in 6, deliver on turn 7.
Bedfont Lakes with $8 +$11 is Caravan in 4, deliver on turn 8.
Therefore, we can save $11 in Gabba Gabba.
Now we only need one more Caravan.
TFalls Settler to build Road N of LN, recommended for 400 years!
REGIA CIVITAS, Change to Caravan, IPRB=20 $13
REGIA CIVITAS, IPRB=30 $6
Therefore, RC Caravan in 5, deliver on turn 8.
That makes 5 Caravans into Elysium, turn 8.
Therefore, the Wine Caravan could be delivered now.
It may not matter, Elysium Gems serf to Road.

But wait, if we hear "AI has nearly completed Cop's"
Then we'll wish we had Elysium Serf on Road earlier.
And we'll wish we had saved the Wine Caravan.

If we can deliver the Wine Caravan, Elysium into RC demand, the expected $74 will pay for all of the above expenses. We are therefore free to spend IPRB on other items, such as Caravans for Mikes, a Dip or two, maybe even another Trireme.

Northern Cities are free to build a Diplomat or two.
However, they must mainly build Caravans for:
  Trade, Marco Polo, Mike's, and Leonardo.

 

[Zwelgje]

I don't think any AI has started Cop's yet.
Elysium has already build quite a big chunk of a wonder and caravans are one their way so I don't think we should be afraid the AI is going to take Cop's, right?

Anyway I'm all in favour of finishing Cop's ASAP to increase science but the Wine caravan really should be used to get a nice trade route between RC and Elysium. Let's just get that caravan to Elysium and let it sleep in the city, once a message comes up that another AI has nearly finished Cop's it can be used to build the wonder, once Cop's is build in Elysium and the Wine caravan was not necessary for wonder production it can be used to establish the trade route.

 

[duke o' york]

Damn! That's a great plan, and one I was just coming over to post myself! Can anyone work out why I like it so much?

Given the trouble we had getting the Colossus then I think that holding back on the caravan just in case is the wisest solution. Cop's will boost our science anyway so we won't need the caravan bonus as much, but will lose a few arrows.

 

[ainwood]

I am all in favour of putting ourselves in a position where we cannot not build copernicus. However, I'd like to raise a couple of points:

1.) Elysium may not actually still demand wine in 6 to 10 turns. We need to take that into account.
2.) If we wait until the AI have almost finished Cops, then what happens when we build it? Do they have another wonder to switch to? Maybe we can get them to build a wonder for us? I would advocate watching carefully for when another AI starts cops, and quickly making every effort to establish an embassy with them. That will tell us what techs they have, and whether they will build another wonder or "waste" the shields.

I would actually like us to be in the position where we can build Cops, but still have enough resources to build/rush another wonder at short-notice.

 

[Jayne]

Something else to bear in mind: If tech choices go our way, we could have Monotheism in 18 turns! We maybe want to think about getting started on a Wonder in another city.

 

[Zwelgje]

I recall a discussion of a while ago, it was about Legendary city (not named like that back then), it was supposed to become a great producer of units and to keep the city out of unhappiness (when many units were abroad) it would be wise to let it build a 'hapiness wonder'.

In other words...maybe we could start Mike's in LC???

 

[Jayne]

If nothing else, we dfinately want Shakespeare's in LC.

We could have Medicine in 12 turns if we wanted!

 

[duke o' york]

Definitely Shakespeare's rather than Mike's in LC. Shakespeare's means that there is no unhappiness ever in the city, but Mike's just gives the city a cathedral, which is the same effect as all the other cities in your empire. I'd like to have Shakespeare's in LC as if we try to capture it from the AI then it may not be coastal and we couldn't rehome our battleships there.

 

[MonkE]

MD - put both serfs on forest for 5s production and growth freeze. Build a warrior in 2 turns for crowd control. Then readjust workers.

Ren - Serf to Wine. Switch to warrior and build in 1 turn. Reassign workers and resume caravan building.

LC - (1) Keep Elvis. Caravan in 2 delays Cops 1 turn. (2) serf to Iron to finish caravan in 1. Civil disorder for 1 turn and rehire Elvis. Next build a temple?

So many warriors ... The real solution is Mike's + trade routes + Republic.

 

[GaryNemo]

Regarding Reneaux, I agree we must favor the Wine Mine.

LC: Why not move the two units into the city, serf to Iron, Caravan in 1 turn and continue with production? Oh, I see now, two units are not enough to grow to Size=3. Not sure...

And if 2 Guards will work, does LC build a Caravan or Temple? Could we delay the Temple in favor of a Caravan? Maybe Temple is required, drat!

Yes, I agree the real solution is Mike's + Trade + Republic.

 

[Leowind]

I say establish the wine trade route now. The AI has not even started Cops, and we're talking about finishing it in 8 turns or so. It would be unusual for the AI to complete a wonder at this stage of the game that quickly. spend money IPRB caravans at every opportunity so they can get to Elysium at the earliest opportunity to be ready just in case, otherwise save our money until Cops is built on the off chance we'll need to rush it.

Do not build a Catapult (this wasn't an option to vote for). They are nearly useless IMHO

 

[MonkE]

I agree with Leowind. Establish the trade route ASAP.

Two units are not enough in LC. We need to build a temple (or warrior for a quick fix).

 

[duke o' york]

Speaking of LC, I saw that we're looking to mine the coal nearby but what about the iron there? That would give us a temple in no time at all.
I agree with Leo that catapults are a waste of shields and crusaders are so much better. We will probably benefit more from the wine route now too, as the AI can't build a wonder from scratch in 8 turns and I don't remember anyone being the process of building another wonder for the potentially damaging switch.

 

[Jayne]

Speaking of LC, I saw that we're looking to mine the coal nearby but what about the iron there?

I've polled on that in the Chryshe 120ad thread