Corporate responsibilit from McDonalds? In FRANCE???

[Sultan Bhargash]

Wow this was a shocker!
Edit: I tried to post the link but it gave me a different site so I've now copied the article in (from Netscape News):
McDonald's Is Warning Customers Away!

The French division of McDonald's has embarked on a highly unusual magazine advertising campaign telling customers that children should eat at the fast food restaurant no more than once a week. The ads go on to say there is no reason to "abuse fast food." McDonald's says DON'T come to McDonald's?

Most Nutritious
• Getting the Chart
• Test Your Drive-Thru Smarts
Maybe it's a sneaky way for the popular fast food chain to make customers think it's looking out for their health. The ads, which appeared in the spring primarily in French women's magazines, featured quotations from dieticians concerning obesity, children's diets, and fast food. An ad in Femme Actuelle in April read: "There's no reason to abuse fast food or visit McDonald's more than once a week." It also trumpeted the fact that McDonald's burgers are made of 100 percent real beef and cooked on a grill that is free of additional oil.

When The Associated Press contacted McDonald's France, it wouldn't talk. Meanwhile, the Oak Brook, Illinois-based headquarters of McDonald's Corp. tersely told AP that it "strongly disagreed" with the nutritionist quoted in the French advertisement. "The vast majority of nutrition professionals say that McDonald's food can be and is a part of a healthy diet based on the sound nutrition principles of balance, variety, and moderation," the company said.

But there IS something McDonald's really doesn't want you to know: the fat content of its food. And in all fairness, the same goes for the other fast food giants. Mind you, they aren't keeping the information secret, but they aren't making it particularly easy for you to get it. Why? When you find out a Big Mac has 520 calories and 34 grams of fat, which is 53 percent of your daily allocation for fat and all you've done is eat one sandwich, it might just scare you away.

The simple truth is we Americans--and apparently the French--love our fast food burgers. We eat 'em up. And we're getting fatter and fatter. Any correlation? To find out the nutrient content of the food McDonald's serves, you have to go to its Web site. Then you have to click "Search." Then you have to type in "fat content" and wade through a listing of titles until you find the "Nutrient Breakdown Card." Then you click on that and read text that doesn't tell you what you want to know. At the bottom of that text, you have to click to download a PDF file that actually contains the nutrition information. Then you have to open up the file in Adobe Acrobat, and since the type is too small to see on even a 19" monitor, you have to print it out--and then go find a magnifying glass so you can actually read it.

You can also go into your local McDonald's restaurant and pick up a nutrition content brochure. Just don't count on it being available. This past summer, Reuters' reporters visited a McDonald's in midtown Manhattan. No brochures were available--even upon request.

If McDonald's really wants us to think it's looking out for our good health, maybe it should take a lesson from Subway or the very popular Manhattan chain Ranch 1 that print the fat and calorie information of their menu items on their napkins. A number of consumer and health groups are leading a campaign to force the fast food chains to include the calories right next to the prices on their menus. The nonprofit Center for Science in the Public Interest wants this to be required for all chains with 10 or more restaurants. "The restaurant industry hates the idea because they might sell less food," Michael Jacobson, executive director of CSPI admitted to Reuters.

Considering more than 60 percent of us are overweight and 25 percent are obese and face very real and very scary health problems, selling less food might be a good thing. For consumers, at least.

--Cathryn Conroy



Facts I found shocking:

1. the French like McDonald's (actually I knew this, last summer in Paris there were lines out the door for the Champs d'Elysee McDonadls while local competitor Quick had no such crowding).

2. McDonald's USA wants to dispute the claim that fast food is unhealthy. Why set yourself up to be the future target of "The Truth" commercials and massive lawsuits from the soon-to-face-major-health-issues fastfood junkie set?

3. People still think Subway is actually healthy. I mean, you have to pretty much order an air sandwhich there to reap the benefits...

 

[joespaniel]

I eat at Burger King.

I'm sorry, but anyone who doesnt ALREADY KNOW fast food is un-healthy, is a dunce. Seems like McDonalds France is just trying to "sound concerned" and project an image of benevolence.

Maybe it's a sneaky way for the popular fast food chain to make customers think it's looking out for their health.

Yeah, maybe...

 

[ejday]

Originally posted by Sultan Bhargash
...Maybe it's a sneaky way for the popular fast food chain to make customers think it's looking out for their health.

Yeah, like Joespaniel, I think you may be on to something here. There is supporting evidence:
1) Motivation: Some doofus is suing McDonalds, Burger King, etc., with the claim that eating there made him fat. Now this is the penultimate mercenary lawsuit -- but you know what? The guy is probably going to get some sort of settlement because a jury of [this moron's peers] can't be trusted to put on their socks before their shoes. This will create a precedent, just like it did with cigarette companies, albeit the "victims" are an order of magnitude dumber.
2) Early and voluntary compliance: Just a few weeks ago, McD's switched what kind of fry oil they use. Think about this one, it's pretty big:
*McD's fries are a backbone of the franchise.
*You don't go McD's for a gourmet burger, you go for consistency. You are already aware of, and have accepted, that you will have a meal with a predefined suck factor -- but that it will still fall within tolerance limits of the average American tastebud.
So? The fries were the best part of McD's. Now they change the billion dollar formula? No, they saw what happened to Coke, they're not that dumb. What they are doing is a preemptive move to reduce the possibility that next-of-kin will be suing after Uncle Jimbo keels over from clogged arteries. Why? A hundred class-action lawsuits filed by Overeaters Anonymous, which, win or lose, means that fries and a coke at McD's will be going up $3/meal. For those prices, people will go back to KFC and Fudruckers. McD's simply isn't good enough to charge rates that would maintain their current business model.
It's a bite (so to speak), but the promoting public health now will promote business health down the road.

 

[Sultan Bhargash]

Right I just want to clarify it ain't my story I copied it out of the news. And to note one other thing, the reason why I have begun to plan my emigration to France - at least their McDonald's execs are polite enough to issue fair warning. It is only a small step further but an important one compared to the American "you'll have it and you'll love it" philosophy of business.

 

[heliogabalus]

Originally posted by Sultan Bhargash
3. People still think Subway is actually healthy. I mean, you have to pretty much order an air sandwhich there to reap the benefits...

I dislike fast food very much. When I was in the USA, I ate at Subways once in a while. Isn't the "Veggie Delite" with dark bread quite "wholesome"?

 

[jpowers]

Originally posted by ejday

... Some doofus is suing McDonalds, Burger King, etc., with the claim that eating there made him fat. Now this is the penultimate mercenary lawsuit...

Really? Then what will the final mercenary lawsuit be? STOP USING S.A.T. WORDS YOU DON'T KNOW THE MEANING OF...

 

[gr8ful wes]

I remember this song from my youth
McDonalds is your kind of place
Hamburgers in your face
dill pickles up your nose
french fries between your toes
Ketchup running down your back
I want my money back
before I have a heart attack
Your kind of place, yeah.

for what its worth.

 

[Richard III]

Subway is no more unhealthy than the average lunch sandwich. You can make it more unhealthy if you want. It depends a lot on what you order: mayo being one of the more deadly triggers. And for me - a low sodium guy - their cold cuts are lethal. But in relative terms, compared to Ron's (west-coast nickname for McD's), it's a frickin' tofu dog on a whole wheat pita.

Re: napkin nurtritional stats, yes Sultan, fine idea, but they don't do it here! Dammit! And if they did, I'd be pissed anyway: few of them ever have sodium stats, and its irritating how often various nutritional data charts lie like crazy: e.g. popcorn labels that are for "1 cup serving" when an average person will eat 3 and a half cups from the bag. Subway, for instance, does all its stats without anything interesting on it, so you have no real idea...

But the Big Mac is still my fav

R.III

 

[Sultan Bhargash]

Okay again, Napkin nutritional stats isn't my idea because I copied this article.

jpowers - Come to think of it, why did he say penultimate and not ultimate?

Subway fans - I was a night manager of a Subway during my sophomore year of college. I lived next door with three guys and since I had the keys we would go into their freezer late at night and hork cookie dough and unbaked breadlets. Subway may seem like a healthier choice and may be healthier than an all out meal but probably you are better off sipping a chocolate shake...

wes- like the McDonald's song. Ever heard Rock'n'Roll McDonalds by Wesley Willis?

 

[gr8ful wes]

no sultan, but if you hum a few bars ....

 

[Richard III]

Originally posted by Sultan Bhargash
Subway fans - I was a night manager of a Subway during my sophomore year of college. I lived next door with three guys and since I had the keys we would go into their freezer late at night and hork cookie dough and unbaked breadlets. Subway may seem like a healthier choice and may be healthier than an all out meal but probably you are better off sipping a chocolate shake...

Yeah, but that happens with every restaurant! Don't be ridiculous! I remember this one time in Victoria where one of the chefs slid a big machete-like knife under a filet of Salmon and hurled it. slingshot-like, across at the cold side chef in retaliation for a barrage of roma tomatoes... and I'm fairly certain it all was put to use later.

And hey, as long as they BAKE the bread, it's safe, right?

R.III

 

[ejday]

Originally posted by jpowers


Really? Then what will the final mercenary lawsuit be? STOP USING S.A.T. WORDS YOU DON'T KNOW THE MEANING OF...

Jeeze, you don't have to shout. Well, maybe you do. Were you robbed by the next-to-last guy in an alley? Did you fail the SAT on the next-to-last question? Did your caps lock get stuck on the next-to-last character from that sentence? Well, I did let slip with a "pen," didn't I? Go ahead, fire away if it'll make you feel better.

Nah... I'm going to backpedal here. I did not "pen" with that "ultimate"! Uh... It depends on how you define "pen." It wasn't my fault... uh... It was a typo! There was an earthquake! A terrible flood! A Big Mac fell on my keyboard just as I hit "Submit Reply"! Ohhhh, please, can you ever forgive my intolerable ignorance? Oh, funkyboy, I promise it'll be my next-to-last mistake!

 

[Sultan Bhargash]

Richard - right you are about the bread being baked killing our foul collegiate germs. Not so sure about the bins of tuna, lukewarm beef and chicken that just kind of sat there all day. Subway in New Jersey was the death of tastier sandwhich companies like Blimpie. And i will never forgive them for the Jared/Clay Henry songs which even now haunt my skull...

 

[Lefty Scaevola]

at ejday and jbpowers





Oh, yeah, and you are both banned for 7 days.












just kidding

 

[ejday]

Originally posted by Lefty Scaevola
Oh, yeah, and you are both banned for 7 days.

But...! But...!

Originally posted by Lefty Scaevola
just kidding [/B]

Whew.
***
Back to the topic. Sort of. I am starting to think the "Stella Awards" should be renamed to the "Caesar Awards" -- for Caesar Barber, the lead plaintiff of the case vs. McDonald’s, Burger King, Wendy’s and KFC Corporation. I mean, really... scalding coffee isn't good, but there was an implicit (penimplicit?) caveat (pencaveat?) to accepting the cup: the coffee is hot. Doi. McD's didn't exactly pour it on her lap, either. I'll give credit where it's due: at least she wasn't the one driving -- I can only guess she wasn't up for suing her grandson for hitting the accelerator as she popped the lid off.
Caesar, OTOH (with no apparent knowledge of, much less relation to, the salad of the same name), ate at fast-food restaurants "four or five" times a week. Now he's blaming them for not educating him with warning labels (apparently, his doctor wasn't a convincing authority after the first heart attack -- he's had two).
***
Now, at 265, I'm not going to be on the cover of "Muscle and Fitness" anytime soon. I have an intimate knowledge of "Oreos"... and I still eat them. Doublestuffs, no less. Nor, as the Ayatollah of Funk pointed out, am I going to be inducted into MENSA anytime soon. OTOH, even I know that you are what you eat. Mr. Barber brings personal responsibility to a new low. I can almost agree with the tobacco lawsuits, but salt and grease? Just where do we say the addiction starts are conscious choice stops?

 

[Sultan Bhargash]

Excellent question, edjay, and it opens a huge can-o-worms.

It started with tobacco, an obvious killer for a long time and completely denied as such by the makers for a long time.

It may be growing to fast food, same as above.

You are free to get mad at the coffee spiller but the question of unhealth and what is a person's responsibility vs. corporate responsibility vs. government is a major issue. The truth is, a government FOR THE PEOPLE would probably act to make sure warnings were in place long ago for tobacco, fast food, alcohol, you name it. Government FOR THE BUSINESS decided to be as hands off as could be, and business faces the wrath of juries who will 90% of the time back any lawsuit against these "monsters". It is still cheaper for the corporation to be sued and settle one at a time or even en masse than to drastically change their advertising or product.

Asbestos was a problem that got dealt with. Uranium too. Maybe some day tobacco and McNuggets will end in the same class of things that are simply dangerous to expose humans to...

 

[ejday]

Originally posted by Sultan Bhargash
Excellent question, edjay, and it opens a huge can-o-worms.

Which are very high in protein, I might add.

Originally posted by Sultan Bhargash
It started with tobacco, an obvious killer for a long time and completely denied as such by the makers for a long time. It may be growing to fast food, same as above.

But it was still, as you mentioned, "an obvious killer." So how and where can we consistenly separate unethical business practice from opportunist plaintiffs that simply lived in selective denial? Let's face it: a big mac is bad for you. The technical information (dietary specs) has been available for years, but the "food pyramid" has been around even longer... and burgers are pretty low on the health scale. It's not like Caesar Barber and company are trying to perpetrate insurance fraud, but by saying their personal choices should've been limited by the vendor (no doubt to get a settlement that will ease their medical bills), they're admitting they're too stupid to be given a choice. By default, if they win this kind of claim, our freedom suffers.

Originally posted by Sultan Bhargash
You are free to get mad at the coffee spiller but the question of unhealth and what is a person's responsibility vs. corporate responsibility vs. government is a major issue.

I agree, it is a major issue.

Originally posted by Sultan Bhargash
The truth is, a government FOR THE PEOPLE would probably act to make sure warnings were in place long ago for tobacco, fast food, alcohol, you name it. Government FOR THE BUSINESS decided to be as hands off as could be, and business faces the wrath of juries who will 90% of the time back any lawsuit against these "monsters"..

More of the worms here, and on several levels.
1) It's not like anybody has been promoting Big Macs as a way to a "healthier you." It's marketed as a social experience, not a dining treat.
2) More importantly, everything and anything in excess can kill you. The FDA, the American Heart Association, et al, have been warning people against seemingly innocuous threats for years. But it's a hamburger--not a hand gun--it's not like deregulation was ever really an issue. If it's any kind of vice, in fact, it's probably bad for you. I can even see introducing label legistlation to warn off the slow-road Darwin Award Candidates, but resorting to litigation is simply modern mercenary work for lazy clients.
...Maybe they go to trial and win. How do the rest of pay for these class-action lawsuits? I'm kind of reminded of a Frank Zappa comment when he was testifying against the PMRC (another "protect me" issue). It was something akin to curing a headache by cutting off the head.

Originally posted by Sultan Bhargash
It is still cheaper for the corporation to be sued and settle one at a time or even en masse than to drastically change their advertising or product... Asbestos was a problem that got dealt with. Uranium too. Maybe some day tobacco and McNuggets will end in the same class of things that are simply dangerous to expose humans to...

Yeah, sad commentary on cost-effectiveness of change vs. lawsuits, but asbestos and uranium are fundamentally different from cheeseburgers. Nobody could see, and even fewer knew of the environmental dangers they were exposed to. OTOH, "supersizing it" on a regular basis has been a known evil since someone coined the word "gluttony."

 

[allan2]

Originally posted by ejday

It's not like Caesar Barber and company are trying to perpetrate insurance fraud, but by saying their personal choices should've been limited by the vendor (no doubt to get a settlement that will ease their medical bills), they're admitting they're too stupid to be given a choice. By default, if they win this kind of claim, our freedom suffers.

Hear, hear! This is EXACTLY how I see it too. It is tantamount to saying to the courts, "I can't HANDLE all this freedom, Mommy! You should have given me less!" And you know what, they probably will not only give HIM less freedom, but all of US as well. THAT'S what sticks in my craw, and that's what makes me get pretty CLOSE to calling such lawsuits treasonous.... They betray the idea of a thinking individual with natural rights.

Yeah, sad commentary on cost-effectiveness of change vs. lawsuits, but asbestos and uranium are fundamentally different from cheeseburgers. Nobody could see, and even fewer knew of the environmental dangers they were exposed to. OTOH, "supersizing it" on a regular basis has been a known evil since someone coined the word "gluttony."

Maybe we should call lack of common sense a "disability"....

 

[Sultan Bhargash]

You guys sound crazy! How is this guy suing McDonald's gonna mean less freedom for us? Do you think they are going to suddenly require IDs and cholesterol tests to sell bigmacs? Do you think that with "billions and billions" served every day they can't afford to pay this guy millions without raising their 99 cent value menu to a 1.02?

The food pyramid, by the way, has not been around longer than the fat count info for McDonalds' burgers. The food pyramid was created in the 80s and was actually going to be pointed in the other direction till the beef people pressured the USDA to put meat "on top of the pyramid" where we might sorta be deceived to ignore the fact that that means fewer servings.

Ironically or not, and I've argued this before, it isn't that they sell burgers that makes them vulnerable. It is the way they advertise them. You think Joe Camel was bad? McDonalds buys more playground equipment than the US school system. Again here is where France is acting responsibly (for a change?) by warning parents not to overdo it.

Hey I am all about freedom, and though I may have some authoritarian wishes in my heart of hearts (dont even ask me about the "IS your SUV too big, let's drop it on your house and see?" program I dreamed up for the Shadow Government) I have made peace with the American system. The people stay uninformed, the business does whatever they can get away with, the government keeps its nose out of business practice and in our private lives where it belongs, and the cleverest folk go to law school and make money filling in all the gaps in that equation.

 

[DinoDoc]

Originally posted by ejday
Caesar, OTOH (with no apparent knowledge of, much less relation to, the salad of the same name), ate at fast-food restaurants "four or five" times a week. Now he's blaming them for not educating him with warning labels (apparently, his doctor wasn't a convincing authority after the first heart attack -- he's had two).

Please tell me your joking. No one can possibly be that completely and utterly stupid. Can they? THis sounds like the best arguement I've ever heard for tort reform.