DocT4-How to Rise as a Ruler (RaR Training SG)
- Thread starter Doc Tsiolkovski
- Start date
denyd
Emperor
Just a heads up that I'll be unavailable from 11/24 until 11/28 and will need to be skipped should by turn come up.
I'll type slower this time, so I don't run into the only 1 message in 30 seconds limit.
I'll type slower this time, so I don't run into the only 1 message in 30 seconds limit.
Pre-Turn:
Change Leh from Asian spearman to Asian Pioneer (due in 3, growth in 3). Leh has good food surplus and weak shields, so I'll get us a settler from there.
Sell Fermentation to Spain for 89gp.
Sell Fermentation+weaving+8gp to Rome for their worker.
Establish an embassy with Rome for 21gp. They are building a tribal guardsman to escort a settler already in city.
I'm a little afraid with the lone pioneer between Chamdo and Sikkim. Hopefully no barbs catch him...
Hit enter.
IBT:
Barb next to Sikkim moves towards the mountain to hunt the worker.
Aristocracy is discovered, set research to Riding to get elephant training. Thought about going for rebublic for a while, but as our capitol is size 7 and can't grow much without irrigation, no point as the rebublic gets better after cities are size 8 or larger. Other possibility for research would be naval techs to get trading ship for contact finding.
Aristocracy reveals plenty of tea in Roman territory.
975BC(1):
Find Iekundo by the river between Chamdo and Sikkim. Set it to build a monument to get border expansion.
There is a roman slave between Iekundo & Leh. Romans must have been doing some barb hunting in those woods...
IBT:
The barb impales himself against our pike on a mountain protecting a worker. No promotion.
Sikkim pioneer -> kublai transport
950BC(2):
Set the settler from Sikkim enroute to grab the iron.
IBT:
Leh pioneer -> worker (due in 4, growth in 4)
925BC(3):
I'm going to do very aggressive settling just next to Antium. This might get Romans angry, but we're going to fight them soon anyway! Other reason for the city location is that Iekundo should have been founded on the other side of the river. Now it will get crowded otherwise. Antium can be replaced in the war.
900BC(4):
Nothing.
IBT:
Sikkim Kublai Transport -> spear
875BC(5):
Damn. Forgot that Pioneer can't move through jungle. Luckily the roman worker is building a road through the jungle, due in 4.
MM Lhasa to build water mill in 1 instead of 2, cost is loss of 3 food.
IBT:
Riding is discovered, start Jumbo training.
Gartokh spear -> worker housing.
Lhasa water mill -> academy
850BC(6):
Nothing.
825BC(7):
Find Kumbum next to the Antium horse. Antium has to be razed in the future. As the romans are weak and we're closing in the elephant training, I think the war should start sooner than later.
800BC(8):
Move spear towards Leh to get defense to the town. Currently there is only a warrior.
IBT:
Lhasa academy -> The Academy (due in 13)
775BC(9):
Next turn the pioneer can move through the jungle towards the iron / wine hills.
750BC(10):
Spanish have discovered the Trade.
Notes:
Remember to MM Sikkim to produce the hardy pioneer at the same time as growth.
The worker near Sikkim is going to improve capital terrain, build mine to the roaded hill to get boost in the shields (bring down the time for Academy)!
Research path should head towards Military training to get us barracks. We don't have time to build Sphinx and that would be overshoot anyway.
Disenfrancised should prepare the road network between Chamdo and Kumbum to allow fast movement of troops when war is imminent.
A dotmap of future city sites would be nice, here below is my proposal for the southern peninsula. We need hardy pioneers there as normal pioneers can't move through the jungle!
Change Leh from Asian spearman to Asian Pioneer (due in 3, growth in 3). Leh has good food surplus and weak shields, so I'll get us a settler from there.
Sell Fermentation to Spain for 89gp.
Sell Fermentation+weaving+8gp to Rome for their worker.
Establish an embassy with Rome for 21gp. They are building a tribal guardsman to escort a settler already in city.
I'm a little afraid with the lone pioneer between Chamdo and Sikkim. Hopefully no barbs catch him...
Hit enter.
IBT:
Barb next to Sikkim moves towards the mountain to hunt the worker.
Aristocracy is discovered, set research to Riding to get elephant training. Thought about going for rebublic for a while, but as our capitol is size 7 and can't grow much without irrigation, no point as the rebublic gets better after cities are size 8 or larger. Other possibility for research would be naval techs to get trading ship for contact finding.
Aristocracy reveals plenty of tea in Roman territory.
975BC(1):
Find Iekundo by the river between Chamdo and Sikkim. Set it to build a monument to get border expansion.
There is a roman slave between Iekundo & Leh. Romans must have been doing some barb hunting in those woods...
IBT:
The barb impales himself against our pike on a mountain protecting a worker. No promotion.
Sikkim pioneer -> kublai transport
950BC(2):
Set the settler from Sikkim enroute to grab the iron.
IBT:
Leh pioneer -> worker (due in 4, growth in 4)
925BC(3):
I'm going to do very aggressive settling just next to Antium. This might get Romans angry, but we're going to fight them soon anyway! Other reason for the city location is that Iekundo should have been founded on the other side of the river. Now it will get crowded otherwise. Antium can be replaced in the war.
900BC(4):
Nothing.
IBT:
Sikkim Kublai Transport -> spear
875BC(5):
Damn. Forgot that Pioneer can't move through jungle. Luckily the roman worker is building a road through the jungle, due in 4.
MM Lhasa to build water mill in 1 instead of 2, cost is loss of 3 food.
IBT:
Riding is discovered, start Jumbo training.
Gartokh spear -> worker housing.
Lhasa water mill -> academy
850BC(6):
Nothing.
825BC(7):
Find Kumbum next to the Antium horse. Antium has to be razed in the future. As the romans are weak and we're closing in the elephant training, I think the war should start sooner than later.
800BC(8):
Move spear towards Leh to get defense to the town. Currently there is only a warrior.
IBT:
Lhasa academy -> The Academy (due in 13)
775BC(9):
Next turn the pioneer can move through the jungle towards the iron / wine hills.
750BC(10):
Spanish have discovered the Trade.
Notes:
Remember to MM Sikkim to produce the hardy pioneer at the same time as growth.
The worker near Sikkim is going to improve capital terrain, build mine to the roaded hill to get boost in the shields (bring down the time for Academy)!
Research path should head towards Military training to get us barracks. We don't have time to build Sphinx and that would be overshoot anyway.
Disenfrancised should prepare the road network between Chamdo and Kumbum to allow fast movement of troops when war is imminent.
A dotmap of future city sites would be nice, here below is my proposal for the southern peninsula. We need hardy pioneers there as normal pioneers can't move through the jungle!
Attachments
denyd
Emperor
Have we gotten the Forbidden Palace message yet?
Tinkez: I like the dot map, and would add two more cities, 1 at the SE tip of the island and another in the center (would have to be a hardy settler).
I agree it's probably time to get a ship out. Rome isn't likely to pose much of a threat and with them gone we should be able to overpower Spain.The most difficult fight for control of our island might be with the barbarians.
Tinkez: I like the dot map, and would add two more cities, 1 at the SE tip of the island and another in the center (would have to be a hardy settler).
I agree it's probably time to get a ship out. Rome isn't likely to pose much of a threat and with them gone we should be able to overpower Spain.The most difficult fight for control of our island might be with the barbarians.
No forbidden palace message yet.
I built one ship for us - a Kublai transport - just to scout wheter or not we have a possible coast / sea route to an other continent. Ocean accessible units are still far away. The boat is now near the southern peninsula tip.
I did not see a single barbarian during my turns after the one visible next to Sikkim died away. I was a bit surprised about that
I built one ship for us - a Kublai transport - just to scout wheter or not we have a possible coast / sea route to an other continent. Ocean accessible units are still far away. The boat is now near the southern peninsula tip.
I did not see a single barbarian during my turns after the one visible next to Sikkim died away. I was a bit surprised about that
Doc Tsiolkovski
Deity
On the dotmap:
I'd settle on the Wines closer to the Iron. While we're wasting one of the Pearls, I prefer any source of Iron in range of a city, for the Iron Works.
The one at the fruits needs to go 1 SW, we're wasting the Rocks otherwise.
Agree with any war plans against Rome.
I'd settle on the Wines closer to the Iron. While we're wasting one of the Pearls, I prefer any source of Iron in range of a city, for the Iron Works.
The one at the fruits needs to go 1 SW, we're wasting the Rocks otherwise.
Agree with any war plans against Rome.
Disenfrancised
Beep Beep
Got it. Hmmm how to make up to the 10 letter word count? I know! The turn Log!
IBT all the cities seem fine but I'm not convinced of the benefits of the Monuments in Kumbum and Iekundo. An academy is only twice the shields and would pay off quite soon; anyway Iekundo needs access to the bonuses fast so keep that one and the Kumbum one will be out of my hands anyway
1) 730BC
-Switch Iekundo to forest after it grows for a monument in 3 (will catch up the food later)
-Ship continues round the continent (not sure its necessary but while it doesn?t cost support might as well keep it)
-Pioneer and Jomon head for wines, worker roads spot
-Worker Stack by Kumbum finish road and start mining the forest
-Spear by Gartokh to Leh
2) 710BC
Elephant training >> Iron working
3) 690 BC
-Sikkam produces Hpioneer; send it to the coastal rice (6 turns)
-Recall boat to watch that area for barbs
-Want an escort for that Hpioneer but at 9spt Sikkam is being most inconvenient. Decide on Jomon warrior (In retrospect I could have set it up for 1 turn ? oh well)
-Worker connecting Chamdo completes road, will build road towards Kumbum from Iekundo
-We are at ?3gpt @ 4.4.2
4) 670BC
-Gartokh completes WH; start on forge (8)
-Iekundo Monument; Spear (15 and a placeholder)
[Romans start Hanging Gardens in a size 1 Rome ? sheesh they could show at least some defense from the blood thirsty Tibetans]
-Build Cohze on NW wines. It has 3spt ? start Wiseman
-I make the mistake of thinking the worker mining Lhasa could use help so the worker roading towards Iron and Cozhe is relocated (we don?t need iron yet anyway with enough large Pachyderms).
5) 650BC
-Sikkam Jomon; starts Hpioneer (7)
6) 630BC
-Workers connect Iekundo ? Kumbum superhighway, 3 of them start mining the big game
7) 610BC
-Leh builds Forge; Start Worker housing
-Shuffle down science for 15gp
8) 590BC
Iron working >> Military training in 7 turns at 4.4.2
Mine by Capital done ? Lhasa jumps to a very nice 20 spt (The Academy now in 3)
-Those two workers to road iron and Cozhe
9) 570BC
-Glommed founded by the rice/coastal spot on the dot map. Set to worker (5) (grows in 5)
10) 550BC
-Spear in Chambo (hopefully the last regular unit we build)
-Spain gets Mythology (will trade for iron working straight up ? how about, no)
Notes
-The Academy in 1 ? huzzah! Build something to escort the Hpioneer from Sikkam then go to town with the team?s credit card at Honest Patel?s Discount Elephant Bazaar
-The 3 workers by Iekundo still have movement for the next players discretion
-Sikkam and Lhasa on elephants and Gartokh & Leh on spears will take Rome (and probably Spain)
-Romes worker movements have been odd with go to and leaving the horse several times (not that it matters without the wheel though)
Remember please point out my mistakes in bold or I could miss them
IBT all the cities seem fine but I'm not convinced of the benefits of the Monuments in Kumbum and Iekundo. An academy is only twice the shields and would pay off quite soon; anyway Iekundo needs access to the bonuses fast so keep that one and the Kumbum one will be out of my hands anyway
1) 730BC
-Switch Iekundo to forest after it grows for a monument in 3 (will catch up the food later)
-Ship continues round the continent (not sure its necessary but while it doesn?t cost support might as well keep it)
-Pioneer and Jomon head for wines, worker roads spot
-Worker Stack by Kumbum finish road and start mining the forest
-Spear by Gartokh to Leh
2) 710BC
Elephant training >> Iron working
3) 690 BC
-Sikkam produces Hpioneer; send it to the coastal rice (6 turns)
-Recall boat to watch that area for barbs
-Want an escort for that Hpioneer but at 9spt Sikkam is being most inconvenient. Decide on Jomon warrior (In retrospect I could have set it up for 1 turn ? oh well)
-Worker connecting Chamdo completes road, will build road towards Kumbum from Iekundo
-We are at ?3gpt @ 4.4.2
4) 670BC
-Gartokh completes WH; start on forge (8)
-Iekundo Monument; Spear (15 and a placeholder)
[Romans start Hanging Gardens in a size 1 Rome ? sheesh they could show at least some defense from the blood thirsty Tibetans]
-Build Cohze on NW wines. It has 3spt ? start Wiseman
-I make the mistake of thinking the worker mining Lhasa could use help so the worker roading towards Iron and Cozhe is relocated (we don?t need iron yet anyway with enough large Pachyderms).
5) 650BC
-Sikkam Jomon; starts Hpioneer (7)
6) 630BC
-Workers connect Iekundo ? Kumbum superhighway, 3 of them start mining the big game
7) 610BC
-Leh builds Forge; Start Worker housing
-Shuffle down science for 15gp
8) 590BC
Iron working >> Military training in 7 turns at 4.4.2
Mine by Capital done ? Lhasa jumps to a very nice 20 spt (The Academy now in 3)
-Those two workers to road iron and Cozhe
9) 570BC
-Glommed founded by the rice/coastal spot on the dot map. Set to worker (5) (grows in 5)
10) 550BC
-Spear in Chambo (hopefully the last regular unit we build)
-Spain gets Mythology (will trade for iron working straight up ? how about, no)
Notes
-The Academy in 1 ? huzzah! Build something to escort the Hpioneer from Sikkam then go to town with the team?s credit card at Honest Patel?s Discount Elephant Bazaar
-The 3 workers by Iekundo still have movement for the next players discretion
-Sikkam and Lhasa on elephants and Gartokh & Leh on spears will take Rome (and probably Spain)
-Romes worker movements have been odd with go to and leaving the horse several times (not that it matters without the wheel though)
Remember please point out my mistakes in bold or I could miss them
Doc Tsiolkovski
Deity
Got it.
marconos
Prince
Lurker Question: Is their ever any point to building monuments? I have found it's only needed if you are going for a cultural victory and then only to get the Pyramids.
I can see a need if you want quick culture and you are willing to rush it.
Question about not building the Sphinx. If you add up the shields and gpt required to build a barracks in you cities for military then the cost of the Sphinx is very cheap.
I can see a need if you want quick culture and you are willing to rush it.
Question about not building the Sphinx. If you add up the shields and gpt required to build a barracks in you cities for military then the cost of the Sphinx is very cheap.
Doc Tsiolkovski
Deity
1) Monuments are pointless for REL Civs (unless going for cultural victories). With other Civs, they cost only half as much as any other culture improvement.
2) But we don't plan to build Barracks everywhere; and currently, a single additional Settler is worth more than the Sphinx. The Sphinx expires pretty soon anyway.
2) But we don't plan to build Barracks everywhere; and currently, a single additional Settler is worth more than the Sphinx. The Sphinx expires pretty soon anyway.
- Joined
- Aug 15, 2001
- Messages
- 20,063
I am curious why you seem down on monuments. I have been fooling around with RaR and I really like being able to close border gaps at a cost of no gold / turn.
Cashflow is rough with cheifdom, so why wouldn't you want to close the border gaps ASAP with a no cost option.
Cashflow is rough with cheifdom, so why wouldn't you want to close the border gaps ASAP with a no cost option.
marconos
Prince
If you build a shrine you get 1 happy face + culture to close gap
Academy you get +50% research and culture
Monuments just don't seem to buy you much.
I play monarch ( thinking about trying emporer RaR ) and find they don't really add to much.
Academy you get +50% research and culture
Monuments just don't seem to buy you much.
I play monarch ( thinking about trying emporer RaR ) and find they don't really add to much.
Pfeffersack
Deity
Sometimes you need a fast border expansion to claim ressources or prevent a culture flip...and then a 40 shield building might come too late.
Doc Tsiolkovski
Deity
Also, early in the game Ritualism isn't exactly the most important Tech, while Masonry surely is...so you may build a few monuments just because you don't have a choice. And later, there are quite a lot pop-rush Govs (especially Republic), and a Monument is only one citizen (and 1 sp in the box).
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- Joined
- Aug 15, 2001
- Messages
- 20,063
What was done to RAR and the AI aggresion level? I already learned that token warriors aren't enought to stop war. However, last night I build scout, then building a tribal guard and was killed by an AI before the guard finished. The game wasn't even up to 3000BC.
FYI - I am only fooling around at Monarchy and getting very frustrated with the unexpected aggresiveness.
FYI - I am only fooling around at Monarchy and getting very frustrated with the unexpected aggresiveness.
Doc Tsiolkovski
Deity
IIRC, the aggression levels were even toned down. It's more the fact that MIL Civs start with 2.1.1 Champions that makes them consider you weak; especially you getting a tribe from a hut often result in ultra-early attacks.
That especially applies when you're alone with an AI Civ on a landmass, and have Barbs disabled...
That especially applies when you're alone with an AI Civ on a landmass, and have Barbs disabled...
Doc Tsiolkovski
Deity
Sorry for the delay; I 've played some days ago already (nothing fancy happened), I only have problems to get any files in the net atm 
denyd
Emperor
I'm going to be unavailable from the 24th until 28th for Thanksgiving holiday and will need to be skipped.
Doc Tsiolkovski
Deity
Tibet 550BC
Well, Kumbum is indeed aggressive…
Change Chamdo, Kumbum and Cozhe to Shrines.
Change preferences: Never enable ‘Cancel Orders for Enemy Combat units’; you’re wasting worker turns with that.
Trade Philosophy to Spain for Trade.
Enter.
IBT:
Lhasa The Academy-> Elephant Rider, Cozhe Shrine->Forge
Turn 1: 530BC
Delay the Settler from Sikkhim for a turn, to finish with growth. Whip the Shrine in Chamdo.
Gartokh Forge->Barracks prebuild, Leh WH->Barracks prebuild, Chamdo Shrine->Dunno, Khumbum Shrine->Cat
Turn 2: 510BC
Zzzz…
IBT:
Military Training->CoL (towards Democracy)
Sikkhim Hardy-> Water Mill
Iron connected.
Turn 3: 490BC
Zzz…
IBT:
Lhasa ER->ER, Golmud Asian Worker->Shrine
Madrid completes the Hanging Gardens.
Turn 4: 470BC
Kumbum’s borders have pushed back those of Antium
Turn 5: 450BC
Zzz…an Elephant Rider builds a road on flat ground in one turn, sweet.
IBT:
CoL->Democracy
Turn 6: 430BC
Zzzz
IBT:
Lhasa ER->ER, Leh Barracks->Spear
Turn 7: 410BC
Zzzz
Sell CoL to Spain for Myth and 30gp
Turn 8: 390BC
Upgrade some Warriors to Swords.
IBT:
Democracy->Currency
Turn 9: 370BC
IBT:
The Romans connect the Horses in our territory?
Thanks, Julius.
Turn 10: 350BC
Nothing.
Not much to say. Move the Jumbos towards Rome and Antium, build Roads where they can, and attack ASAP (in 2 or 3 turns). Eliminate them. I would not revolt to Demo before the war is close to be over.
Capital should stay on Jumbos for some time, they really pay off for the roads (use Workers only to mine, if possible). Sikkhim could try to get the Colossus; other cities should build the occasional Settler, otherwise we need a round of commerce buildings after a short war; oh, and occasionally connect our Gold.
The Save
Well, Kumbum is indeed aggressive…
Change Chamdo, Kumbum and Cozhe to Shrines.
Change preferences: Never enable ‘Cancel Orders for Enemy Combat units’; you’re wasting worker turns with that.
Trade Philosophy to Spain for Trade.
Enter.
IBT:
Lhasa The Academy-> Elephant Rider, Cozhe Shrine->Forge
Turn 1: 530BC
Delay the Settler from Sikkhim for a turn, to finish with growth. Whip the Shrine in Chamdo.
Gartokh Forge->Barracks prebuild, Leh WH->Barracks prebuild, Chamdo Shrine->Dunno, Khumbum Shrine->Cat
Turn 2: 510BC
Zzzz…
IBT:
Military Training->CoL (towards Democracy)
Sikkhim Hardy-> Water Mill
Iron connected.
Turn 3: 490BC
Zzz…
IBT:
Lhasa ER->ER, Golmud Asian Worker->Shrine
Madrid completes the Hanging Gardens.
Turn 4: 470BC
Kumbum’s borders have pushed back those of Antium
Turn 5: 450BC
Zzz…an Elephant Rider builds a road on flat ground in one turn, sweet.
IBT:
CoL->Democracy
Turn 6: 430BC
Zzzz
IBT:
Lhasa ER->ER, Leh Barracks->Spear
Turn 7: 410BC
Zzzz
Sell CoL to Spain for Myth and 30gp
Turn 8: 390BC
Upgrade some Warriors to Swords.
IBT:
Democracy->Currency
Turn 9: 370BC
IBT:
The Romans connect the Horses in our territory?
Thanks, Julius.Turn 10: 350BC
Nothing.
Not much to say. Move the Jumbos towards Rome and Antium, build Roads where they can, and attack ASAP (in 2 or 3 turns). Eliminate them. I would not revolt to Demo before the war is close to be over.
Capital should stay on Jumbos for some time, they really pay off for the roads (use Workers only to mine, if possible). Sikkhim could try to get the Colossus; other cities should build the occasional Settler, otherwise we need a round of commerce buildings after a short war; oh, and occasionally connect our Gold.
The Save