Does anyone EVER use the colony or fortification functions?

[Lord Parkin]

plus in Democracy unit support costs 2g or am I wrong ? I don't use Democracy from ages.

I don't think so... Republic is the 'economic' government where military costs are higher (though you DO get some free units).

About forts/colonies:
Forts I build occasionally, though this does vary (on some maps I will never build a single fort, whereas on others the terrain and/or civ borders on the map naturally lend themselves to building a fair number of forts).
Colonies I personally have only built two or three times in all my years of playing civ3 - this is because on randomly generated maps, you just don't need them! (For this reason I made one of my scenarios, "Colonial Warfare", at my Parkin Creations forum - on this map colonies are unavoidable. )

 

[Calder]

I very rarely have a need for colonies, but funally enough in my latest game I used them twice in very lucky situations. Having no saltpeter in a game has become quite common for me. I'd say out of the last 10 games I've played, I've had saltpeter in my own territory about twice and had to conquer another civ to get it. This current game was no exception except luck had it that saltpeter turned up from nowhere one year between 2 unexpanded Fascist Carthage cities where I promptly colonised it. And amazingly enough the same thing happened with Coal which appeared just 3 tiles away from the saltpeter in between 2 Carthage cities and colonised that. Unfortunatley I later lost the coal to the Carthage cultural expansion when I promptly went to war and got it back.
As for fortifications, that always been a part of my game in varying circumstances. In one game a few years back I fortified to the extreme, i.e. every turn of war as I advanced forward, I would have across the whole width of the continent fortified Mech Infantries in fortifications. Once the war had finished the landscape looked quite ugly! But that was Modern Armour warfare.

 

[Doc Tsiolkovski]

Colonies - whenever possible. Sometimes before founding the city, inst-road to that Gems. And, they are way more efficient that rushing culture somewhere to pull in a resource in several turns. 10sp wasted? If that allows to lower Lux for 10%, or saves like 50gpt for a resource, I'd say that's a pretty good deal...

Forts - Rarely. Yes, the ZoC is nice. Build them when I happen to have Workers around with nothing better to do (usually after building a road under the besieging stack]. Barricades OTOH can win you the game; you can use them in maybe 1 out of 10 games, but used properly, they rock. It's not about the def bonus - it's the fact they stop all fastmovers. This frees up all defenders on that side of your empire; with RR, they'll be back to deal with any invasions.

 

[Chieftess]

Colonies - Only on the extreme rarest of occasions when I have a gigantic mountain range that my culture will never cover.

Forts - Chokepoints, and landbridges. The latter especially when I want the AI to go through it, and I have units that don't have a Zone of Control. Good for picking off the AI.

 

[onedreamer]

Colonies - whenever possible. Sometimes before founding the city, inst-road to that Gems. And, they are way more efficient that rushing culture somewhere to pull in a resource in several turns. 10sp wasted? If that allows to lower Lux for 10%, or saves like 50gpt for a resource, I'd say that's a pretty good deal...

I wouldn't. You don't need to rush culture somewhere to pull in a resource in several turns. You can build a town next to it. Where is it written that a colony must be a gem colony ? Everyone turned the discussion into a gem colony discussion. Colonies are never more convenient of a city unless the resource is in a boxed area that none can reach anytime soon with culture, a scenario that is quite rare to see, unless you always play with the youngest world (highest mountains). Even a 1 size town will give you more and will be more defendable than a colony.

 

[777]

Never used forts since Civ2 and colonies very rare. Usually situations when I have to get lux or resource at least for some time before AI culture overrules them. Slaves are good for colony purposes (or captured workers)

 

[gunkulator]

Colonies - only near the end of the game to get a resource in land where I've razed a bunch of cities.

Forts - almost never. 1 tile choke points are rare.

 

[Doc Tsiolkovski]

I wouldn't. You don't need to rush culture somewhere to pull in a resource in several turns. You can build a town next to it. Where is it written that a colony must be a gem colony ? Everyone turned the discussion into a gem colony discussion. Colonies are never more convenient of a city unless the resource is in a boxed area that none can reach anytime soon with culture, a scenario that is quite rare to see, unless you always play with the youngest world (highest mountains). Even a 1 size town will give you more and will be more defendable than a colony.

And, why is it better to waste a 30sp, pop2 Settler to found a city in an otherwise inconvinient spot? Why should I found a city completely surrounded by Marshes or Jungles, one tile off the coast?
And what's the point about defense? I'm not talking about colonies on the frontline. The game isn't always about war; sometimes it's about efficient empire management.

 

[garyg]

I rarely use colonies but if that iron is in an odd place it's quicker than building a city and rushing culture. I want to start that sword rush now.

 

[.Shane.]

Thanks for all the great feedback.

I think my initial assumptions (although I'll keep in mind the need to be flexible and that assumptions can be challenged) will be:

*Only use colonies for distant luxuries/resources that you must have.

*Use forts to control check points. All the better if on a hill/mountain.

Follow-up questions:

*forts x2 the defense value?
*are there any defensive units who's unique attributes make them wiser or poorer choices for forts?
*colonies... they are easily overrun unless defended, correct? So, probably wise to always stick at least 1 defender in them.

Random side-question:
*"slave" workers... I take it these are workers captured from another civilization. They work at a slower rate, but have don't have to pay upkeep on them? correct?

Thanks guys, this is a great forum. Nice to find a place where people are helpful and can even disagree and be civil about it.

 

[Amitabh]

I never build fortresses - just can't be bothered!

Every now and then I build colonies in AA as I usually do not build temples and libraries until later in the game, hence the need for colonies to secure resources/luxuries until my cultural boundaries start expanding.

When milking for high score, I often need to build colonies late in the game, as I have to abandon cities to avoid domination victory.

Amitabh

 

[Abaddon]

forts x2 the defense value?

Not sure sorry.

are there any defensive units who's unique attributes make them wiser or poorer choices for forts?

Again dont use forts, sorry!

colonies... they are easily overrun unless defended, correct? So, probably wise to always stick at least 1 defender in them.

Yes, they are totally undefended otherwise. Also, as soon as anyones culture overlaps they vanish.

"slave" workers... I take it these are workers captured from another civilization. They work at a slower rate, but have don't have to pay upkeep on them? correct?

Yep

Nice to find a place where people are helpful and can even disagree and be civil about it.

Due to good moderators that soon get rid of any problem causers




#Phew! lots of quoting but it was fun

 

[Iron Clad]

I never build forts. But I have too build colonies if I want a resource. I don't know why you guys don't use colonies. The only way to obtain a resource that is out of the borders is if you build a colony.

 

[Turner]

But there's no reason to build a colony unless the resource is buried deep in a mountain range. It's easier to plop a city next to it. Because if you have time to road to and build a colony, you've got time to build a settler and put a city there. Keep in mind, under the standard rules, mountains are the only terrain that you can't build a city on. And usually you'll find a resource near enough to terrain which can support a city to make it worthwhile to put a city there. And if you don't put a city there, the AI will.

Of course, in C3C you have volcanos, and you can't build anything on them. But then, resources don't appear there either. Not to say that one can't pop up near a volcano.

 

[Doc Tsiolkovski]

Yes, that is nothing but Marsh around the Iron Colony. Could have founded on top of it - but why? With a SEA Civ, we will build coastal cities later.

 

[island007]

Colony: I build at least two a game.
Forts are very rare.

I use a colony to get that resource in a jungle/mountain area quicker and without wasting a city. Also, I use a colony as a 'King Maker'. This would be an instant road through a hill or mountain normally, followed ( that same turn) by a knight or cav rush taking out the enemy city that was safe.

 

[.Shane.]

Also, I use a colony as a 'King Maker'. This would be an instant road through a hill or mountain normally, followed ( that same turn) by a knight or cav rush taking out the enemy city that was safe.

That is an interesting application!

 

[Grohan]

I rarely use colonies. Forts are good in chokepoints but otherwise they are pretty useless.

 

[Renata]

Once in a Deity training succession game (where did Sirp ever wander off to, anyway?), we had good territory but cruddy culture. A saltpeter resource popped up near our borders in a desert area that was unclaimed by any city. None of the AIs were going to settle there given the way they found cities, but we couldn't, either. We bordered Japan, who had monstrous culture -- any city we might found to claim the saltpeter would be at horrible flip risk, and if it did flip, it could wind up putting our core cities at flip risk as well. So we built a colony, and stuck a warrior on top of it for safekeeping. We got to keep the saltpeter for about 80 turns until the nearest Japanese city's borders expanded.

Outside of that, though, I can't think of another time I've used one except in 5CC variants and such.

Renata