Doviello+ Worldspell

[Valkrionn]

Need some input on a possible new world spell... Thinking that it's a bit too close to the Clan's.


Worldspell:

The current Doviello worldspell shows their affinity for animals quite well, but I think the new Animal spawning fits much better, and the two combined are too powerful.

• Smaller version of the Nature's Revolt ritual. It will convert a portion of the world's barbarians to animals with Heroic Strength/Heroic Defense 1, and will possibly convert a portion of them to Doviello control, as with the Clan worldspell... Not sold on that part yet.

 

[Tarquelne]

Make simply make all animals temporarily stronger? So again much like Nature's Revolt. Just no changing ownership or barbs.-to-animals, and available very early. Perhaps from turn 1.

Timing for maximum effect could be tricky, which is generally considered a desirable trait in world spells. (The lack of that is my greatest dissatisfaction with the Scion so-called World Spell.)

 

[xienwolf]

Don't apply HD/HS, then it stacks poorly with Nature's Revolt ritual. Instead just use changeStrBoost(1) to augment their strength directly.


What I think would be far more enjoyable though would be something like:

War Drums

• Reduce the in all other player's cities by 50% of current value

You could use this to help snag a tile or two in a late-game culture war, since otherwise you are hosed, OR you could use it in the early game to push borders back a ring or two and allow your troops to get closer to the enemy before declaration of war, or get back out to Neutral healing rates during a war quicker.

 

[Psychic_Llamas]

actually what the Doviello need is a way to expand better in the early game. i rarely, if ever, see more than 2 doviello cities in any given game.

so id suggest something which would help them spread out an get a better foothold on the wilderness.

Beast-Merge

The doviello spawn a settler unit on each animal lair that is within doviello line of sight, as well as convert all barbarian animals in doviello line of sight to their team. Avaliable with hunting.

or having expanded on this idea:

Call of the Wild

Barbarian animal spawn rate increases 150%, All units belonging to the Barbarian Animal civilization migrate toward the Doviello capital over 20 turns. over the 20 turns, any barbarian animal to enter Doviello line of sight converts to doviello control. also during this time, Doviello recon units may found cities on any animal lair, at the cost of consuming the unit and spawning x number of random animal defenders there

 

[Valkrionn]

actually what the Doviello need is a way to expand better in the early game. i rarely, if ever, see more than 2 doviello cities in any given game.

so id suggest something which would help them spread out an get a better foothold on the wilderness.

Beast-Merge

The doviello spawn a settler unit on each animal lair that is within doviello line of sight, as well as convert all barbarian animals in doviello line of sight to their team. Avaliable with hunting.

or having expanded on this idea:

Call of the Wild

Barbarian animal spawn rate increases 150%, All units belonging to the Barbarian Animal civilization migrate toward the Doviello capital over 20 turns. over the 20 turns, any barbarian animal to enter Doviello line of sight converts to doviello control. also during this time, Doviello recon units may found cities on any animal lair, at the cost of consuming the unit and spawning x number of random animal defenders there

Oooh.. I like that one. Probably going to use that instead... Just need a worldspell that doesn't combine with animal spawns so insanely powerfully.

 

[Breez]

Need some input on a possible new world spell... Thinking that it's a bit too close to the Clan's.

• Smaller version of the Nature's Revolt ritual. It will convert a portion of the world's barbarians to animals with Heroic Strength/Heroic Defense 1, and will possibly convert a portion of them to Doviello control, as with the Clan worldspell... Not sold on that part yet.

I like it... but I would make a small change.

- All animals get Heroic Strength/Heroic Defense 1.
- X % chance to convert ANY animal in the world to Barbarian (including Current Doviello animals)
- Y % chance to convert and Barbarian animal in the world to Doviello with the HN promotion.

I think it becomes a 1 and a half edged sword at that point. All their animals would get more powerful, and they would gain some animals around the world, including ones owned by other nations. At the risk of "losing" some of their current animals. Because they are feral, losing some of their animals is not a huge deal. Yeah they lose control of it, but the now barb animal would not attack them so there is no danger involved. Just a controlled animal now wouldn't respond to commands anymore.

Beneficial side is in a MP game, vs humans they could not automatically assume an barb animal in their area is (or isn't) the Doviello player.

 

[25Hour]

Hmm... I feel like the Battle-Hardened promotion may be a bit much with Lucian, even without taking into account experience-sharing. I'd suggest removing this... I mean, as is it pretty much guarantees you a turn-20 axeman with Shock, or turn-60 (or thereabouts) axeman with Shock 2. As you said, it's hard enough dealing with a Shock 2 beastman, let alone axeman at that stage in the game.

What about having the Battle-Hardened promotion autoapplied with Bronze Working? He'd still be useful for priming your Axemen later on, but wouldn't be so overpowering early-game.

In the spirit of encouraging more animal spawns, what would you think about granting all Doviello cities of size 1 or 2 no or dramatically lowered maintenance costs? (Call it "self-sufficiency", or "local warlord" if you want something more tangible.) I feel this would also synergize well with the Doviello's penchant for conquering cities that'd normally be too expensive to hold-- they get the cities, but they quickly degrade under Doviello control until they're mere husks of their former selves. Good times!

With this implemented, you could have the Doviello worldspell create a settler and a Beastman in all cities you possess, to assist in rapid expansion. It could easily require something like "hunting" to avoid players using it instantly for a turn-2 second city, and encourage a bit of forethought in its use.

EDIT: It would appear that I put this in the wrong thread (well, all but the last point.) Uh, my bad!

 

[WarKirby]

I'm afraid I don't like it.

I really like the world spell that the doviello already have. Being able to summon an army of powerful wolves seems quite fitting for them, and it's not exactly lacking in power. The ability to combine them has recently been ebalanced, and I feelit's a great spell as it is.

I really don't think that a worldspell should be a "weaker version of.." anyuthing. If anything, world spells should be stronger than rituals, I'd say. Anyone can build a ritual, but only one civ can use a worldspell.

But my point is here, it aint broke, don't fix it. The Doviello worldspell causes me plenty of trouble when I try to invade them. It#'s a bit less powerful than the March of the Trees, but I'm sure that wouldn't be hard to tweak, instead of creating a new concept.

 

[Valkrionn]

Problem is that now they're spawning wolves from turn 1. Which means they can make their wolfpacks whenever they want... The worldspell on top of it might be too much. Not changing it for sure until I have a working version of an alternative to play around with, though.

 

[xienwolf]

You could keep the same idea, but modify the mechanism:

Since you should have a ton of animals roaming around as your main army, let the worldspell cause them to breed (all animals spawn a copy of themselves, instead of all units spawn a wolf).

If the combining mechanic of the wolves is extended in some manner to the other animals, this would certainly be a powerful late game worldspell, but not so late that fully combined animals aren't strong enough to be a threat, and an equally viable early-mid game worldspell, not exactly useful before turn 50 while you have scant few total animals, but potentially worthwhile if you have 5 wolves and one is VERY highly promoted, copy that guy and you can rush an extra Civ.

 

[Iceciro]

I like Xien's idea the best of all the listed ones.

 

[25Hour]

I like Xien's idea the best of all the listed ones.

Likewise. Flexible, and ties into the Doviello's unique mechanic-- quality stuff!

 

[Valkrionn]

Already decided to go with that, actually.

 

[Valkrionn]

Right, Xienwolf's idea is in, and is working perfectly... Stole the code from Mirror that clones promotions. Just like with Mirror, there is no cloning of equipment.

What would you think of a second worldspell for the Baron? I'd initially thought that it should be a replacement, but he is ONLY lycanthropic/agnostic. He could use the boost...

The proposed effect:

• Turns all Recon units into werewolves for ten turns, after which they revert. If they promote to Blooded Werewolves, they will remain.

 

[Guybrush!]

I like the idea for the Baron. It needs an epic howl as the sound that plays when you trigger it.

 

[The NeverTide]

I THINK I remember reading something about how you intended to allow the merging of animal units and normal units? If that is still in, why not allow the Baron's world spell to permanently turn all units that were merged with a wolf into werewolves?
Of course, you might have undone this effect with the kindred spirits promotions. If so, I think the idea as stated is pretty nice.

 

[xienwolf]

Having 2 worldspells just means he gets a CHOICE between the two, he can't cast both in one game (short of building Birthright Regained and choosing to use the other one the second time around)

 

[Valkrionn]

Yeah, originally the Kindred Spirits promos were supposed to be gained by merging a unit with an animal. After I changed the spawn system though, I needed something for the wonders... So now they grant the promotions.

Edit: Most likely, it won't be an actual worldspell... It'll be a unique spell castable by Varulv, his hero.