Emperor AW Adventure - The story of Kublai Khan

[Giaur]

I am back - this time with new face - this is called reincarnation. I assume that AW maps are not popular and I do not understand why. Here are some args that you should try that one day:
1) while in regular game running at 100% research is a common reality, in AW maps these numbers lower to 50-70. This makes some buildings more powerful - courthouses, markets
2) in regular game you can roll dice which tech is to be researched next with good results, while in AW game this could mean the loss
3) it's more fun to get great generals every 10 turns and you can make alternative use of them - assigning to units, which is not popular in regular game
4) finally it's more fun to razing enemy's cities without worring of losing relation points

Settings are excatly the same as in previous game (only now it's Emperor).
Basic objective: Survive as long as possible
Secondary objective: Victory - Cultural, Space, Domination/Conquest

So here is the start ...


I think it is crappy. Silence means that you do not disagree. I expect it won't be a walk in the park.

Everything is the same, but this time you are allowed to take a try. Only post 800BC save. And you will need 3.13 version of the game.

See you tomorrow ...

 

[Giaur]

Pretty nasty map ...

 

[Giaur]

This is a new save. I'll be proceeding with this one. Much easier - gold and stone. Still I will be continuing previous one (shadow game), but all descriptions will be concerning this one. If you decide to join, play with a new one. Let's hope, there is one strategic resource nearby.

And how things could look like with an older version ... pretty nasty, aren't they?
http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/70897/Giaur_BC-0800.CivBeyondSwordSave

Two reasons for new reroll:
1) invitation for other players
2) this game is a demogame and I wish to see longbows at least

 

[Giaur]

RL issues will slow down this topic very much. I am giving up smoking and I cannot tell what is happening right now. They say that it will pass in 1-3 weeks, but never know. I gave a try the second map, but with bad results. Perhaps Emperor is to difficult for me, but I'd rather think I feel pretty bad to face this task. But the main reason of delay is that I have problems with making detailed reports. Also no preparation - no shadow games on this level. But I am quite optimistic. The main problems on this level are small cities. I made a conclusion that whiping should be transformed to chopping and things should go just fine (at least first 100 turns). Every civfanatic who knows me a little should know that I give up quite easily.

edit:
btw. I wonder if I should improve archers a little. Strength of 3 is definitely too few. Perhaps this idea ...
str. 4
city defense - 30
hill defense - 15
vs melee - (-10)
vs mounted - (-20)
I played with these settings for my own purposes with good results. With these settings promoted archers make sense. And it would break sick addiction creators to numbers - 25, 50 and 100. I believe this addiction results that rules of the game are easier to remember, but damn it - I am in this game for 2 years and I can remember more twisted change.

 

[vicawoo]

What is cost here?
First city, it might be ok except for a lack of food. -10 food total, only +3 from the rice, so it's not cottagable. Move up 1N gives 2 sea useless sea tiles and 2 flood plains, 1 SW loses the river. Best bet is to go for production, and SE off the flood plains.

 

[Giaur]

@Viewcoo:
I am playing with Stone version now. And I would be very glad hearing your opinions on this map.

@All:
Some spoiler from another map. 1AD save. You can see how these settings can damage economy if there are no rivers, no currency, high military upkeep, no poping gold from barracks and cottages built too late. Some good preparation should be made - focusing on city placement (concerning stone map).

 

[Giaur]

I was defeated in 1840BC ...

16th turn and Khmer shows up from the dark with 2 archers and 2 warriors against my 1 warrior and 1 scout. This game surprizes all the time. There are 2 turns to Bronze and if there is one more beaker it would be one turn. Anyway to late to whip because we are not spiritual. Warrior could be finished in 4 turns and Khmer's forces will attack the city in 2 turns. The city is lost.


Captured Beshabik becomes Jewish holy city. Great ...


Completed the Great Wall and started working on Pyramids, cause Beshabik had both gold and ivory in fat cross. Khmer is creative so no chance to flip this city by culture and since it became a holy city, things went even worse.
Settled in 2 more spots, grabbed horses and copper. Copper was improved but Monti fortifided his one archer and 1 warrior next to horses, there was no way to improve them now. There were more important things to do.

Finally sieging Karakorum. Our 1 archer, 1 warrior and 1 scout against 3 archers, 1 spearman of Khmer. I expected to hold the city for this one turn and next turn axe was ready to whip. I should not have moved the defenders out of this city, but I was hoping to recapture Beshabik. Karakorum fell. Let's analyze what were the chances of what happened to me ...
Archer vs Spearman:
3+3*50%+3*40% = 5.7 against 4.4 - it's about 85% odds

Archer vs Archer:
Let's assume that archer won first battle. He is most likely more than half damaged.
1.2+1.2*90% = 2.1 against 3.3 - it's about 10% odds

Warrior vs Archer:
2+2*(25%(cover)+40%+25+10 (combat))=4 against 3.3. - it's about 70% odds

Scout vs Archer: 0% odds (scout only decreased the number of Khmer soldiers)

After constructing probability tree I can say it's slightly more than 62% (perhaps 65%), so yep - I should have left more defenders :/.



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Perhaps new game will be generated, but on Monarch. I believe it's possible to win on Emperor, but not all the time. And bad luck as well as lack of math education doommed me.

If you are interested in playing as well, let me know - what level do you favor. Noble? Prince? Monarch? Emperor (aaaaaaaaaaaaa)? This could be next open game, but you should do writeups by yourselves. I do not expect you to play because it demands lot of time (in Charlemagne game - i knocked down 1600 units) and this game could be annoying - Blake's AI does some annoying tricks - like fortifing units in our territory forever or trying siege inland cities and destroying all improvements on their way if there is chariot with them.

 

[Johan^^]

What does "AW adventure" mean ?

 

[ParadigmShifter]

It's Always War, i.e. you declare war as soon as you meet another civ. I hate this (in warlords and vanilla anyway, I haven't got BtS), because it only applies to the player.

 

[Diamondeye]

I had taken the first save. It was an excellent start... Although you can argue that the 2nd is a slight bit better.

 

[Giaur]

Attach some screens concerning city placement.

I think stone is always sth better than marble, but it's only my opinion .

Spoiler :

But the reason of chosing stone version, was that there was no copper&horses nearby. I had to go very early for an expensive tech - IronWorking - this could mean - slower expansion.

edit: In Vanilla, Warlords having stone could mean - to have monopoly on wonders. All three - Great Wall, Mids and Hang.Gardens produced GE points. It's an dead end that led to Cultural Victory. There was nothing left, but to place NE in that city. Ooops - we need marble

 

[sveint]

Archers

(message too short)

 

[TeraHammer]

lol yeah i first thought of "AW" as "animal bronze working"

 

[vicawoo]

I guess that attack made sense. Monarch and above they start with archery and archers.

I've never played always war, but I guess it would be more rush/pillage oriented. Scouts probably blow, and the only point of great wall would be to hurry great generals. Wonder and culture probably aren't very good. You don't get war wariness, right?
From my games against raging barbarians, I find roads are important to defend your tiles. I'd spend a lot of time thinking about my general strategy before playing.

2nd game, there's a lot of stuff around, but in the end, I would have settled on the red circle for the corn and 3 flood plains. Maybe chop rush.

Marble is good for oracle, great library, national epic. If I have a GP farm city ready, I'll go oracle->alphabet, tech literacy, and get a really fast great library with 2 normal scientists. Stone, best benefit is pyramids, which in many games ups your win % tons. Stonehenge is ok, although by the time you get masonry/mysticism, it may be too late.

 

[Giaur]

@viewcoo
War weariness strikes , but it's not so terrible as in a regular map.

You are correct about the roads. However from my experience there is higher priority - choping down trees and jungle (not for hammers, but not to give enemy defensive bonuses). Usually one excludes another.

Finally I settled 2S1W from red circle. Then ... To the east there was blue circle - no fresh water. I'd rather settled 2S1W from gold. But before that checked visability of the tile placed 2S from blue circle. There was rice, which told me to settle on desert/hill. If there was no rice, I would have checked 1S1E and 2S1E from blue circle - the common area of both cities (if no food resource - I would have settled to grab both gold and corn). But I was lucky, so settled on hill. On AW cities on hills are very powerful.

btw. I never settle with a thought - "This will be production city" or "This will be GP farm". I try to think about everything (many cities) - but with assumption - all should be cottaged. Even when I have Mids - I do not farm everything. I often steel resources from one city and give them to another. I am trying to have as many cities as possible with great potential. This way very few specialists are assigned, cause all surplus food is given to another (nearby) city. But of course - it all depends on the map - how many plains and how many grasslands. Specialization comes much later in my games ...

 

[Giaur]

monarch start ...



I'll update game every day. I'll be playing less turns each time. And everyone is invited to try ...

 

[Giaur]

This is start. Two cities - both in blue circles.


I always try to take at least two cities in AW Advanced start maps. Then I was seeking for food resource of the same kind. There were only pigs&sheep, so I took AH, no horses inside our borders. I chose worker, normally I do not do that (first thing I produce in my cities are workers - were similar to non-advanced game - perhaps it should force me to stay with non-advanced start in the future).
Worker started connecting cities. The bad side of having two cities is low research - I could not afford for pottery. We spotted also stone - nice.

We never know, if my decisions paid off. No early religion with 2 cities. Agriculture -> Pottery that was research path for nearest several turns. Then we met Qin Shi Huang - he declared war on us. And the funny thing was that he blocked completly our expansion. We discovered the source of horses and gold. Third city should grab gold, fourth - horses. I made a risky move and stood with a warrior as my best unit. Only - I had impressive numbers of them. Bronze in (and no bronze) - this move became even more risky now.
3000BC - Masonry in. 3 turns later Judaism FIDL, so if that civ has stone, no chance for The Great Wall. Bronze came later.
Good news: 2500BC Great Wall completed. 2000BC Pyramids in. Nothing happened in that time - only I settled in mentioned spots to grab horses&gold. But - I made a incorect move - I beelined to Priesthood and the Oracle. Although Oracle is was not built, I should spent research on Horseback Riding. Current research is on Writing.



The save is not really interesting, so I won't leave it this time.