[NFP] Ethiopia Update Discussion Thread

[Thenewwwguy]

Looks like Civ has gone completely off the rails, but I kind of like it. Maybe they've felt the pressure from Paradox or Humankind and realize they can no longer compete in the historic game market. This is an interesting shift from the series that used to be the staple of the historic gaming genre, but it is what it is.

I do understand the complaints of people that want a more historic game, though. It doesn't matter that these things can be shut off -- what matters is that the developers are devoting their focus and resources to these fantasy elements instead of adding more historically focused additions to the game.

Like I've said, I am OK with the changes, but I have reached the understanding at this point to the fact that Civ is more of a boardgame now rather than a historic strategy game.

i don’t think they’re moving away from historical strategy, they said they’d have historical game modes later. Just atm, they’ve done two fantasy game modes back to back which makes ppl reasonably thinking that they’re permanently pivoting into the absurd, but i don’t necessarily think that’s the case. These are optional game modes in an essentially complete game, meaning they have leeway to be a little fun. I don’t think civ is pivoting permanently, nor is it feeling the pressure. It’s more historically accurate than Humankind, has got more variety than Old World, and is more fun than paradox games. I think they’re just experimenting and having fun.

Paradox fits in a completely different market, I’d compare Old World and Humankind to Civ more, and even then both are very unpolished from what i can tell and i don’t think they’re even close to competing.

 

[AntSou]

Looks like Civ has gone completely off the rails, but I kind of like it. Maybe they've felt the pressure from Paradox or Humankind and realize they can no longer compete in the historic game market.

They are not capable to compete with a game that doesn't even exist yet? As for Paradox, it's an entirely different set of games.

This is an interesting shift from the series that used to be the staple of the historic gaming genre, but it is what it is. I do understand the complaints of people that want a more historic game, though. It doesn't matter that these things can be shut off -- what matters is that the developers are devoting their focus and resources to these fantasy elements instead of adding more historically focused additions to the game.

There's no shift. It's two optional game modes. We've got other historical stuff coming.

Like I've said, I am OK with the changes, but I have reached the understanding at this point to the fact that Civ is more of a boardgame now rather than a historic strategy game.

I don't see the two as mutually exclusive and I don't know where this dividing line is supposed to be.

 

[iammaxhailme]

Random thoughts

- I look forward to trying out the new Catherine ability. I think France was underrated to begin with as a cultural victory civ, and getting even more tile cultural will give them EVEN MORE tourism. It's also interesting that France is the first civ to have (in effect) three leader choices. I'm not upset about that, but I do wish we would get more alt choices for other civs, especially ones with a lot of very relevant possible picks, like Rome or Japan.

- Like others, I feel a bit mixed on the Teddy split, but I'll reserve total judgement until we see what President Teddy gets. I hope he gets something new, and not just half of the previous ability, becuase that'd be a big nerf. Perhaps he could get a discount on naturalists or something similar to Canada's mountie? And taking away more of the cultural victory bits from Rough Rider teddy makes the film studio seem kinda useless for him.

- Secret Societies look fun, but I'm glad it's a toggle since I don't really want that kind of fantasy element in every game. I'll definite give it a few tries though. It looks more interesting than Apocalypse mode, which I did twice and probably won't do again.

- Since this pack seems to have a lot of focus on spies and espionage, I really hope they take this opportunity to rebalance (or just remove) "recruit partisans", which is nearly universally hated here and on r/civ.

 

[Thenewwwguy]

They are not capable to compete with a game that doesn't even exist yet? As for Paradox, it's an entirely different set of games.



There's no shift. It's two optional game modes. We've got other historical stuff coming.



I don't see the two as mutually mutually exclusive and I don't know where this dividing line is supposed to be.

yeah, strategic historical board game isn’t exclusive to strategy, historical, or board game

 

[wesplaysciv]

Ok, so on the topic of envoys and the diplomatic district. In the video, the consulate yields 4 gold, 4 science, and 2 faith. The chancery grants 3 faith. So I am thinking that there is one level of envoys that provides +2 of the yield to the consulate building, and the next level of envoys provides +3 of a yield to the chancery building.

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

I don't see the two as mutually exclusive and I don't know where this dividing line is supposed to be.

Considering the original Civ computer game was based off of a board game, I agree.

That being said my first Civ experience was when I bought and played the 2010 board game version.

 

[AntSou]

Since this pack seems to have a lot of focus on spies and espionage, I really hope they take this opportunity to rebalance (or just remove) "recruit partisans", which is nearly universally hated here and on r/civ.

Hmm, I didn't see any focus on espionage? But I do hope those rebalances will come eventually.

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

Hmm, I didn't see any focus on espionage? But I do hope those rebalances will come eventually.

More like anti-espionage with the introduction of the Diplomatic Quarter.

Build all your neighborhoods around it.

 

[SammyKhalifa]

I can't watch the video and havent time to keep up, but I like the general idea of a one-per district if they're going to add one. A new "staple" type district would be too much.

 

[bite]

More like anti-espionage with the introduction of the Diplomatic Quarter.

indeed, I was expecting a Diplomatic or Security district and what we got was kind of like a hybrid of the two.

I wonder if there are only 2 buildings or if there is a 3rd wait to be revealed

 

[AvianBritish]

They showed the first three promotions for three of the secret societies. For each one, the first promotion was unlocked by an early-game task that you'll almost always do (getting a tribal village, sending a trade route to a city-state, discovering a natural wonder). They also show a screen where you can accept membership or ignore it. So, I guess that's how you choose. I don't know how to get vampires, though...

I bet Vampires will be available if you descover a Barbarian Encampment.

 

[leandrombraz]

This is a mode that I'll actually play. Apocalypse mode was just too much for my taste.

The only criticism I have is that they are adding way too many OP stuff to the game. This looks ridiculously unbalanced.

 

[DogeEnricoDandolo]

The thread seemed to get split by the mods between the old Frontier Pass discussion thread and this one here, so I'm now making this argument in two different threads. But I'll copy and paste my statement here.

These are entirely first impressions, yes. But if you've played the game for a few years, you can get a pretty decent handle on how changes might affect the game. Obviously, yes, you do need to get your hands on the game to really feel the changes, but you can make educated guesses about how the new systems will work, and from just first impressions, I think the old system was better.

Can you imagine having to play a "metagame" against AIs who are dumber than a post? And even on multiplayer, the existence of that district adds another layer of decision, so that "min-maxers" will not do the same thing every single game in the early game (a.k.a. the best part of the game) and then proceed to complain even more on why the game feels so stale. It makes the decision making process more complex without making the game more complicated, which is the exact opposite of "obtuse", which by definition means "difficult to understand". On the contrary, this district simplifies things.

 

[TheMarshmallowBear]

indeed, I was expecting a Diplomatic or Security district and what we got was kind of like a hybrid of the two.

I wonder if there are only 2 buildings or if there is a 3rd wait to be revealed

The pack preview mentions only two buildings.

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

indeed, I was expecting a Diplomatic or Security district and what we got was kind of like a hybrid of the two.

I wonder if there are only 2 buildings or if there is a 3rd wait to be revealed

I thought it would be weird with if we got a separate espionage district when we already had the Intelligence Agency in the Govt. Plaza but this hybrid one works for me.

The announcement said one new district and two new buildings so I think this is it.

 

[CivLuvah]

Lazily upscaled Menelik:
View attachment 562650

Looks unintentionally like a member of a secret society.

 

[Thenewwwguy]

Can you imagine having to play a "metagame" against AIs who are dumber than a post? And even on multiplayer, the existence of that district adds another layer of decision, so that "min-maxers" will not do the same thing every single game in the early game (a.k.a. the best part of the game) and then proceed to complain even more on why the game feels so stale. It makes the decision making process more complex without making the game more complicated, which is the exact opposite of "obtuse", which by definition means "difficult to understand". On the contrary, this district simplifies things.

exactly this new district makes things so much better.

 

[SupremacyKing2]

i don’t think they’re moving away from historical strategy, they said they’d have historical game modes later.

I am definitely looking forward to the historical game modes coming later.

 

[PhoenicianGold]

I think I'm going to pass on secret societies until I can mod the Illuminati stand-in to have a less stupid name.

I can accept leylines, and cultists, and vampires, because those can at least be warped into being vaguely globalist concepts and at least the names for everything are pretty generic.

But "Owls of Minerva"? Why not just call it what it really is: "Assassin's Creed: Basic Mythology Geek Edition".

Actually, let me go one further. Thanks to the likes of Dan Brown, the Illuminati mythos itself has become nothing more than vaguely Greco-Romanticist superstitious nonsense. It's new age hippyism for 18th and 19th century historians.

Between the Fountain of Youth/Paititi and now this, I'm not finding these "sprinkles" very attractive so far.

Okay, I'm done.

 

[Gedemon]

Anybody can sum up the video for me?

Civilization is dead.

Or at least full of dead things. Zombies, vampires...

Next the mode with Bill Murray as an alternate leaders for USA with a Ghostbuster UU. I mean... why not now ?

But now the immortal leaders thing finally make sense.

Can't wait for the time machine mode that will also explain the modern leaders in ancient era. Come on, who don't want Sengoku jieitai or The Final Countdown modes ? Ok, right, with the game's science/calendar ratio and the units gaps you can already use tanks against Samourai...