Ethnic diversity INFANTRY please

[salty mud]

Pro-tip: When you have to strawman the people who disagree with you, you've probably already lost the argument and are just hanging in because you can't accept that other people disagree with you yet. Nobody is arguing that artwork is a waste of time, the argument is about how much work on the details is justified. In this "Do it 'till it's perfect!"-world of yours no game would ever be finished.

And I already told you what I think 'is' sufficient - that, what most people think is sufficient.

Wow, talk about splitting hairs. It's pretty clear what I meant, but sure - just misrepresent what I say to try and get a point across.

Also, nice strawman in bold. Please back up with evidence where I said everything has to be perfect? Pot, meet kettle.

I asked for specifics what people find sufficient. You just reiterated what you said before. I'm still waiting for specifics.

 

[Ryika]

Wow, talk about splitting hairs. It's pretty clear what I meant, but sure - just misrepresent what I say to try and get a point across.

Also, nice strawman in bold. Please back up with evidence where I said everything has to be perfect? Pot, meet kettle.

I didn't claim you said that, but it's clearly the end point of your argument even if you don't realize it - because the argument is open-ended. Even if they add unique models for every single unit, somebody will start complaining that there's no female models, and that there's only one model per Civ. And when people tell them that that's an unreasonable request they'll quote you and say "Amateurs should be left to complete the job that professionals can't be bothered to do?" - that's why the answer to...

I asked for specifics what people find sufficient. You just reiterated what you said before. I'm still waiting for specifics.

...is still that sufficient is what most people find sufficient. You're asking for "specifics", and I assume by that you mean "objective standards", but those don't exist. It's a silly request. Everybody has their own standard, and what the devs have to do is find a balance between adding stuff to the game that people want, and not focusing more on one thing than the overall budget allows for, in relation to other features. It's a balancing act, there will always be people who say they should work more on a specific feature, and at some point the devs just have to ignore them.

 

[Browd]

If you want to compare models, there's Paradox games, where, e.g., the base games in the Crusader Kings and the EU series include basic unit models, but if you want more "realistic" models and sprites, you have to buy DLC "unit packs," "clothing packs," "content packs" and "sprite packs." Clearly, Paradox has found that to be an effective method of charging those players who want that additional level of "unit realism" for the development costs associated with the additional artwork and programming, while sparing the rest of their customers from having the bear the costs of features that they are less interested in. That approach appears to work for Paradox, but Firaxis has no history of nickel and diming its customers that way, and I suspect that the community would howl if they tried to do so. So, we're left with Firaxis having to do a cost-benefit analysis of what additional artwork all of its customers are willing to pay for.

 

[DudewiththeFood]

So what, pray tell, is sufficient enough for Firaxis to work on? Because according to the fawning mob on this forum, it's pretty much nothing. In this thread, people are arguing it's worthless devoting time to artwork. In another thread, people are arguing it's worthless devoting time to AI because most people apparently don't notice. In another thread, it's argued why bother balancing? Mods can just do that. The glaring gaps in the civic and tech tree - don't worry, modders can fix that.

I'm aware there is a fawning mob but on this forum I'm seeing people complaining about either the AI, bugs, the UI and horrible balance issues. Other than the AI, these are things that Firaxis are definitely working on and even the AI is probably getting looked at. On top of that, they'll be working on the promised modding tools as well as working with Steam to set up the Workshop. From the files and the teaser, we're expecting Poland, Genoa and Isabella for Spain at some point in the near-ish future - in likelihood including new wonders/city-states/great people. Also found in the files is an indication they're working on expanding the diplomatic aspect including a new victory objective.

My guess is they've also started planning an expansion on a similar scale to G&Ks but that's just a guess.

When that's the workload, I think ethnically diversifying basic units more than they already have (which is already an upgrade in Civ 5) is an idea they have in an ideal but not realistic world. It's that kind of thing they've left to the modders partly because they know the modders will (think of RED) and partly because the way that units are modelled/animated/textured is a much simpler process than in the past which makes it easier for non-professionals to use.