Discussion in 'Civ4 - General Discussions' started by Xineoph, Jan 5, 2006.
I would assume that if someone wanted a particular Civ included they would have a variety of reasons- duration, art, ect. I suggest that since this criterea varies from person to person what one person deems as important another may not. However, i agree, getting a bit trollish (?)
My criterea is to see a new Civ for variety sake- more important (to me)
than other factors.
however, you still claimed that Byzantium was severla things it was not, and as I have borne out before, thie ris proper evidence proving that it was not- I would much prefer to stop trollin g all together, and just initiate a debat eon the matter, so that if you do have new evidence to present illustrating your point, I may see it, and if possible counter it, and if not look into for possible future acceptence, if it bears out study.
well, hell ok ...let me get out the ol Webster's Encyclopedia Unabridged Dictionary...page 288. Byzantium Empire " the Eastern Roman Empire after the Fall of the Western Empire in 476 AD"
Now lets see ..i wrote ...They were a knock off of the Roman Empire ....
Me and Webster's are the biggest liars of all time.
In all honesty i got into History in my youth and happened to be a reading machine - but much of history is speculation- such as they stopped the muslims from overrunning Europe - but ya see- i do not take things in and stop thinking and regurgitate other's ideas (well yes i do but i try to add a bit of speculation of my own....) . So's i thinks to meself - well - they bribed enemies to go west - that is hardly a buffer ...They begged for the west to help them in the end ....again - lame buffer....maybe the west would have got it together sooner if Byzantine fell earlier- who knows.
two words for you then: prove it
spare me your trite, meaningless snippets of what you belive to be either witty, or somehow, enough to proove your point- if you wish to back up your accusations, then, as I have said before- I invite you to a full debate on the matter- all you have to do is accept. Sunday evening, as i shoudl have time then, I invite you to participate in a full disscussion on the matter; if you accept, then hatsoff to you, perhaps you make your argument well- if you do not accept, then you have no right to continue posting baseless accusations about one of the most pivitols states in western and middle eastern history.
Yes, the American's are misplaced. However, there is no way to add them into the game so late. Probably why I can't find them in the world scenario.
Lol , prove what? For what? Oh yeah - you like to come out on top.
Lol. However, ur insults and poor spelling are gaining strength.
Have no right? Man i was really wrong about know it alls getting uptight.
But since name calling seems to be your game - i'm up for it -
Your type reads a few English translated versions of other people's speculations and then prance facts around as if they carry some weight. If someone is not educated perhaps they would be amazed at the collection (personally i find it boring and non intellectual- no originality- no sense of humor) A professor of the subject would have read untranslated versions and probably would be flexible on possibilities. Your type - stodgy, redundant
and all worked up -- "i challenge you to a debate" sorry- my teen days are past - join a high school debate team.
Sure let me give up my sunday to prove something to someone that is blind to their own blindness. I have nothing to "prove". If one says they are "tired" do they have to "prove it" Ya can't debate with logic two things - how one feels - and having fun. I prefer those two things moreso than rambling facts from a
I've PMed the mods to see if we can get a proper debate thread going- see your arguments then (on sunday evening)
you really can't read can you? I am up for the name calling game- not a debate. Your too young obviously to realize that it is pointless.
I find it ironic that your calling me the young, and by default, naive one, by saying I dont understand the pointlessness of a proper, civilized, orginized debate on the issue of the various merits of the Byzantien civlization, while it is you who are refuting such an orderly offer, in favor of name calling. If this is how you "adults" settle your differences in the "real world" then I hope to stay a 19 year old college freshman forever- because "growing up" dosent seem to be worth it, in terms of civilized conduct and discussion.
my offer stillstands, and I will post a post on the merits of Byzantien civlization, and how they would make an optimal choice for an expansion civlization this sunday, as I said before, and perhaps you can expand you view point in it.
Moderator Action: @Troytheface & Xen - if you want to debate the merits of the Byzantines in another thread, then fine - however please do it without the sniping at each other. Please stop the threadjacking in this thread - focus on the topic, not on each other.
Please read the forum rules: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=422889
with apologies- i know better - hell probably birds of a feather - i vote Assyria!
Yes, the Martians... and the Atlantians too! They could battle it out...
actually, having the Atlanteans as a secret unlockable civli, once you have completed all the other civs would be a sweet bonus feature!
I would love to see some Eastern European civ beside Russia. Maybe Poland (nyah, nyah), but I would be equally happy with Czech, Hungarians, or Serbia. All 4 have more than 1000 years of history with some outstanding archievements.
And - more importantly - I would like to see Russia revised. Since early nineties and Civ1 I was kinda shocked that Kiev or Minsk were "russian" cities... And as I seen the history of Russia in Civ4 is also hm... not quite correct. I mean - modern Russia is a descendant of Kiev Rus northern colonies. Actual Rus was literally erased from the face of earth by Mongols in XIII century and its direct descendants are called (what a surprise) Ukrainians . Name "Russia" wasn't even in use until XVIII century when Catherine bought Diderot's library in exchange for promise that he will use name "Russia" instead of "Muscovy" in his encyclopedia. In Poland, Ukrainians were called "Russians" until the beginning of XXth century.
Why do I write it? It's Don Quixote's crusade
And as for the rest of the world I would like to see some black Africa civs (Zulus or Ethiopia) and Asian civs (as mentioned here before - Khmer or Vietnam).
I agree and it looks like there will be: On the Firaxis.com community poll, it had as a Civ expansion nominee "Austria-Hungary." I know many people, incl. myself who voted for it.
Darn, you're a pill who's overly full of himself. I've read your arguments and put-downs and can tell you either have a very shallow view of the Byzantian Empire or are way behind the times, continuing on with the 18th & 19th centure Euro-centric/racist interpretaions. All I've seen in your arguments is to continue on the bigotry and prejudice of the old-fashioned, self-righteous Western European historians of days gone by.
Fortunately, in the last few decades, historians have started to recognize the immense contributions and uniqueness of the Byzantian empire.
And, just as an FYI, the Byzantians were not Romans. They were Romoni and as they established their identity seperate from the latinate romans, considered themselves a GREEK EMPIRE and GREEK PEOPLE influenced by Rome, rather than a Roman empire of Romans in exile.
Celts and Ostro/Visigoths
Some more Asian and Native North American civs would be cool and less eurocentric.
The Byzantines should be in the game for sure. My bloodline traces back to the byzantines, Helena actually built a church in my dad's village in Palestine. This was way before the islamic invasion. Who knows how much better the world could have been had they received the help they needed to curb islam's spread in the middle east. Of course it didn't happen because the orthodox cross themselves differently then the catholic /boggle. Now being a christian palestinian, you basically get to live ancient history everyday over here. St. Barbara's shrine, Constantine's daughter, was also built in our village and stood the test of time until it was recently destroyed by Israelis. Christians are still being slaughtered by jews and muslims, good times. Of course you don't hear about this in the news, but I'm not making this up, you can google st. barbara or the village of abboud. It's all there. Anyways, I digress, put the Byzantines in the game =p.
Separate names with a comma.