F^4 - As a GOTM Player, what Civ Feature would you remove?

They need to make Naval, Naval Aviation, and Aviation warfare more realisitic.

First of all a carrier is much faster than a battleship. So much more faster that it is classified. Battleships are loaded with armor which make them heavy and slow. Second, a carrier battle group can go from San Diego to the Persian Gulf in one month. I can see, galleys and Galleons being slow due to their reliance on the wind. But carriers should get somewhere around 12-15 tiles per turn.

Second, Aircraft should be able to kill any kind of unit. If you don't believe me, ask all the Germans that were killed in the Eighth Air Force's saturation bombing in WWI. Or ask the Japanese at the Battle of Midway.
 
Get rid of micromanagement, short-rushing, wastage of the carry-over of food/shields/gold and other tactics that don't require any skill, just the tedium of counting and doing simple math.

Waste in the form of corruption is a good thing, as it keeps the game balanced, and big civs just don't keep getting bigger. But there is no reason that food/shields can't carry over to the next population/building/unit. With no waste in this form, the AI would actually be better off, and the AI wouldn't need such large discounts.
 
Aircraft rebasing should be limited in range. You don't need aircraft carriers when you can teleport your bomber right around the world in 1 turn. Fuel in Civ2 was annoying but there should be some other limitation to stop this. I would love to land at the enemies doorstep with 10 carriers loaded to the teeth with bombers (I did in the latest GOTM for the fun of it!) but really, it isn't necessary at all.
 
Sailorstick,
If you think of a turn as a year. Any aircraft can get from one part of the world to another in a year. What would probably make it more realistic is if you gave aircraft a limited range say 20 tiles, but 10 moves. That way if you have strategically placed cities, you can fly around the world, but you have to occasionally land to refuel. Example: B-52's and B-1's can bomb Iraq from Diego Garcia, but not from Sydney.

This would also make the carriers more important, because you could strategically place your carriers off an ememy's coast to use it as a very limited airport. Sort of like we do today.

Just two cents from a fly boy.
 
Yep, agreed Sir Bugsy, it definitely needs doing.
12 tiles and 3 relocations sounds pretty good. (Keeping in mind that a naval unit should be able to cross the world in 1 turn aswell using the same logic, but it would be a game killer.)
 
Well, since I'm so late to the party, I'll throw out more than one idea...

Naval movement should be heavily modified. Keep the movement points for each ship, but move on any controlled water like it is a railroad, and unexplored water uses movement points--as you move INTO a square not out of like current. You would use movement points in other civs waters--say at triple the normal cost. Unclaimed water would get better movement bonuses as you got the techs. So with Navigation and modern ships, for example, unclaimed water would be treated like railroads.

You could instantly get an invasion to the enemy waters, but if his boundary extended far enough you may not be able to get to land on the same turn. (Or you'd have to land away from his major coastal cities, like in real life.) This is important since the downside is, ships SINK. Artillery, coastal forts and aircraft should be able to completely kill a ship. (Ships could not kill each other in a bombarment situation unless you wanted to get into the ranges of the guns on the ship types and allow the longer range one to kill one that is out of range of retaliation.) Damage would spread around all ships as normal but you'd sink the escorts first to leave transports to land an invasion.

I'd also like some sort of BENEFIT for building ships--or at least a reason to. Maybe ships don't have an upkeep cost, or you gain 1gpt for each ship per each civ with a harbor as extra trade income. Why did England build her navy and why don't you need it in civ? It's abstracted away into building harbors to make the trade routes, but maybe there should be a factor like you need X number of ships per city per good or resource to be able to get the benefit of what you're importing which would at least force you to build some ships.


I would not like to see air or artillery changed away from red-lining ground units--WWII and Vietnam proved that you could carpet bomb something and still not completely destroy ground units. Reduce buildings to rubble, yes, but dug-in troops crawl out of their holes to defend that rubble.


I do NOT understand why they have that 40 turn no-research tech advance in the game. Especially when you consider that the advancements have an infrastructure component. Edison can 'invent' Electricity, but you need to wire up your country before it does you any good! Engineering lets you build a bridge over a river, but presumably what you were 'researching' was actually getting all the rivers bridged!

So I want you to have to spend as many beakers as it takes to get that advancement and not just be able to put one scientist on the job. If you want to build a forbidden palace you need 200 shields, not just 40 turns! (Maybe GLs should be able to rush a tech, then?)


Finally, I would like to change the build queue so that shields are NOT transferable. You start a temple and switch to a galley, the galley has 0 shields in it, but the game remembers how many shields you had in the temple so you can come back and finish it later! The building will still be standing there half-finished, after all. If they wanted to get really tricky, you COULD allow switching from some buidings to others with little or no shield loss--a Temple or Library or Courthouse, for example, is just a shell of a buidling that you just put to a different use.
 
Originally posted by pterrok
I do NOT understand why they have that 40 turn no-research tech advance in the game.

You can easily change this in the editor. It would be fine with me to have some GOTM games where min research is effectively disallowed (by setting it to 500 turns). In most GOTMs it wouldn't make very much difference, because you can do about as well by doing full research, but it wouldn't do any harm to the game (imho) by adding variety by allowing min research in some games but not others. The AI never does min research, so it's only an advantage (or, I suppose, perhaps a trap) for the human player.
 
Finally, I would like to change the build queue so that shields are NOT transferable. You start a temple and switch to a galley, the galley has 0 shields in it, but the game remembers how many shields you had in the temple so you can come back and finish it later! The building will still be standing there half-finished, after all.

IIRC in CivII you lost half your production as a penatly for switching. Here there is no penalty. If you want to play a game like that (to make a self impossed penalty) you could switch to wealth to wipe the slate clean then make your new building with an empty box the next turn. I thinik that was the premise of Epic 12.
 
There should be no switching (or a penalty for switching), and carryover of excess shields (so that if you generate more shields than necessary to fill the box, the remainder appear in the box next turn and can be used on a new project). The two really go naturally together. See discussion of this in the Conquests requests forum.
 
Originally posted by DaviddesJ
There should be no switching (or a penalty for switching), and carryover of excess shields (so that if you generate more shields than necessary to fill the box, the remainder appear in the box next turn and can be used on a new project). The two really go naturally together. See discussion of this in the Conquests requests forum.
Agreed - While I make use of the ability to switch all the time, it doesn't really make sense to build 98% of a temple and suddenly decide that you are really building a cavalry.

Oh well.
 
One of these days I'm gonna have to look into that editor!

So if Cracker wanted to, not only could he mold a game where the minimum tech rate was 81 turns (to keep it out of the QSC timeframe) but he could also set the Conquest, Open and Predator to have slightly different minimum tech times? Cool!

It's a big deal for players who always just go for Writing in 40 to build gold up and then trade it to get other techs they missed--if they had to wait 80 turns for Writing or if the AI got it first...I may have to set something up and try it myself.


hortrod0823, yeah, you also lost a bunch of productivity in SMAC when you changed in the middle, but I want the game to keep track of the progress of the individual things you've started so you never really lose shields, you just can's slam them right into something else.


A great feature from Master of Orion 3 is that when you've sorted your planets, when you step through them they come up in that sorted order. It would be nice to add that to Civ, so that when you've sorted the cities on shields, for example, the arrow keys would step through them in that order.

And add a way to sort the cities on the F5 culture screen!
 
Originally posted by pterrok
It's a big deal for players who always just go for Writing in 40 to build gold up and then trade it to get other techs they missed--if they had to wait 80 turns for Writing or if the AI got it first...I may have to set something up and try it myself.

As cracker often says, I think that if you try it both ways (do full research instead of min research), you'll find that the benefits of min research aren't that great. Not that it doesn't work, but full research works too, and the net gain from one to the other isn't so much.
 
Agreed - While I make use of the ability to switch all the time, it doesn't really make sense to build 98% of a temple and suddenly decide that you are really building a cavalry.

DaviddesJ is saying that if you have 59 shields towards a temple, and your city produces, say 13 shields/turn, the 12 shields (that is essentially wasted) should go to the next thing you decide to build.
Having excess materials left over could be salvaged for other things in real life.

Getting rid of waste in this form would help the AI.
 
Originally posted by Bamspeedy


DaviddesJ is saying that if you have 59 shields towards a temple, and your city produces, say 13 shields/turn, the 12 shields (that is essentially wasted) should go to the next thing you decide to build.
Having excess materials left over could be salvaged for other things in real life.

Getting rid of waste in this form would help the AI.

Agreed as well. DaviddesJ was addressing two issues. I was only talking about the switching issue.
I do agree that the overflow would also do a lot to help the AI.
 
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