FfH2 0.14 Bugs

[Rando]

Hi Kael,

Quick question - does Mod "C" work with current save games or will it invalidate? Also, will the mod C fixes work with a game already in progress?

Thanks!!

 

[Kael]

Hi Kael,

Quick question - does Mod "C" work with current save games or will it invalidate? Also, will the mod C fixes work with a game already in progress?

Thanks!!

None of the patches break save games. Only the major version changes (0.13 to 0.14) invalidate save games.

 

[Kael]

a suggestion to someone earlier (forget who) in this thread who suggested difficulty in seeing all the available resources they have (especially in the foreign advisor window) If there will be no more patches for this version Kael then I will once again (and suggest to others who find this annoyance with Civ) to add the (The Lopez) Enhanced Foriegn Advisor Mod. I also add in the usual Special Domestic Advisor as well as the Military Advisor. However, if playing on large maps with large amounts of unit the Military Advisor can be rather slow. I had done this with version .12 and .13 and no problems (also included pirates mod and animal units mod) This time I may try the unit statistic mods too. Any chance Kael when you might offically insert the Enhanced Foriegn Advisor mod in for good? P.S. I think I've also came up with an error when creating the Blood of the Phoenix and Messaba of Dis. Apparently when gold rushing Messaba of Dis, the city creating the Blood of the Phoenix is stopped. Not sure if this is intentional but it's happend twice (i'll check a third time) (duel map, starting in rennisance) with civs Clan of Embers and Blaspheraps or however you spell it)

Yes, but Im not ready to add 3rd party mods yet. Once our code is settled down we will look at adding other components.

 

[Kael]

I mentioned this with the previous version...

Would it be possible to give an announcement with that flourish when the Barbarians declare war on someone like whenever war is declared by anyone else?

This would be really helpful when playing against AI civs with the BAR trait and they exceed the 50% pt. threshold.

Thanks.

Yeah, its on my wish list. I will see what I can do.

 

[Kael]

Dear FfH Project Team,



PLAYER’S FEEDBACK – FfH Version 2.014b. (Patched to 14c towards the end.)

My first two games as the Khazad ended with barbarians marching through the ruins of my capital. But the third time did the trick. I have reached the beginning of the endgame. It has been a peaceful, rather dull game. My main challenge was dealing with Vault conditions. (I wish I had found this forum http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=177116 before I had started as Khazad. ;rolleyes: )

Conditions: Emperor, Raging Barbs, Aggressive AI, City Flipping After Conquest, Permanent Alliances, New Seed, Fractal Map (large, random conditions)

Civilization/Leader: Khazad / Arturus Thorne (King of Fundementals)

Game Play Summary: After numerous map regenerations I concluded the Fractal Map generator does not often generate large swaths of hilly lands. So the dwarves ended up starting in pretty generic terrain. All through the opening game I had just one city with the ability to mine nearby hills. We ran into the Mercurians to the NE and the Illians to the NW. After fighting a brief war against the Illians the Dwarves remained at peace. We expected conflict between our Good and Evil neighbors, but they seemed to love each other. The Dwarven Vault put significant obstacles to my early expansion, but from the mid-game on I was running 100% tech almost every single turn. The Khazad + Runes of Killmorph certainly = One Rich Civ. Thanks to the peaceful world I have been able to make trades and thus have kept almost even with the tech leaders. However, it looks like once again the only way to end the game is via a Domination victory. A cultural victory is possible, but is still over 200 turns away. A Religious victory was the goal, but even with Runes in every city but about 8-9, I have been unable to get above 59% influence. So the Khazad are poised to win, I just don’t think I could live with the tedium of watching them do so.

PROBLEMS & BUGS: I’ve no idea which bugs are already known. Further information and/or saved game files are available to the project team upon request.

There’s Something about Mary: That caused the typhoid lady’s appearance in Year 97! Even if a hut gave someone the Alchemy tech, how could they build so many shields with the feeble starting cities?

Your Dragon is Showing: When Orthus and Aecheron appeared, their origin tiles appeared on my world map. Later, a unit belonging to a civ on the far side of the globe entered Orthus’ origin tile, the unit was ‘seen’ on my world map, and our civs established contact, even though we were about as far from each other as was possible.

Cheese It, It’s the Coppers: The poor dwarves had no copper to mine all game (until about Year 570) yet they were still able to build Dwarven Soldiers and Hammerfists, Their requirements say Copper or Mithril, but I was able to build ‘em with just Iron.

Shy Maros: I was unable to build Maros from the full city screen, or from the production mini-panel under the city on the main map. Maros was a selection, but was greyed out. I was able to build him successfully from the production pop-up menu that appears when a civ finishes it’s build queue.

Lastly, The Big Bug

NOBODY expects the DWARVEN Iquisition: (Answered above, whew.)

PERSONAL OPINION

Need Lockouts for solo Mercurians/Infernals. As mentioned, I was surprised to see the Mercurans ‘pleased’ with the Illians all game long, and vice versa. From their greeting, I gather the Mercurans might be programmed to go to war with the Infernals, and only the Infernals? If so, there needs to be a chech to ensure either both races are in the game, or none of them are. I have this feeling the politics of my game were skewed by the amazing passivity of the Mercurians.

The Dwarves Act Like Dwarves: I am still letting my opinion stew regarding the Khazad as designed. The Dwarven Vault is a nice boon in the endgame, when money flows freely. But it is a major burden to bear in the opening game. Early city expansion is slowed dramatically, which undermines the historic advantage to having an Organized leader. (Low maintenance costs means you can build an extra city or three.) And the need to divert funds into the Vault also slows early R&D.

OTOH, by the mid-game or the end game, a healthy Vault is a boon, provided that you have been able to trade enough to keep up with the Joneses. So I am not sure there is much of a problem, if any. One can say that the Khazad tend to act like you’d think Dwarves would act. They pay attention to internal matters, seek money, and don’t have much energy left over to get involved in the outside world. But could they do this when faced with a nearby hostile neighbor? I was able to gain a lot of gold and tech through trade … can the Khazad keep filling their Vault, keep up with the tech leaders, AND defend themselves against a starting antagonist? In this situation the Vault might prove as beneficial as hip waders during a midnight swim. That’s my concern at this point.

Reccomendations:

Resolve the Mercurians/Infernals political passivity issue (if it actually does exist.)

We are looking into a war script that will monitor the game and push wars when the situation is right. It propbably won't be added until the "Fire" release.

I am concerned about the harsh magical limitations put on the Khazad. But my game did not put the Khazad warfighting ablities to the test. I cannot make any claims one way or the toher.

BRAINDRIZZLING

I would like to see a nature-based civilization that actually preserves nature. That is, it does not build cottages, lumbermills, or even roads. Animal units continue to spawn. It would be the anti-civ … the people who wish to protect large swaths of the planet from development of any sort. Perhaps the ‘settlements’ mechanism could be adapted to allow this civ large cultural boundries with few cities? They’d probably need a special victory condition, if they were made a playable race. This would take a lot of work and might not be programmable, but it’d really be a ‘different’ civ. It fits my idea of the “protector of nature” type neutrals more than the Leaves religion, which might be said to be more a “draw upon nature’s power” sort of philosophy. (Certainly even an Elven civ homeland has been vastly developed by Year 500.)

Thanks again for the great mod!

Im glad you are having fun. We have talked about removing roads from elves, havign forests act as roads, creating another road type called "paths", etc etc.

But nothing is worth the amount of effort. Removing roads entirely takes the elves ability to link resources away. So we would then need to code a new way to link resources without roads (a lot of work which wont dramatically improve the game).

 

[Hian the Frog]

Kael and Co.

Testing Luchuirps at that time. Difficult when you lost Barnaxus... He was ...how to say...scattered by Infernal Chariots.
But that's not the problem of the day.
Is it logical or a bug that forests grow in desert ? I have some in "flat" desert and desert hills....strange.

The Frog.

 

[puck11b]

Haven't had much time to play, but I have not run into a giant spider in the wilderness, anyone seen one?

~p

 

[QES]

We are looking into a war script that will monitor the game and push wars when the situation is right. It propbably won't be added until the "Fire" release.



Im glad you are having fun. We have talked about removing roads from elves, havign forests act as roads, creating another road type called "paths", etc etc.

But nothing is worth the amount of effort. Removing roads entirely takes the elves ability to link resources away. So we would then need to code a new way to link resources without roads (a lot of work which wont dramatically improve the game).

I like the idea of elves not having roads. I dont know how the "Trade network" thing functions, but paths sounds nice. Maybe make the roads invisable? The trees could still "move out of the way" but thered be no redish/brown road visable on the map? That'd look nice, it'd still look basically like forests, but it'd allow the elves to link resources, and it would hide their "paths" from other players........cept the AI would still see them. Maybe make them "Unpillageable" too. That way the AI wouldnt care about them. only the "commando" units would be able to use them, and it would make sense that commando's know about the paths.

Maybe replace "railroads" with invisable paths. And with that "Unpllageable" elven workers would have a reason to upgrade. I wouldnt suggest that they make units faster, however.
-Qes

 

[Maniac]

Im glad you are having fun. We have talked about removing roads from elves, havign forests act as roads, creating another road type called "paths", etc etc.

But nothing is worth the amount of effort. Removing roads entirely takes the elves ability to link resources away. So we would then need to code a new way to link resources without roads (a lot of work which wont dramatically improve the game).

As far as I can see Elves and Dwarves (or more generally if desired, all Fellowship and Runes followers) could be given their own unique route types with only XML modifications. Here's a post I made a couple weeks back:

How would you feel about adding a route type, named Hidden Path, which is built automatically together with the elven farm/cottage/pasture..., starts with 120 iMovement, but gets -90 iMovementChange with the Hidden Paths tech and another -10 with Commune with Nature or something? Result would be that other civ units with the Commando promotion but without Hidden Paths tech couldn't rush through elven forests. The Elves would keep their home advantage. It would fit with the idea of ancient forests as mysterious and impregnable.

One could do a similar thing for Dwarves or Runes religious civs in general. With the Arete tech, add a new worker order which builds a mine together with a new route type called "Underground Tunnels". Likewise they could start with 120 iMovement and only give -90 with Arete (and another -10 with some other mining/metal related tech).

 

[QES]

As far as I can see Elves and Dwarves (or more generally if desired, all Fellowship and Runes followers) could be given their own unique route types with only XML modifications. Here's a post I made a couple weeks back:

That'd be sweet, cept the AI would still pillage them. And foriegn units cant use roads anyway - hence the pillaging.

Still, that DOES sound like a coding answer to the problem.
-Qes

 

[FM_Freyland]

I have seen several giant spiders, to the poster who asked.

I am playing my first game as Khazad, and it is a Terra map, so as you can imagine, I have close borders with several civs, including the Infernals. They declared war on me when I wouldn't tribute, and they lost. I can't say I find the dwarves weak, even in the early game. Also, this is on Prince.

 

[Nikis-Knight]

Kael and Co.
But that's not the problem of the day.
Is it logical or a bug that forests grow in desert ? I have some in "flat" desert and desert hills....strange.

The Frog.

Is there mana nearby? Nature might have put forest on desert, or fire made the plains under them into desert.

(Intentionaly, btw.)

 

[QES]

Is there mana nearby? Nature might have put forest on desert, or fire made the plains under them into desert.

This happened to me too, and it always happened around magic nodes...its sort of an interesting quirk...one im not sure should be fixed! Magic lands yo!
-Qes

 

[Hian the Frog]

Is there mana nearby? Nature might have put forest on desert, or fire made the plains under them into desert.

(Intentionaly, btw.)

Nikis-Knight,

Ahhh !!! Ok.
I understand now. Yes you are right. I first build a fire Node, then the wonder Eternal Flame. I destroy the fire node and then build a nature one. That's why there are forests on desert....Fun.
And with my wonder Tomb of Succelus and an other Water node, i built the Tower of Elements. Also fun...and usefull.
Thanks.

The Frog.

 

[vorshlumpf]

Im glad you are having fun. We have talked about removing roads from elves, havign forests act as roads, creating another road type called "paths", etc etc.

But nothing is worth the amount of effort. Removing roads entirely takes the elves ability to link resources away. So we would then need to code a new way to link resources without roads (a lot of work which wont dramatically improve the game).

When I was thinking about this, I thought a quick solution could be to simply give elves incentive to not build roads. For instance, a road could reduce or eliminate the chance of a treant appearing, or a road could take away the bonus food given by ancient forests. This way, the elves could still build roads to link up those valuable resources, but they'd have to be very selective about it.

Frankly, when I was the Ljosofar, I would frequently ignore some resources that I didn't need because putting ancient forest with a cottage on top of their base bonus was more appealing. And the elves are not in great need of the health bonuses given by food resources (I'll refrain from getting into my idea of making animal resources unusable to elves...).

- Niilo

 

[QES]

When I was thinking about this, I thought a quick solution could be to simply give elves incentive to not build roads. For instance, a road could reduce or eliminate the chance of a treant appearing, or a road could take away the bonus food given by ancient forests. This way, the elves could still build roads to link up those valuable resources, but they'd have to be very selective about it.

Frankly, when I was the Ljosofar, I would frequently ignore some resources that I didn't need because putting ancient forest with a cottage on top of their base bonus was more appealing. And the elves are not in great need of the health bonuses given by food resources (I'll refrain from getting into my idea of making animal resources unusable to elves...).

- Niilo

YOu failed to refrain since it was mentioned .

But i think roads are necessary for military purposes as well. Then theres the factor of some of us are lazy, and dont want to micromanage the workers (yes i know manipulating them personally is more efficeint and quick, but im a king, i got better things to do than over see a workshops construction...there are people to oppress, nobles to tax.......women to impress with my royal scepter...etc. I cant be bothered (except with mana nodes) to trifle with counting coppers.

Stilll, i see your point.
-Qes

 

[Hian the Frog]

Kael and the Team,

Since 0.11, i have tested all your leaders and all civs. Something disturb me.
Whatever is the leader you chose for a particular civ, you always start with the same tech. e.g: you can play as Arendel, Amelanchier or Thessa, you always begin with exploration (if i'm right).
Nevertheless, their outlooks are very different.
So, why not a particular first tech for each leader ? That could improve their specific outlook. Amelanchier (for exemple) is very very different from Arendel or Thessa. He's neutral and "military/def" whereas Arendel is good and "cultural/religious".
I suppose that it's not possible to do: techs are linked with civs and not with leaders. Right ?
That's just an idea i have to give more taste and flavor to the mod...

The Frog.

 

[Kael]

Patch "D" is up and linked in the first post. It foxes the following issues:

1. ExtraCombatStr retained through capture and upgrade.
2. No divide by 0 error when the Khazad don't have any cities.
3. You cant build pirate coves on area 1 islands (and get the CTD).

 

[Kael]

Kael and the Team,

Since 0.11, i have tested all your leaders and all civs. Something disturb me.
Whatever is the leader you chose for a particular civ, you always start with the same tech. e.g: you can play as Arendel, Amelanchier or Thessa, you always begin with exploration (if i'm right).
Nevertheless, their outlooks are very different.
So, why not a particular first tech for each leader ? That could improve their specific outlook. Amelanchier (for exemple) is very very different from Arendel or Thessa. He's neutral and "military/def" whereas Arendel is good and "cultural/religious".
I suppose that it's not possible to do: techs are linked with civs and not with leaders. Right ?
That's just an idea i have to give more taste and flavor to the mod...

The Frog.

Your starting techs are decided by 2 things:

1. Your civilization (and these are set differently).
2. Your handicap. If you start on Warlord or easier you get Exploration for free. I suspect this is why all of the leaders seem to have exploration for you.

 

[pa12ick]

Kael,
Played Ljosifar with Leaves and noticed that Yvain doesn't start/get the "Elven" promotion. That seems odd for a Hero with "Wood Elf" in their name...