Firaxis needs to change Chinese cities naming!

[Bans]

What to call cities from the ancient civs then? Like the egyptian cities? They surely werent named Memphis, Thebes or Elephantine...

I think the naming should be as it is... If not you can prolly change em when you found as always.

 

[dc82]

What to call cities from the ancient civs then? Like the egyptian cities? They surely werent named Memphis, Thebes or Elephantine...

I think the naming should be as it is... If not you can prolly change em when you found as always.

again, the point isn't that english names r used - the point is the both outdated/incorrected spellings and just plain wrong city names r used. i mean the argument isn't to use chinese type for the name. the situation is that, certain cities names of cities that also exist today r considered written incorrectly by today's official standards. of course u can change the name, but it's a hassle and a misrepresentation of the civ. again, if u had to change new amsterdam to new york or texas to dallas in every game...

 

[tcjsavannah]

of course u can change the name, but it's a hassle and a misrepresentation of the civ.

Yeah, because I hear ancient Romans all the time complaining about how Civ misrepresents their society.

 

[dc82]

well we're talking about chinese civs... and that there r some pretty gross errors - the fact that this thread is up and people r complaining shows that... well there is complaint. lol

 

[tcjsavannah]

well we're talking about chinese civs... and that there r some pretty gross errors - the fact that this thread is up and people r complaining shows that... well there is complaint. lol

I just find it humorous that people are complaining about historical accuracy in a game who's fundamental design... is changing history. Who knows, maybe there's some alternate reality out there where every Earth city name is exactly as its spelled in a computer game. But the idea that Firaxis "owes" it to everyone to correct this "glaring problem" that has absolutely NO impact on game play is laughable, especially when the corrective mechanism is included right in the game design.

 

[ogmoir]

tcjsavannah:
So it would be fine by you if all the civilisations and their cities were made up?

I wouldn't like that. I want certain recognition of facts to make the game more interesting. Having Pinyin transcription of the Chinese city names would contribute to that.

 

[dc82]

I just find it humorous that people are complaining about historical accuracy in a game who's fundamental design... is changing history. Who knows, maybe there's some alternate reality out there where every Earth city name is exactly as its spelled in a computer game. But the idea that Firaxis "owes" it to everyone to correct this "glaring problem" that has absolutely NO impact on game play is laughable, especially when the corrective mechanism is included right in the game design.

well what you said doesn't make sense at all. by ur standards then it should be fine if alphabet tech leads to space travel or america is spelled amerika with its capital city as new delhi, lead by president mrs. joseph stalin. u can play a fictional game, and yes u can play an alternate history, u can change the names if u want to, there's no disputing that. but again, there is a certain consistancy in civ that should be held, in this case, correct and sensible names. again, if there were gross errors in like the above example w/ the us, people wud be kicking and screaming. perhaps it's just not a big deal for u 'cuz it doesn't affect a civ u care about.

 

[Trade-peror]

I just find it humorous that people are complaining about historical accuracy in a game who's fundamental design... is changing history. Who knows, maybe there's some alternate reality out there where every Earth city name is exactly as its spelled in a computer game. But the idea that Firaxis "owes" it to everyone to correct this "glaring problem" that has absolutely NO impact on game play is laughable, especially when the corrective mechanism is included right in the game design.

Yes, Civ is not based on maintaining historical accuracy, but Firaxis intentionally uses civs that historically existed in order to better relate the game to the player's real world. Therefore, details such as city names are assumed by players to be correct, and when in fact they are not, errors that should have been corrected long before are perpetuated.

It is true the corrective mechanism exists. But I suspect the real purpose of being able to change city names is so you can change it to random, completely made-up names. Players assume that the names that automatically come up are based on historical city names. Therefore, Firaxis does need to make sure those names are in fact historically accurate.

 

[tcjsavannah]

tcjsavannah:
So it would be fine by you if all the civilisations and their cities were made up?

Sure, why not. I did buy and play Galactic Civilizations, after all.

Listen, you guys are probably right. There used to be a way we anglicanized everybody's names and, like there are people in our South that still refer to everyone above the Mason/Dixon line "Damn Yankees," there's people who will still call them by those bastardized names. But if you're seriously contemplating not playing or buying a game only because it has Tsingtao instead of Qingdao... *shake head* Personally, I'd rather the gamePLAY issues be resolved making it an enjoyable experience. "Crap, this whole religion thing is broken. But hey, at least they didn't offend us by putting Canton as a city name!"

 

[NP300]

romantic for some, age of imperalism and oppression for others. heh. XP

The case of Ukraine and Belarus is different, though. Russian culture had its origins in Ukraine. They were part of the same state in their very beginning as a state. They just diverged linguistically after a few centuries. If I recall correctly, Ukraine and Belarus were never independent entities until 1991, save for a short time in 1917-1920 as a result of conditions imposed by the Brest-Litovsk treaty. So I think Ukrainian and Belorrussian cities should be in the Russian city list.

The anti-Russian nationalism in Ukraine appears to be more a response against communism than anything else. Thus, I suspect the objection of the Ukrainian nationalists is more against Communism than against Russian culture. I also don't remember reading about Ukrainian nationalism until communism appeared, although it probably did exist to some extent under the Tsars. In any case, it did not really become a major force until the oppression of communism.

For that matter, there were even Russian nationalists who opposed and took up arms against the Soviet Union from 1917-1945. Russian nationalism appears to have fused with Soviet nationalism only after WWII.

 

[dc82]

if you're seriously contemplating not playing or buying a game only because it has Tsingtao instead of Qingdao... *shake head* Personally, I'd rather the gamePLAY issues be resolved making it an enjoyable experience. "Crap, this whole religion thing is broken. But hey, at least they didn't offend us by putting Canton as a city name!"

well obviously i wudn't let something like that prevent me from buying the game. i mean i always just change the city names, or i go to the rule editor and just change it permanently. i think the whole point is that since firaxis does look at this, and the game is still being touched up, it's a relatively small and easily fixed problem that people wud like to see done on the game.

 

[Cuivienen]

i was writing how indian cities such as bombay shud be corrected (it's being recognized more now as mumbai)

Not in most cases. From what I understand, most Indians call Bombay, Bombay and Madras, Madras despite the formal changes to Mumbai and Chennai. (Calcutta/Kolkata was just a bad transliteration that stuck.)

 

[dc82]

Not in most cases. From what I understand, most Indians call Bombay, Bombay and Madras, Madras despite the formal changes to Mumbai and Chennai. (Calcutta/Kolkata was just a bad transliteration that stuck.)

hrm, i've heard that the other is the more correct spelling/closer pronunciation, but perhaps it's slightly different than the situation with chinese cities. heh.

 

[KarstenL]

Now there's also a country in CIV called Scandinavia with a city called Copenhagen. This city happens to be the Capital City of my mother country Danmark.

Now the name isn't Copenhagen, it's an English misspelling. The correct name is København.

 

[Trade-peror]

Now the name isn't Copenhagen, it's an English misspelling. The correct name is København.

I agree, but before making these comparisons please understand that if Guangzhou were displayed as Chinese characters I would not complain. "København" is the Danish spelling for the city the English spell as "Copenhagen." There is no mispelling, however, because the official English translation of "København" is "Copenhagen."

My issue with using "Canton" is that it is the incorrect English translation--not just another style, but officially incorrect because the Pinyin system is the standard system. If "Guangzhou" is not used, then Firaxis should use the Chinese characters for the city name (which would probably be more difficult to program than just the correct spellings).

Also, I must remind everyone that probably no one will refuse to buy Civ4 for such a minor reason, but Firaxis should really consider not perpetuating such errors, if only to demonstrate that they in fact thoroughly research their games. Again, the Pinyin system has been the official translation for over 50 years...way before Civ1 was made...

 

[dc82]

I agree, but before making these comparisons please understand that if Guangzhou were displayed as Chinese characters I would not complain. "København" is the Danish spelling for the city the English spell as "Copenhagen." There is no mispelling, however, because the official English translation of "København" is "Copenhagen."

My issue with using "Canton" is that it is the incorrect English translation--not just another style, but officially incorrect because the Pinyin system is the standard system. If "Guangzhou" is not used, then Firaxis should use the Chinese characters for the city name (which would probably be more difficult to program than just the correct spellings).

Also, I must remind everyone that probably no one will refuse to buy Civ4 for such a minor reason, but Firaxis should really consider not perpetuating such errors, if only to demonstrate that they in fact thoroughly research their games. Again, the Pinyin system has been the official translation for over 50 years...way before Civ1 was made...

in fact, there's actually two errors - not only is canton to wrong official english spelling (it's guangdong), but canton is not even a city! so either way u look at it, there r errors that need to be fixed.

trade is rite tho, i mean, i'm sure most if not all the people here who r in favor of the change in names have bought past civ's despite the errors in the past, and it's not something that wud keep one from buying 4. at the same time, there's nothing wrong about asking them to fix some mistakes, esp. before the game is released.

 

[EmperorNikolaos]

Tsingtao is QingDao....So what? If Firaxis changes this, it would also have to change the greek cities names. Instead of Athens, Athina for example. And I am sure that similar situations exist to all non-english speaking nations. In civilization 4 there should be used the english and international names. That is not an insault to us, the rest of the world. Do you call the other countries as they call themselves in your language? In greek, we dont.

 

[rbis4rbb]

Also, I would like some different cities on the American city list, and I would like them spelled differently

 

[dc82]

Tsingtao is QingDao....So what? If Firaxis changes this, it would also have to change the greek cities names. Instead of Athens, Athina for example. And I am sure that similar situations exist to all non-english speaking nations. In civilization 4 there should be used the english and international names. That is not an insault to us, the rest of the world. Do you call the other countries as they call themselves in your language? In greek, we dont.

arg... u shud reread the posts - it's not about spelling it the way its pronounced in chinese. it's about the correct english spelling. the fact is the english spelling they use is outdated and wrong, not to mention that some of the names r just blatantly wrong (they're not even cities). it's like having a city called attica or korinthia or arkadia instead of athens, corinth, or tripoli.

 

[EmperorNikolaos]

arg... u shud reread the posts - it's not about spelling it the way its pronounced in chinese. it's about the correct english spelling. the fact is the english spelling they use is outdated and wrong, not to mention that some of the names r just blatantly wrong (they're not even cities). it's like having a city called attica or korinthia or arkadia instead of athens, corinth, or tripoli.

To tell the truth I did not read all of the posts. You are right, I misunderstood the whole thread.