First Impressions

Questions:
--Do stations disappear if I don't trade with them, or is it because a worm killed them?
--What all do I earn affinity from? I seem to be getting a little progress (shown on the top bar) when I don't finish techs or choose quest rewards.
--What determines what you get from trade routes?
--How many decent tiles should an area have before you decide to build there? I'm thinking 6 tiles is the magic number in this game, which is much much smaller than BNW.

Random observations, neither good or bad:
--Firaxite/Floatrock/Xenomoss spawning near you may be critically important, but I want to play a little more first.
--Base tile yields aren't as powerful as in Civ 5 because there are more ways to modify them. I guess I'd like to see them be a little more important, particularly through the nerfing of trade routes.

1. Yeah they disappear if not traded with by anyone for x number of turns after drop (not just you)

2. Some quests, some virtues, big increases come through nailing the affinity icons on the tech tree.

3. Disparity between source and destination (i.e. net production/food difference, unsure on science exactly, but heard it's something about resource variety?) some virtues also impact it.

4. It's personal preference, but myself I almost always hit up Geoscaping and Climate control, so I go for strategic positioning. You can make a dog spot awesome with weather sattelites and orbital fabricators. If anything I look for a little titanium and oil.

In most games I've played firaxite/xenomass/floatstone don't come into that big of effect, I mean they're nice to have but you can usualy trade someone with a off affinity until you can secure your own "somewhere" on the map.
 
Moderator Action: Two First Impressions threads merged into the main First Impression thread
 
My opinion after finishing 3 games on the 3 ''normal'' maps, I played all 3 directions, thought Harmony was the easiest, I did the mind flower, a conquest victory ( with purity) and the supremacy victory thing once where you send 1000 strength in military through the gate:

Game is quite fun, but some very annoying points:

1. Stations, **** off, they always seem to land where I want my second city planted, and have to wait a long time to kill them off with military units
2. Siege worms often chill where I want my 2nd city.
3. It's impossible to reach maximum level of a particular direction on any ''fun'' (gemeni and upwards) difficulty level, if you pursue maximum level, the AI will beat you to a victory, or you win the game way before the maximum level.
4. Health is impossible to have early in game. And very easy late in game ( think I had 50+ positive health in my harmony & prosperity game.).
5. Strategic resources are of much more use in this game than regular civ 5, I always pretty much use all my oil/firaxite/xenomass/floatingstone/titanium, even with 30 + of it.
 
#4 is just not true. In my current game I may have slipped to -3 health but only for a short amount of time. Most of the game I've been watching my health go up as my population grows.
I played the virtue tree differently this time.
 
Disclaimer: I only ever actually played a little of CiV after spending an enormous time on I, II, III and IV.

First off, the thing I definitely like most about the one unit per tile system with ranged units and combined with the trade system is that naval units matter now! Playing through the game I actually felt that my navy was as, if not more, important as my land based armies. I NEVER felt that way once in any of my earlier Civ games (except in a couple of the few V games I played). It really made the experience feel like an improvement.

Which leads to my primary comment for adjustment about the yet-to be patched version (which all strategy games must undergo after release. I honestly don't know why everyone always makes a big fuss about it really). The AI just doesn't prioritize the right stuff. I actually don't think trade is outlandishly imbalanced like so many have implied. It does benefit both sides afterall. It needs to be toned down a bit (which Firaxis did announce already) but completely nerfing it would ruin so much potential.

The AI should build large navies, aggressively go after trade in wars, group its ships, avoid outnumbered confrontations in favor of pillaging, and engage in naval battles when it has the numerical and/or technological superiority. I only encountered a couple warships in all my wars in my first game. Had the AI gone after my trade and made it difficult for me to sail fleets up to their cities and shell them, then I would've had at least a real fight on my hands.

Diplomacy and options available should also be ramped up. AI's (depending on relationships and personality) should use trade blockades, embargoes, etc. aggressively against warmongers or anyone nearing a victory condition. War should be more of a trade off. Steamrolling opponents with no consequences to balance isn't fun.

Speaking of war: where's the spectrum of benefits? Health penalties/bonus are being amped (rightfully so) but when I went to war, I felt there was no point in not completely steamrolling my opponent. This was both tedious and, well, without much reward.

Healthwise I don't need a bunch of puppet or, worse, additional cities and razing takes too long and confers practically no benefit. Since a large number of cities is not beneficial and as it takes so long to grow a city into something resembling maturity settling the now open land is not a viable option either.

However, there are no reasonable diplomatic options that make non-complete victory worth it. I should be able to force my opponent to suspend trade with another for a set number of turns or to reserve a certain % of their routes for my cities exclusively. There should be affinity related options subject to the affinities and levels of both parties. Quests should be activated for both sides during the war.

Obviously, you can already take resources but that's not properly developed. What does a Supremacy Civ gain from defeating a Purity Civ and taking Floatstone? Either there should be some use for all the resources for every Affinity (while maintaining greater use and value for the affinity-associated resource) or, and I'm spitballing here, you should be able to trade the ability to build special units/buildings.

Example: for 10 turns Supremacy Civ A can build a unique floatstone Supremacy unit due to a treaty with Purity Civ B. As soon as the agreement ends, Civ B stops supplying the necessary equipment to build the unit so Civ A can only maintain the ones it already built. If Civ A does not maintain its Floatstone supply then the units are inactive until enough is acquired. Perhaps the agreement costs Civ B some production for X number of it's largest cities. Therefore Civ A has incentives both to not completely annihilate Civ B and also to more or less maintain the status quo post victory. Civ B may chafe under the yoke, but it survives, has some leverage in the agreement and as Civ A becomes more reliant on the relationship, can make a comeback. More fun than just steamrolling.
 
The AI just doesn't prioritize the right stuff. I actually don't think trade is outlandishly imbalanced like so many have implied. It does benefit both sides afterall. It needs to be toned down a bit (which Firaxis did announce already) but completely nerfing it would ruin so much potential.

Internal trade routes benefit only you. External trade routes benefit you disproportionately. In a cost-benefit analysis, trade routes give you more of what you want than any other option available to you, and the AI doesn't understand this. So you can either bring trade into balance with the other options for gaining food/production/science/energy, or you can make the AI prioritise the overpowered trade system. Having an overpowered system like this is also a trap for new players who will not assume it's the main production center for your entire empire - they might think silly things like factories being the best way to increase their production, or laboratories being a good way to gain science, or other such nonsense.

The Autoplant quest was a clear mistake which they'll likely rectify in the first patch, which will straight-up nerf the trade section of the game by a third.

Healthwise I don't need a bunch of puppet or, worse, additional cities and razing takes too long and confers practically no benefit. Since a large number of cities is not beneficial and as it takes so long to grow a city into something resembling maturity settling the now open land is not a viable option either.

I completely agree. Like in Civ 5, warfare is a great way to bring opponents down, but it's a really bad way to build yourself up. The "resistance" time in this game is enormous - if I want to take over the average city late in the game I have to wait roughly 10% of the entire length of the game before the city contributes anything but warmonger penalties and unhealthiness to my empire.

However, there are no reasonable diplomatic options that make non-complete victory worth it.

Yes. Diplomacy is horribly bare-bones - they didn't even bother making unique text for all but a couple of the responses other leaders give you.

What does a Supremacy Civ gain from defeating a Purity Civ and taking Floatstone?

They can build the unique buildings that require Floatstone, or sell it for energy. Just because you have Supremacy as your major Affinity doesn't mean you won't have picked up a few Purity techs and buildings along the way. I recommend Vertical Farming.
 
I've harvested resources my affinity had no use for so I could trade it to another civ. BUt I'll only bother researching the tech to harvest for doing so if its convenient.
 
They can build the unique buildings that require Floatstone, or sell it for energy. Just because you have Supremacy as your major Affinity doesn't mean you won't have picked up a few Purity techs and buildings along the way. I recommend Vertical Farming.

I discovered vertical farming in my second game. Went for the farm/generator combo which I assume is a thing. With wonders, the combo was pleasantly productive.

Built some of the other sides' unique buildings btw using their special resources, thanks for the advice. Got some nice quest rewards.

Also if you have mixed purities, different unit upgrade paths are available (as long as you remain dominant in one). Unfortunately the bonus' are not entirely different but it does add some nice flavor.

**Note* I'm not sure about this, but the mixed path may be bugged. I couldn't upgrade a second time using my Purity combat suits after I picked the 10 Purity/2 Harmony path. I hope somebody crosses this path again and double checks. **

You're definitely right about autoplant quest. If they remove that then a third of the trade issue is gone. That might be almost enough since you have to build buildings to make internal trade strong. External trade with stations is kind of weak relative to with other civs and internally as well. It only becomes lucrative (and then supreme among trade) if you go down the industry virtues and grab 6 energy per tier perk. (which applies on land and sea). At that point you're halfway through the game (and for some reason the AI loves killing stations).
 
Oh, IMO the ultrasonic quest should go as well. You shouldn't have trade routes immune to aliens, unless they are at least within your borders.
 
Moderator Action: Comments after first BE game merged into the main First Impressions thread
 
Alternative Markets opens a lot faster if you don't detour 3 Virtues into Prosperity for the Colonist. I mean, I have a lot of respect for a free early Settler, but 3 Virtues is kind of steep, and it's not like the other benefits are super great. It's nice, but you don't have to do it every game.
 
*Note* I'm not sure about this, but the mixed path may be bugged. I couldn't upgrade a second time using my Purity combat suits after I picked the 10 Purity/2 Harmony path. I hope somebody crosses this path again and double checks. **

Battlesuits only ever upgrade once.

Alternative Markets opens a lot faster if you don't detour 3 Virtues into Prosperity for the Colonist. I mean, I have a lot of respect for a free early Settler, but 3 Virtues is kind of steep, and it's not like the other benefits are super great. It's nice, but you don't have to do it every game.

Disagree, unless you're in the mood to penalise yourself. If you're playing to win, you need that free colonist.
 
Disagree, unless you're in the mood to penalise yourself. If you're playing to win, you need that free colonist.

That sentiment is inconsistent with the idea that you don't need anything other than Trade Routes to win at the hardest difficulty. If this latter statement is true, then I really don't need anything to win other than Trade Routes.

Internal trade routes benefit only you. External trade routes benefit you disproportionately. In a cost-benefit analysis, trade routes give you more of what you want than any other option available to you, and the AI doesn't understand this. So you can either bring trade into balance with the other options for gaining food/production/science/energy, or you can make the AI prioritise the overpowered trade system. Having an overpowered system like this is also a trap for new players who will not assume it's the main production center for your entire empire - they might think silly things like factories being the best way to increase their production, or laboratories being a good way to gain science, or other such nonsense.

The AI and newbies are incompetent at everything in every Civ game ever made. If you want to equalize the AI and new players to recitfy the "overpowered whatever" you would need to reduce CivBE to Progress Quest.

Also, Factories ARE a good way to increase production in CivBE. It's the best option once you have a good network set up.
 
Additionally, trade gain value based on the production of various stats in each city. So while a building may only give a couple of production points it also enhances the trade route value. Hence trade routes are not incredibly valuable in a vacuum, they only leverage of the buildings and infrastructure you have built.

Just Add not using trade routes to the AI needs to improve list. Its long enough as it is
 
That sentiment is inconsistent with the idea that you don't need anything other than Trade Routes to win at the hardest difficulty. If this latter statement is true, then I really don't need anything to win other than Trade Routes.

You keep pulling this out like it's some kind of slam-dunk instead of being meaningless. You rush to the free colonist because it allows you to set up a trade route between the two cities it gives you, because trade routes are overpowered and all your decisions should revolve around maximising your trade route returns.

The AI and newbies are incompetent at everything in every Civ game ever made. If you want to equalize the AI and new players to recitfy the "overpowered whatever" you would need to reduce CivBE to Progress Quest.

By including ridiculously powerful options (trade depot > trade unit > trade unit > autoplant > trade unit in every new city) alongside normal options (old earth relic, recycler, anything that doesn't focus on trade) you are simultaneously making the game more boring and laying traps for both the AI and new players.

By balancing trade route output with the output from other sources that cost the same amount of resources to activate, you would simultaneously make a more newbie-friendly game, a game that the AI is more competitive in without having to give it more bonuses, and a game that has more interesting strategic choices.

As it is, I don't actually make any choices about what my new cities are going to build until they've built about six things, because those six things are all complete no-brainers.

This is bad game design, and we're going to see them moving towards fixing it in the first patch. (probably just fixing the Autoplant quest, but I can hope for more)

Also, Factories ARE a good way to increase production in CivBE. It's the best option once you have a good network set up.

Once you have a good network set up you can pretty much do whatever you like, since the network makes the game ridiculously easy. I had much more food and production than any of the Apollo AIs I played against in my first game due to the overpowered trade system, and it made the game a walkover.
 
I'm currently playing games on Mac and a bit late but now I have tried the game and this is my first impressions:

Looks: The design and graphics is really, really messy boring. The game is dark and lacks personality. I can't describe it better then that there is no "female touche" what so ever. The whole appearance just reeks of "young programmer male" in a very bad way. No taste! The beauty from Civ V is gone.

The leaders looks all the same, bland and boring. I get depressed... Is this what humanity looks like In the future we should kill ourselves right now!

Sound: The sound and atmosphere is better. I have no early complains but no salutations in particular either.

Gamplay: I have way to few hours to be judge of anything. I enjoy to explore the new techs and policies and overall it seems like a decent Civ game in this part.

The main issue from my point of wiew is the overall feel. The magic from real civilizations and history is just not present at all and I find it boring to play.
 
Looks: The design and graphics is really, really messy boring. The game is dark and lacks personality. I can't describe it better then that there is no "female touche" what so ever. The whole appearance just reeks of "young programmer male" in a very bad way. No taste! The beauty from Civ V is gone.

This is a pretty sexist statement and doesn't line up with reality.

The art team from Civ 5 was overwhelmingly male (out of the 35 names on the art credits I can only see one female name, though I'm unsure of the name Sang Han - looks like it's a unisex Korean name) but you use it as an example of game with a "female touch" in it's graphics?
 
This is a pretty sexist statement and doesn't line up with reality.

The art team from Civ 5 was overwhelmingly male (out of the 35 names on the art credits I can only see one female name, though I'm unsure of the name Sang Han - looks like it's a unisex Korean name) but you use it as an example of game with a "female touch" in it's graphics?

I'm well aware that it's a sexist statement. I'm from Sweden for God's sake. ;)

And I know that the actual gender of artists does not matter even in the slightest.

This was the best way I could describe my issue. The whole game has a pubertal feel and overall lack of taste. It's probably because of bad imagination about our future.

When dealing with actual history you stumble on our complete heritage in fashion and design with might explain the beauty I see in Civ 5.

Example of less bland future design that I know of could be Final Fantasy or Avatar. Beautiful Sci Fi worlds far away from (sexism again) the smell of pubertal teenage boy-room-games.
 
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