CS sling on immortal? That's ambitious... I didn't even think it was possible. What year do you finish the oracle?
CS slingshot is very do-able even on diety. Immortal you can coast along and still get it.
G-Major 18
- Thread starter Denniz
- Start date
CS slingshot is very do-able even on diety. Immortal you can coast along and still get it.
Damn, two close shots, but no hit. 
First time Huayna vassalized his complete continent and started his ship 3 turns before me and Churchill.
Second time Mansa declared war on me and Huayna and it was game over. We had casings, thrusters and 1 or two other parts done.
Mansa was pleased with us and suddenly annoyed. Stupid AI.
I would have not had a chance to win the gauntlet, but submitting a win would have been nice.
That was it for me for this gauntlet. Maybe I try again after New Year. On to gmajor19 and kick some AI butt !
First time Huayna vassalized his complete continent and started his ship 3 turns before me and Churchill.
Second time Mansa declared war on me and Huayna and it was game over. We had casings, thrusters and 1 or two other parts done.
Mansa was pleased with us and suddenly annoyed. Stupid AI.
I would have not had a chance to win the gauntlet, but submitting a win would have been nice.
That was it for me for this gauntlet. Maybe I try again after New Year. On to gmajor19 and kick some AI butt !
shyuhe
Deity
major 19 is harder than major 18 I think. Good luck on that one!
The-Hawk
Old Original Geezer
Yeesh, these AI's are idiots. I had an early PA with Ghandi, couldn't entice him to build squat. He even started Space Elevator in a city, I sent workers to chop it out. Chopped it about halfway, then Ghandi stopped the build, replaced it with a destroyer, and restarted Elevator in another city from scratch. Later, researched to fusion, watch Ghandi building supermarkets, missionaries, granaries, bunkers... but no engine. Moron. 
I do a CS slingshot after building the 2nd city, with the addition that I try to get marble with my 2nd city. You still must have some luck, especially if you discover alphabet before CL. I'm not sure but I think in that game I finished Oracle about 1600-1700 BC. It is quite randomly when AI (would) finishes Oracle in immortal, it can happen in 2000 or even 1300 BC, continents map pushes this date later, I didn't have a game when AI finished it before 1800 BC.
The-Hawk
Old Original Geezer
I have not figured out the secret to getting the AI motivated to go for a launch. I just submitted a 1697 win (my 5th submission, I think my 8th win overall). In this game, Ghandi went after Apollo and all spaceship parts as soon as they were available. In my previous post, I reported that he wouldn't build anything. I have no idea what was different this time around.
Having said that, he still was very stupid. I kept mining his hills in his production cities, he would come back and cottage (or windmill) over the mines. In fact, while building our last part, I had completed mines on all hills and he had one turn to go to win the game. However, all along, he had a worker turning one single mine back into a windmill, no way I could stop him. IBT when we were ready to win, he finished the windmill, which actually delayed the build one more turn! Obviously, he caused us to miss finishing it by one or two hammers. Nothing I could do but watch, was wishing I could kill the worker before he finished.
Oh, and I switched to Qin this time around. I had been using Liz, but I decided Qin's starting with agri was a huge advantage over Liz.
kovacsflo, I am amazed that your fastest time was without a PA. I still think PA is faster, in spite of the stupid AI's. You must have had a tremendous expansion period
. Makes me wonder how early you would have finished that game if you had entered into a PA.
Having said that, he still was very stupid. I kept mining his hills in his production cities, he would come back and cottage (or windmill) over the mines. In fact, while building our last part, I had completed mines on all hills and he had one turn to go to win the game. However, all along, he had a worker turning one single mine back into a windmill, no way I could stop him. IBT when we were ready to win, he finished the windmill, which actually delayed the build one more turn
! Obviously, he caused us to miss finishing it by one or two hammers. Nothing I could do but watch, was wishing I could kill the worker before he finished.Oh, and I switched to Qin this time around. I had been using Liz, but I decided Qin's starting with agri was a huge advantage over Liz.
kovacsflo, I am amazed that your fastest time was without a PA. I still think PA is faster, in spite of the stupid AI's. You must have had a tremendous expansion period
. Makes me wonder how early you would have finished that game if you had entered into a PA.kovacsflo, I am amazed that your fastest time was without a PA. I still think PA is faster, in spite of the stupid AI's. You must have had a tremendous expansion period
A tremendous expansion BC is essential, even if my research rate decreased to 60-70% for a while because of city maintenance. The changing point happens when I receive currency and my cities have enough cottages.
About PA, in my game (and with my librarian strategy), PA wouldn't help me too much. I had practically 2 tech trading partners, both was in my continent and had my religion, they gave me every tech they had. Last one was plastic. I know that PA can help us mainly in hammers and not in bulbs, but the choke point is bulb, because of the following:
I start to build Apollo immediately after rocketry, but before rocketry I research industrialism for having aluminium (if I'm lucky). I cut all trees I can to make Apollo building faster, and by the time I finish it, I can't start to build SS engine - it's always the last part I finish, instead of it's not the lastest part I START to build. SS life support is a very cheap part, it's enough to start to build it after engine, life suppport still will be ready before engine.
In Vanilla, number of cities producing bulbs doesn't really matters for researching, AI could never finish building these critical two parts. Maybe you can start to build them 1-2 turn earlier with PA (because of bigger number of bulb building cities), but that's all.
Usefullness of a PA is very much strategy dependent, with my strategy I don't think it can help too much because of the mentioned reasons, but I will try it next time.
Flóri
The-Hawk
Old Original Geezer
OK, excuse me while i throw up 
. I was giving this another try, doing pretty well. I got my PA in place about a dozen turns ahead of my best submission. Rocketry was also about a dozen turns sooner. So, subtracting 12 turns from my best time, I was aiming for around 1660 AD.
Alas, this time I got the idiot version of Gandhi as my partner
. After I researched Rocketry, it took him almost 150 years (48 turns) to start Apollo. In the mean time, he did some wonderful builds... for example:
- built a Castle in his ironworks city (which was dead center in his empire, not near any other AI)
- built a coal plant in most cities... later came along and build nuclear plants in all the same cities... later built Three Gorges.
- built bunkers, super markets, marines, arties, etc. etc. etc....
But, no Apollo!
Really sucks to play that far only to have him go stupid.
One game he is an idiot, next game he beelines all spaceship parts, then the next game he is an idiot again. Wish I understood what was the trigger. Is is possible the AI randomly selects a victory condition and sticks with it?
. I was giving this another try, doing pretty well. I got my PA in place about a dozen turns ahead of my best submission. Rocketry was also about a dozen turns sooner. So, subtracting 12 turns from my best time, I was aiming for around 1660 AD.Alas, this time I got the idiot version of Gandhi as my partner
. After I researched Rocketry, it took him almost 150 years (48 turns) to start Apollo. In the mean time, he did some wonderful builds... for example:- built a Castle in his ironworks city (which was dead center in his empire, not near any other AI)
- built a coal plant in most cities... later came along and build nuclear plants in all the same cities... later built Three Gorges.
- built bunkers, super markets, marines, arties, etc. etc. etc....
But, no Apollo!
Really sucks to play that far only to have him go stupid.One game he is an idiot, next game he beelines all spaceship parts, then the next game he is an idiot again. Wish I understood what was the trigger. Is is possible the AI randomly selects a victory condition and sticks with it?
shyuhe
Deity
are you playing with random personalities or with vanilla? I think the warlords AI is slightly more competent about going after a space victory but I'm not sure.
In all of my attempts, I have not had any problems with my PA partner going after SS parts but I've always ended up joined with Asoka (don't ask me why). Asoka builds the SS parts in a hurry and never leaves any parts for me to complete...
The nuke plant part sucks though. I've seen AI cities suffer meltdowns even when the city was built on a river.
In all of my attempts, I have not had any problems with my PA partner going after SS parts but I've always ended up joined with Asoka (don't ask me why). Asoka builds the SS parts in a hurry and never leaves any parts for me to complete...
The nuke plant part sucks though. I've seen AI cities suffer meltdowns even when the city was built on a river.
The-Hawk
Old Original Geezer
Maybe I'll try Warlords and see if that works better. I had been playing Vanilla because of easier CS slingshot. On the other hand, time is running out on this gauntlet, maybe I'll bag it and settle for what I have.
I did come up with a way of avoiding nuke plants... I trade away any Uranium I have, then ask my partner for his. In a PA, the AI will give you a resource even if its his only one. If he doesn't have another, then he can't build Nukes...
I did come up with a way of avoiding nuke plants... I trade away any Uranium I have, then ask my partner for his. In a PA, the AI will give you a resource even if its his only one. If he doesn't have another, then he can't build Nukes...
I think the advantage of easier CS slingshot is better than for example special buildings of warlords. Koreans are maybe an exception: 35% knowledge for university is awesome! If you play with them, with their secondary trait (prot) barbs won't be so effective, and a bit worse result with barbs means more in points then a bit earlier one without barb bonus.
Also russians' institute is useful as well, but they don't have useful traits for SS victory.
Obviously I am too stupid as I must miss something. 
I got an early PA with Mansa, gifted him Aluminium and he does not start Apollo. He puts his cities on "Research" even when we have researched all techs for space. All AIs, even the most backward catch up and start building the space ship although we could have gone to Alpha Cenaturi lightyears before. This is frustrating.
I got an early PA with Mansa, gifted him Aluminium and he does not start Apollo. He puts his cities on "Research" even when we have researched all techs for space. All AIs, even the most backward catch up and start building the space ship although we could have gone to Alpha Cenaturi lightyears before. This is frustrating.Well, at least I managed to submit a win finally yesterday, although I do not know whether it has been accepted, yet. Won in 1864AD. My first win on immortal and I am quite happy about that. 
After all the negative experience I signed a PA only after Cyrus completed Apollo and from then on it was quite a race against HC.
After all the negative experience I signed a PA only after Cyrus completed Apollo and from then on it was quite a race against HC.shyuhe
Deity
I think you're going to win kovacsflo. I haven't come close to my first entry either (3 turns behind yours). Must be the first attempt luck or something?
(3 turns behind yours). Must be the first attempt luck or something?I think you're going to win kovacsflo. I haven't come close to my first entry either
Just 3 turns? It must be frustrating... Anyway, I must tell that SS is my speciality, I used to spent all of my civ4 time on it especially on immortal. I tried other victory types just when ss couldnT show me new.
My first city wasn't on a really good place: 1 gold and 1 cow with 3 flood, but several green river tiles. The secret was that I settled as many cities I could and I started to cottaging just when nothing could be settled down.
Flóri
shyuhe
Deity
Yeah, I tried a few more times but then I had to leave for vacation so I haven't tried again since then 3 turns is a frustrating margin but I haven't been able to match it since my first game (tried 3-4 more times). I think most of the people have move on to try G-major 19 instead of 18, even though 18 is probably the easier of the two gauntlets (to post a competitive time). I'll be returning from break later this week but not in time to try 18 so I'll have to try 19
3 turns is a frustrating margin but I haven't been able to match it since my first game (tried 3-4 more times). I think most of the people have move on to try G-major 19 instead of 18, even though 18 is probably the easier of the two gauntlets (to post a competitive time). I'll be returning from break later this week but not in time to try 18 so I'll have to try 19 
Due to CFC's server being down today, we are extending the deadline of the gauntlets to twenty fours from the time of this post. That would be at 12:00 AM Central Time US (0600 GMT).
The-Hawk
Old Original Geezer
Well, at least I managed to submit a win finally yesterday, although I do not know whether it has been accepted, yet. Won in 1864AD. My first win on immortal and I am quite happy about that.
Well done partner!!!
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