Getting beat at a wonder

[Theov]

the turn before I finish Leonardo's Workshop, the Byzantines beat me to it.
Is there any way to hurry the wonder somehow?

 

[Pyrrhos]

Yes and no. The wonder as such cannot be rushed, pop or cash. Shields from woods and disbanding troops do not count (IIRC). But you can use a prebuild:

When you want a certain wonder such as Leonardo's, you decide which town - other than your capital - will build it well in advance. You focus a large part of your workers on improving the tiles of this town to maximise the number of worked tiles and shields. You can even disband workers (build button) to up the pop of the town. Just make certain it won't riot!

Now you calculate how many shields that town will gather per turn and how many turns it will take to build Leonardo's. Let's say the town at pop 12 produces 25 net (blue) shields. At this rate, it will take 600 shields / 25 shields per turn or 24 turns to build.

What you do is select something else to build and then once you've mastered Invention, you switch that build to Leonardo's. What most people use as a prebuild is the Palace and that's why you have to select another town for your prebuild. Now the Palace costs 300 shields or at 25spt, twelve turns. This means that you start the Palace prebuild eleven turns before you get Invention. If you're have researched Feudalism and start researching Engineering and see that will take, say eight turns, you're sixteen turns away from Invention which means that the town selected should start its Palace prebuild with three turns remaining of Engineering.

You could select another wonder for the prebuild such as the Great Library (400sh or 16 turns @ 25spt) or the Temple of Artemis (450sh or 18 turns @ 25spt). The risk is that someone completes it before you can switch to Leonardo's...

Sorry if my explanation was long-winded and too basic.

 

[Theov]

So other than pre-building there is no way to hurry / rush a wonder?
.
- cash: no
- forest chop: no
- disband units: no
- anything I forgot: no
.
I guess that if I can not hurry, I'll have to cripple their production.
It's a bit radical, but in the worst case, I'll end up with some Byzantine cities and some recourses.

 

[Bartleby]

You can rush a wonder using a Scientific Great Leader (SGL). You have a 3% chance (or 5% if you are a Scientific civ) to get an SGL every time you are the first civ to discover a technology.
A further point to something that Pyrrhos mentioned; you can't chop forests or disband troops to hurry a wonder, and if you try to do this, the game will not let you change to another wonder.

 

[Pyrrhos]

Considering how the ancient wonders were built (such as the Pyramids, even if it wasn't slave labour but voluntary participation), it's strange that the game won't let you sacrifice workers and troops in honour of the gods to whom these buildings were dedicated. But there it is.

 

[Sweetchuck]

Yeah, I use the pre-build thing all the time. I don't go into the mathimatical detail that pyrrhos does, I just sort of swag it and tee-up my pre-builds about 3 or 4 techs before I get to the one that I'm building a wonder with.

I use the palace also.

I remember my first game. I had about a dozen cities and finished building anything I could build - then saw Palace in one of them and thought "hmm, build a palace - why not?". So I started building them in all of my cities and couldn't figure out why I had to keep building them over again after I finished them.

 

[Aabraxan]

Just one slight correction:

You can even disband workers (build button) to up the pop of the town. Just make certain it won't riot!

If you disband workers, their shields won't go towards a wonder. In fact, if you start on a large building (like a cathedral or university) as a prebuild and disband a worker, the shields will go into the building and you will then be prevented from switching to a Great Wonder. I think what Pyrrhos means is that you can join workers to a city to increase its population and, thus, its shield per turn production.

Also, Theov, I don't know what version you're playing, but I think you could also use MGLs to rush Great Wonders in PTW. That was taken out in C3C, I think.

 

[Theov]

Just one slight correction:

If you disband workers, their shields won't go towards a wonder. In fact, if you start on a large building (like a cathedral or university) as a prebuild and disband a worker, the shields will go into the building and you will then be prevented from switching to a Great Wonder. I think what Pyrrhos means is that you can join workers to a city to increase its population and, thus, its shield per turn production.

Also, Theov, I don't know what version you're playing, but I think you could also use MGLs to rush Great Wonders in PTW. That was taken out in C3C, I think.

C3 Complete 1.22.
My city is already at the max (12) so adding workers wont help.
Thanks anyway.

 

[Aabraxan]

OK, if you're playing C3C 1.22, no rushing wonders with MGLs. And I guess no adding workers, either. Guess you'll just have to go capture Leo's, eh?

 

[Tone]

You cannot speed up your build but you can sometimes slow the AIs build down a bit, as long as you have met them.

Investigating the city via your embassy is well worth it in some circumstances. Firstly you can see whether they will beat you to the wonder. If you are trading luxes with them and the city needs those luxes to keep its citizens at work, stopping the deal might slow down the build. If they are getting luxes via a third party, you might be able to break that deal, maybe by declaring war on that other civ and claiming the luxes for yourself or simply by breaking their trade route.

If these are not viable options, investigating the city has saved you from wasting numerous shields and, as Aabra says, you can concentrate on how you are going to capture it.

 

[Northen Wolf]

Micromanaging has a possiblity to help also, Do not afraid to lose a little food, if you can get few shields more and your city size won't decrease, even like 3 shields in a turn can help....

 

[brennan]

Just one slight correction:

If you disband workers, their shields won't go towards a wonder.

He meant add the workers to the town, not disband them.

 

[Aabraxan]

He meant add the workers to the town, not disband them.

. . . which might explain why I said:

. . . . I think what Pyrrhos means is that you can join workers to a city to increase its population and, thus, its shield per turn production.

 

[Theov]

Micromanaging has a possiblity to help also, Do not afraid to lose a little food, if you can get few shields more and your city size won't decrease, even like 3 shields in a turn can help....

You guys! You guys!
Call it cheating, but I went back 3 turns and micromanaged the city so it had a few more shields. (like Northen Wolf explained. To be honest I figured it myself, but the tip is very useful)
So it beat the Byzantine city to the wonder.
For those who don't get it:
I went to a nearby city, took away the shield tiles and put them somewhere else. Then I went to the wonder city and made it work the (now open) shielded tiles. Gaining 2-4 shields a turn.
.
For those curious; I still went to war against the byzantine. It's a stalemate on the world with me leading the tech race and military, so I guess I can hurt them a little bit.
My happiness (and tech) is dependend on trading lux and I'm in Repo, so I must be carefull with not going in disorder.

 

[megistatos]

Ooh something else.

In PTW, if you rush a wonder with a MGL, you cannot then switch to another wonder(ie no rushing a pre-build the turn before getting the new wonder tech).

I wonder if this applies to Conquest SGLs? Probably though I've never tried it.

 

[Aabraxan]

You guys! You guys!
Call it cheating, but I went back 3 turns and micromanaged the city so it had a few more shields. (like Northen Wolf explained. To be honest I figured it myself, but the tip is very useful)
So it beat the Byzantine city to the wonder.

Of course it's cheating, but it's also a good way to try out and practice new techniques. We're talking about your solo game where, from the sounds of things, you're honing some skills. Reloading is a no-no in competitive play or SGs, so don't do it there, but I sure wouldn't worry about it here. Congrats on beating Theodora to the Wonder.

 

[Northen Wolf]

I did something useful, I did something useful! *runs around*

Let him learn by loading, but not like centuries, just 2-3 turns is good enough if you do it only like 2x in a game. Not all are as advanced strategist as you guys are

 

[Sweetchuck]

I did something useful, I did something useful! *runs around*

Let him learn by loading, but not like centuries, just 2-3 turns is good enough if you do it only like 2x in a game. Not all are as advanced strategist as you guys are

Whaa???


Anyway, if the AI gets a wonder over me - I take note of the city, if ya know what I mean.

Future "rescue" ops.

 

[lucashp]

Actually, when you use hurry production on a normal building, that takes up lots of shields (Im just guessing, Bank) And I'd Hurry it, You can then change to a wonder for a head start.

There's a word for that, But I forgot...

 

[Nergal]

If you do any hurrying on a prebuild it prevents you from using it for a Wonder as far as I know. I've had a few cases where the Wonder I wanted to build was greyed out because a worker had done a forest chop too near the city.