Greatest Conquerer
- Thread starter puglover
- Start date
Mongoloid Cow
Great Khan
"The Mongols conquered a big part of the world, but they didn't conquer any important European empires. Most of their territory was underdeveloped, empty, poor and had no important culture at the moment. So the Mongols didn't gain the (relative) power and supremacy the Roman Empire or Alexander the Great gained."
Addiv, I'm sorry but I have to pick you up on this. Europe had nothing! Absolutely nothing. It was backwards in all respects with a miserable climate and inhabited by people who would mutilate each other rather than fight off an outside threat. China had extreme wealth and technology. Central Asia was also very rich. Same with the Middle East. Russia had nothing, but the Mongols conquered it anyway. They didn't want to waste their time on Europe when there were better places to conquer.
Addiv, I'm sorry but I have to pick you up on this. Europe had nothing! Absolutely nothing. It was backwards in all respects with a miserable climate and inhabited by people who would mutilate each other rather than fight off an outside threat. China had extreme wealth and technology. Central Asia was also very rich. Same with the Middle East. Russia had nothing, but the Mongols conquered it anyway. They didn't want to waste their time on Europe when there were better places to conquer.
Dark Ascendant
Darkness Ascending...
your information is inaccurate. Under GK, the mongols with less than 200000 warriors breached the Great Wall to invade the Kin Empire of Northern China. The Kin had about a dozen major cities, all with population in and over hundreds of thousands. They split their forces to attack Korea and the Kin. The Kin emperor didn't have will to spend the full military might of the empire against the Mongols despite the insistence of his generals. The Mongols raided the countryside, attacking, pillaging and ambushing. All this made them seem larger than less than 200000. They took the major cities with deception and cunning and forced the emperor to flee south. In the end, the Mongols conquered Korea, all of Northern China, and learned things like bridge-building and siege warfare. The Mongols sent spies and caravans to learn about the outside world and to conduct trade. They sent envoys to the Khwarzm empire, but the envoys were executed by the emperor, Mohammod. The Mongols declared war and marched against them. That was a repeat of the Kin, except the Mongols had better siege experience. They forced through city walls with trechbuts, deception and driving captives towards the walls to force the surrender of a garrison. When GK died, the Mongols had plundered Northern China, Central Asia and Nothern India. GK successors did even more, taking southern China, Russia, Eastern Europe, the Muslim Caliphate in the Middle East, and the Indus valley.
Julius Caesar would be my choice. Ghengis Khan is up there too, but his empire was destroyed so quickly that I can't put him at #1.
Alexander the Great has to be one of the most overrated generals of all time. He conquered an empire that was already already in its death throws, and his phalanxes that many of you consider "revolutionary" had been developed years before Alexander, and even before his father, King Phillip, began using them. Alexander fought an unorganized, poorly led army that any phalanxes of the time could have defeated.
Alexander the Great has to be one of the most overrated generals of all time. He conquered an empire that was already already in its death throws, and his phalanxes that many of you consider "revolutionary" had been developed years before Alexander, and even before his father, King Phillip, began using them. Alexander fought an unorganized, poorly led army that any phalanxes of the time could have defeated.
Dark Ascendant
Darkness Ascending...
The Mongols were nomads, great conquerors, not administrators. That's why they had Chinese be the clerks and administrators. So, would you like to state why Caesar is a great conqueror? Alexander and Genghis Khan fought and defeated larger and powerful empires(Persia, Kin, Khwarzm), Caesar fought a pack of Gallic barbarians.
Not really. The Chinese definitely staffed most of the lower end admin posts in Yuan China, but the Mongols wouldn't trust them with real power. Most of the admin posts with significance went to Central Asians like Uighurs, or even Europeans, like the Marcos. Just so long it wasn't Chinese.
NewDestroyer
Vegetto
- Joined
- Jan 23, 2003
- Messages
- 406
the ussr wasn't as big as ghengi's empire. They didn't have china, or the middle east. The Mongol's actually created russia from lands they took over.
Sayounara
King
Germany and Japan had the best chance of Conquering the world, they should've stuck with Germany's plan than Japan's plan. Than USA wouldn't develop a nuclear weapon and They would've conquered America.
It was indead comprable, although not as big thats true. russians also had support for its Empire from many world nations (about 1/2). this is becouse they supported those contries with wealth and other needs. these could be assimilated into a bigger communist union, an equivilant to the UN, only stronger.
The kingdoms of novgorod and Kiev existed before the mongols took them over it was a moskovsky (sp?) prince that reunited russa, under his greed.
remmember also the posibility of WWIII.
Dark Ascendant
Darkness Ascending...
That didn't work, Japan's plan didn't work. Do too many things at one time and things don't get done. Wonder what would have happened if the Nazis opened the eastern front and then the Japanese invaded the Far East.
Sayounara
King
Germany knew how to fight Americans which would've help Japan capture Pearl Habour. Japan should've attacked Russia to help Germany like it demanded.
They did; a few years before 1939. But they got trounced so badly by Soviet armor under Zhukov in Mongolia (which was why Zhukov wasn't purged I think), that they made a peace treaty with the Soviets and sticked to it until almost the end of the war (the Soviets broke it and attacked Manchuria per agreement with the other Allies).
By the time the Germans opened a new front against the Russians, the Japanese were heavily engaged in the south anyways - with up to 4/5 of their troops tied in China. And the rest in SE Asia, the Pacific islands, Japan etc.
Dark Ascendant
Darkness Ascending...
Germany and Japan allied with their own seperate agendas. They weren't buddies, just people with the same enemies. The Japanese cdidn't want to attack Russia while they were already in a gurriella war with the Chinese.
*Alexander and Genghis Khan fought and defeated larger and powerful empires(Persia, Kin, Khwarzm), Caesar fought a pack of Gallic barbarians.*-by Dark Ascendant
That "pack of gallic barbarians" that Caesar fought were actually battle hardened fighters that had for years destroyed Roman attempts to colonize the land. The Gauls had fought through years of tribal warfare, knew the terrain, and were brave and courageous. And if you want more proof of Caesar's military accomplishments, look at the Roman Civil War, in which Caesar faced an army double his size, and which was led by one of Rome's most celebrated generals, Pompey the Great. In the battle of Pharsalus, Caesars troops routed Pompeys forces. Also, look at the battle of Alesia, during the Gallic revolt led by Vercingetorix. At Alesia, Caesar faced 2 gallic armies both larger than his. He was forced to construct 2 lines of defenses to protect his army. Completely surrounded, Caesar managed to destroy both of the Gallic armies and put down the rebellion.
That "pack of gallic barbarians" that Caesar fought were actually battle hardened fighters that had for years destroyed Roman attempts to colonize the land. The Gauls had fought through years of tribal warfare, knew the terrain, and were brave and courageous. And if you want more proof of Caesar's military accomplishments, look at the Roman Civil War, in which Caesar faced an army double his size, and which was led by one of Rome's most celebrated generals, Pompey the Great. In the battle of Pharsalus, Caesars troops routed Pompeys forces. Also, look at the battle of Alesia, during the Gallic revolt led by Vercingetorix. At Alesia, Caesar faced 2 gallic armies both larger than his. He was forced to construct 2 lines of defenses to protect his army. Completely surrounded, Caesar managed to destroy both of the Gallic armies and put down the rebellion.
Dark Ascendant
Darkness Ascending...
GK faced longer odds than that, and unlike Caesar, he was the tribal barbarian going to conquer civilized empires. The Mongols had basically nothing except their horses and their weapons and food. No supply lines, not even seige weapons when they took Northern China.
NewDestroyer
Vegetto
- Joined
- Jan 23, 2003
- Messages
- 406
yes ceaser was a better strategist but the topic is who came closer to taking over the world and that by far is ghengis kahn.
Similar threads
