Health? Trade?

[TM Moot]

Whilst I am most excited about the XP I haven't seen much written about Health and/or Trade.

These are two features I think are missing/lacking most in civ5 currently, even more so then religion and espionage (imho ).

Has anyone discovered any new features in G&K's that will enhance or develop these?

 

[Camikaze]

Nothing has been said about health at all. I don't really see that as likely either, because it'd be an entirely new feature that they'd presumably have advertised from the start (and I don't see what place it would take in the game, seeing as the happiness system is what works to limit growth).

Trade hasn't been specifically mentioned either, though there has been a bit said about diplomacy from which you could extrapolate some conclusions (very tenuously).

 

[Androrc the Orc]

I can easily see how health would work in the game. When the DLL is released, it can be modded in with not so much difficulty.

 

[Louis XXIV]

Neither one is particularly necessary in this game. Health would mess up the precarious balance of global happiness. Trade is something I think should be in, although I don't think it should be Civ4's trade. Civ5 can be slow enough without having to calculate traderoutes every single turn. However, connecting roads to CS should give traderoutes. In addition, I could see something like "trade agreements" that gives gold to each side.

 

[TM Moot]

Neither one is particularly necessary in this game.

erm...well neither are religion or espionage in that case, but any new feature will add excitement and interest

Global happiness is a poorly implemented feature, adding Health in some form or other would make city placement important and give buildings and resources much more purpose

Trade, both internal and international, is sorely lacking in civ5, especially as it is so crucial in history

hopefully they'll be a second XP called Doctors and Merchants

 

[Louis XXIV]

My point is religion can enhance the game, corporations even last game seemed kind of tacked on and would definitely feel that way this game. Especially since getting at least a bit of a resource is easier through trade or city-state alliances.

 

[Androrc the Orc]

Corporations perhaps, but health seemed rather well-designed to me.

 

[fat_tonle]

There should be food penalties or unhappiness for modern/industrial era buildings. Factories should have a food penalty or unhappiness penalty. There should be consequences for spamming those kinds of buildings. This would account for health effects without actually having unhealthiness.

Also, how war weariness isn't in the game is beyond me. I am tired of 4000 years of war. Get this in the game and make it add -3 unhappiness after every some odd turns.

 

[Helmling]

While I agree that taking out health was one of the biggest steps backwards in this game (esp. when coupled with the decision to make happiness global, if we can even consider those separate decisions), I can't imagine them retooling the game to reintroduce it.

I agree with Androrc, though. Restoring a good health system should be modded in asap once the code's released.

 

[Louis XXIV]

Corporations perhaps, but health seemed rather well-designed to me.

Well-designed for Civ4 because they had separate mechanics for horizontal and vertical expansion. Civ5 does not do this, one directly impacts the other. Health will encourage small cities and ICS once again.

 

[MoonFlare]

Health can be implemented like global happiness. But it won't be ******** like global happiness.
This is how is should work: every city generates "health +" and "health -" points. Those points form global health for that Civ. But there will be another stat - world health. It will be a sum of global health numbers from every Civ. Nuclear fallout will generate a penalty for global health. If world health will be good - every Civ will receive improved production, hapiness,growth, etc. When it's bad - every Civ will be punished and global warming will turn grasslands and plains into deserts.

 

[joncnunn]

I'm thinking that if they were to put in Health in a future expansion it would be global health on a per city basis.
Pluses would be: Aquaduct, Hospital, Medical Lab, and forest.
Minus would be: population, marsh, jungle, flood plains, factories, and nuclear fall out.
In addition, the University would remove the negative of nearby jungle tiles, and the Dutch UB would remove the negative of nearby marshes.

Effects would be:
Zero or Positive health: No affect other than being added to the GA counter [just like global happiness]
Health between -1 & -9: 10% less population growth per point; and this negative number being added to the GA counter.
Health between -10 & -19: ZPG. 50% chance of a random tile within your civ getting struck by global warming per turn.
Health -20 or worse: One random tile within your civ gets struck by global warming per turn.

Health can be implemented like global happiness. But it won't be ******** like global happiness.
This is how is should work: every city generates "health +" and "health -" points. Those points form global health for that Civ. But there will be another stat - world health. It will be a sum of global health numbers from every Civ. Nuclear fallout will generate a penalty for global health. If world health will be good - every Civ will receive improved production, hapiness,growth, etc. When it's bad - every Civ will be punished and global warming will turn grasslands and plains into deserts.

 

[jdog5000]

Health in CivIV was a way of limiting growth in a city until certain infrastructure buildings were built (and happiness was a second, stronger version of this). City growth limits are fairly foundational to overall pacing, not something to be added for the fun or wow element ... so my bet is they'd only go that way for an expansion if there was some real problem identified in pacing. Plus, they have the buildings already (aqueduct, hospital) doing things which boost city population, so health is already in the game in that sense.

So is there some other reasonably realistic way to represent health and sanitation that's also fun?

 

[thadian]

wow i am so suprised. when civ4 BTS came out, i thought about all the "new features" that were imported from Civ3 complete that was missing from vanilla.

They waste time and money, rebuilding the same game - literally, each civ is just a naked, plucked down vanilla version of itself, that in its expansions, will re-add what the expansions from the other civ games added. then they will say it is new. ohh, espionage i havent seen that before. should have been in the game to begin with, this sham was concocted beforehand. Oh and while the re-write civ3 complete and BTS back into the game, they can fix their graphics. the inside of my very nice computer temps at 160 and runs like its about to burn out.

I just bought SKYRIM from STEAM and it runs a lot smoother than Civ 5. Of all things, i run skyrim with HD pack on highest settings - and i run just fine. On the same computer, civ5 runs like jack crap, takes 11 mins between turns and crashes badly, like you just got sub-seven hit type of crash. this is on all the lowest settings. interesting how they build this game. First, they look at older civ games, and ask what a complete game looks like. then they remove all of its content to sell later, and release vanilla version - but first they make sure that it runs badly enough to shut down the wal-mart supercomputer then the content they DO release is not even as good as what modders make.

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[Louis XXIV]

I think growth bonuses work effectively as a way to represent it. So things like Aqueducts and Hospitals doing what they currently do.

I understand it could allow trade value for bonus resources, but I think that only has so much applicability.