How Are You Liking The Barbarians Game Mode?

[Linklite]

Here's a question: suppose there was a message from Firaxis saying, "We intended to have the barbarians mode for you in February, but playtesting shows it has several problems, so we are holding it back to April". What would your reaction be? Would you rather have the buggy version now or the polished version after a two-month wait?

Honestly? It wouldn't have bothered me. I got excited once they actually told me what it was - telling me that I'd get an extra mode in April wouldn't have bothered me at all. I recognise that my reaction may not have been universal though.

 

[Hakan-i Cihan]

It's possible that neither had a tile with an appropriate map condition. This would include all the normal conditions that govern camp spawns in the base game.

Yes, you are right. After adapting map settings for more desert and jungle tiles, the jungle and chariot clans appeared. But they are both very rare.

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

Yes, you are right. After adapting map settings for more desert and jungle tiles, the jungle and chariot clans appeared. But they are both very rare.

You are right. The thing is both of those need two different conditions, unlike the others, which makes them more rare.
Jungle clan needs both rainforests and ivory near by while chariot clan needs both horses and desert.

 

[Hakan-i Cihan]

Here's a question: suppose there was a message from Firaxis saying, "We intended to have the barbarians mode for you in February, but playtesting shows it has several problems, so we are holding it back to April". What would your reaction be? Would you rather have the buggy version now or the polished version after a two-month wait?

I can play it now, but could have waited for april too. The issues with the game mode are not that problematic. Some of us are only pointing things out, so that those issues will be ironed out.

 

[chazzycat]

I have played a couple games in this mode now, and it seems like mostly a "more city states" mode than anything else. More city states makes the game easier for the human player so this is another "-1 difficulty" mode.

How the barbs transform into city states seems too passive IMO. Maybe the player should have to make some kind of small effort or sacrifice to make this happen, not just happen automatically. Send them a trade route or something, I dunno.

 

[Linklite]

I have played a couple games in this mode now, and it seems like mostly a "more city states" mode than anything else. More city states makes the game easier for the human player so this is another "-1 difficulty" mode.

How the barbs transform into city states seems too passive IMO. Maybe the player should have to make some kind of small effort or sacrifice to make this happen, not just happen automatically. Send them a trade route or something, I dunno.

Maybe the passive progress can be altered to be different for different camps or something. I like some popping up into CSs near the beginning, but it would be better if there were some that don't change until later.

 

[Zyxpsilon]

One indirect solution for the crazy overload of CS would be to use a new SPY ability.. instead of just "Foment Unrest" and/or "Fabricate Scandal" -- they'd be able to revert the targeted CS back into its previous Barbarian Camp state as it once was?!
Heck, even the Religious Priests could be associated to such re(de-)volutionary mindsets of the Locals, etc.

All we'd need is a feedback ID tag (on CS banners?) that points at the previous Barb status.

 

[Nerevatar]

I wonder if it's not due to total clan names, but the number of clan names per type of clan. If a camp spawns on a map condition area where there have already been six named clans (since each clan type has six names), would they then just spawn as normal camps. I'm assuming that each name is unique and cannot be reused. Or, maybe the name can be reused only if the previous named clan has converted to a CS.

Some observations about camps being normal:
It is not related to the number of types currently active. In my game I got 10 clans. 3 of them are Melee Open, 1 is Melee Hills, 1 is Cavalry Open and 4 is Naval. There is 6 of each types. The normal camp should have been Melee Open. Then I did a quick test game where I removed all but 1 Melee Open clan from the XML, which resulted in 4 normal clans on turn 10. I undid the removal of the clans and then reload the quicksave from turn 1, and I got outposts in the same spots, but this time with proper names. So this seems to confirm that there can only ever exists one of each clan, and once a clan type has been used up and the game decides to spawn one of that kind, it becomes a normal camp.

Also of note: All screenshots I have seen and from my own game, these normal camps have no units in them. So the bug affecting them is also affecting the unit spawning. They are very much broken.

 

[Linklite]

Some observations about camps being normal:
It is not related to the number of types currently active. In my game I got 10 clans. 3 of them are Melee Open, 1 is Melee Hills, 1 is Cavalry Open and 4 is Naval. There is 6 of each types. The normal camp should have been Melee Open. Then I did a quick test game where I removed all but 1 Melee Open clan from the XML, which resulted in 4 normal clans on turn 10. I undid the removal of the clans and then reload the quicksave from turn 1, and I got outposts in the same spots, but this time with proper names. So this seems to confirm that there can only ever exists one of each clan, and once a clan type has been used up and the game decides to spawn one of that kind, it becomes a normal camp.

Also of note: All screenshots I have seen and from my own game, these normal camps have no units in them. So the bug affecting them is also affecting the unit spawning. They are very much broken.

So, if I want to maximise the number of CSs, no clearing camps. Annoying. I hope it's an oversight and they fix it, I like the idea of there not being a fixed number.

On the other, they go crazy with with CSs. Looks like they've spawned at least 17 in my standard map so far, potentially more.

 

[blackbutterfly]

...so this is another "-1 difficulty" mode.

Perhaps paired with a +1 difficulty mode (i.e. Dramatic Ages) it makes for a fresh yet challenging game

I really like being able to hire units. It's a very different playstyle. It's like playing as Hungary except instead of leveraging city state units with your gold you hire barb mercenaries. Trade your strategics for gold and buy strategic units off barbs.

You can even get musket men and frigates even before you've teched Gunpowder.

BTW try the TSL maps if you don't want them to turn into city states.

 

[TreVor_ish]

Dramatic Ages+Barbarian Clans = Map full of Free Cities and City-States

 

[Nerevatar]

So this seems to confirm that there can only ever exists one of each clan, and once a clan type has been used up and the game decides to spawn one of that kind, it becomes a normal camp.

On the bright side, this was very easy to fix. For those interested in not getting normal (bugged) camps, please download the fix here: https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2412130013

Limitations:

1. There is still a cap, it is just 3 times as large. So the chance of it happening should be very slim.
2. Names and icons are reused. For example: It is possible (but unlikely) to have two Yellow Goat clans in the game at the same time.
3. This can be loaded into an existing game and will help with future camps. Existing camps which have been broken is not affected.

 

[Greywulf]

I'm just so grateful that the Devs finally did this, and I can't imagine myself going back to playing without this mode switched on. Before this I almost always had the barbs turned off, as I was unhappy with how they worked in the game in the past, and so decided to play without them until they were significantly improved. Now that they have been significantly improved, I'm pretty certain I'll always have barbarians turned on from now on.

Thank you again to the Devs for doing this! You guys are awesome!!

 

[CoconutTank]

I haven't finished my rough rider session with Barb Clans mode yet, but I've been having a good time nonetheless

So far the part I've enjoyed most is being able to hire a Warrior for 95 gold, which sure beats buying a warrior for 180 good normally. Having twice as many Warriors as normal helps a lot with early warring. Hoping to hire Dromons sometime!

Being able to decide where I want new city states to go (for the most part) has been an amusing exercise. I don't want the city states too close, otherwise they grow into my own territory, but I want them close enough for trading. Hopefully the clans can be close enough to other civs, so that when they become city states, I can levy and war with them easily.

 

[iammaxhailme]

Is it just me, or does coastal raiding do absolutely nothing?

 

[aieeegrunt]

Here's a question: suppose there was a message from Firaxis saying, "We intended to have the barbarians mode for you in February, but playtesting shows it has several problems, so we are holding it back to April". What would your reaction be? Would you rather have the buggy version now or the polished version after a two-month wait?

That which is done well is done fast enough

Haste is not speed

 

[earlofbrigand]

I like the idea but it needs a few tweaks. One problem is that the AI keeps removing their camps and they become a bit of a non issue quite quickly. So I'd like to see the much maligned slider to give you a bit of choice as to how strong they are (irrespective of game difficulty). I'd also like to see them regen in new regions if they get killed off too quickly.

 

[Aussie_Lurker]

I have played a couple games in this mode now, and it seems like mostly a "more city states" mode than anything else. More city states makes the game easier for the human player so this is another "-1 difficulty" mode.

How the barbs transform into city states seems too passive IMO. Maybe the player should have to make some kind of small effort or sacrifice to make this happen, not just happen automatically. Send them a trade route or something, I dunno.

Which is why I want some City-States to independantly begin or become hostile towards Major Civilizations-forcing you to overcome that hostility before you can even start using Envoys on them for usual Diplomatic Purposes.

 

[Chris41336]

Which is why I want some City-States to independantly begin or become hostile towards Major Civilizations-forcing you to overcome that hostility before you can even start using Envoys on them for usual Diplomatic Purposes.

They should just become free cities until and unless specific criteria are met.

 

[iammaxhailme]

After a couple of games I have to say the mode is not quite as interesting as I had hoped. Apart from occaisonally getting a unique unit from a camp, and seeing LOTS of city states placed really badly on the north/south pole, it's basically just a regular game