How do I spring back?

[Taras Bulba]

NOTICE!!!!! If you open the save, you probably don't need to read the background at all!!!!! I just hope the attachment works ok

This is sort of a surprising past two days for me. I was playing the EFZI 2 game, and I was playing at a higher difficultly level then my usual not-mod playing difficulty. When I started a new game, I did a random huge map (roaming barbs) and I opened up the screen and saw I was playing at Emperor for that game (I usually play at regent where I have seem to be stuck for the last while)

Anyway, I thought it might be interesting to start an Emperor game just for fun, figuring I would do horrible and quit not long after the start. I select random civ with about 10 AI (as I worried about too much competition) I turned off Domination victory and cultural connection start and start the game. (note this is Civ III Complete) I start out as England on a tile that doesn't seem to be what I want, so I do something quite unorthodox and move from a river tile to a non-river tile, in order to keep the ocean connection for my capital, maximize river commerce bonus, and capitalize on the adjacent tiles (bonus grassland/resources etc...) I figured that outweighed the price of an Aqueduct (which I may have been wrong, but I seemed to fair ok. As I continued on, I seemed to be rather slow in keeping up with the AI tech wise (I never was the farthest behind, but usually about 4th)

I originally tried the Republic slingshot, but I failed because I needed to research Philosophy as soon as possible in order to make sure I got it, and then used philosophy to snag Map Making (in order to get galleys to spread farther) I found all the neighbors on my continent, and tried to maintain peace as I was expanding. Luckily, despite me falling behind the tech race, I did manage to grab Literature first which gave me the necessary boost in order to the the Great Library. My tech research was halted for the time being, and I rode the backs of the AI, which worried me, as I was on a continent with 4 other AI (I then realized I chose too few enemies). To shear dumb luck, I managed to send a successful suicide curragh (yes curragh) across the ocean (for 5 turns in dangerous waters!) to make contact with 3 more civilizations (which were relatively weak and being dominated by the powerhouse on that continent, the Inca).

As time progressed, I realized to my shock that no one had built the SoZ, so I grabbed that too, which helped my military out alot. However, once that was built, I reached a stop to my expansion, which was depressing, as I wasn't able to grab as much as I would've liked. However, I maintained my dominance over my continent as many tribes were warring as I built up my power. Defending myself against minor skirmishes and occasionally gaining a few cities, but mostly trying to maintain my neutrality for now, I did little but protect myself. I soon realized that with my huge economy from my lack of tech-research and being in a Republic, I could support a larger army. I started building knights, and attacked my neighbors, but was pushed back. I had to buy my way (with alot of my efforts) to Military Tradition, to then try and find some trading partner for gunpowder. It came later than I would've liked, but I got one, upgraded and quickly produced a massive invasion force and sent them in on a blitzkrieg into France. It was very successful. I lost only 4-5 Cavalry and conquered about 7-8ish cities (the rest of what they had) in about 5-6 turns. France was gone.

My next target, which was my neighbor to the north, was Japan. They had alot of territory that I wanted to expand into, and I wanted to only be facing enemies on 1 side. I tried to attack, but RIGHT as I attacked, they finally upgraded to musketmen, and my upper divisions blitzkrieg was halted, as I didn't have cannon to back it up, and my lower army was bogged down carring alot of cannon, and it then took (and wiped out) the blunt of the Japanese army. I settled for taking 1 "useless" city and one city connecting 2 gems, and the terms of peace came soon after, getting me another useless city. Those terms of peace were forced though, as the more threatening issue was to the south, the Chinese. They RoP raped me and tried to take 2 of my southern most French conquered cities, but my defenders held them off. Then the massive invasion force came in, and I barely got enough Cavalry in there in time and the cannon there in time to wipe out their force. The counter attack was swift and just. The Chinese are not currently a problem, and I'm still at war and conquering fast (perhaps too fast for my own good, as a new growing power loomed just beyond them... Spain)

HOWEVER... this is not where my problem occurs. Over in the other continent, the Inca have brought total destruction to their continent. They pushed the poor Portugese to a small useless one-city island, before declaring peace. The Mongols barely made peace before they were wiped out, but the Hitties were not as lucky. The Hitties died, and the Mayans were next. The Mayans, the second most powerful (and heavily aided by me granting techs/resources to them in order for their survival) lost several cities (and a source of gunpowder) to the Inca. The next logical step for the Inca was the Romans... the only ones left. The Romans were crushed.... utterly crushed. Despite me granting them about 9 techs, the Mayans trading them gunpowder, me trading them horses (they have Military Tradition) they still die a quick and horrible death. The only good thing about that death is the fact that I run in and place 1 city on that continent grabbing 2 sources of wines, a much needed luxury.

This is where my problem comes in. The Inca have gotten too powerful, but I have NO chance in beating them in open war and the only reason why I haven't been one of their targets is the fact I'm trading them about 3-4 luxuries for their gpt. Their rampage mustn't go unlooked though. The Mongols have no hope, and once the Inca declare war on them, they're gone. The Mayans have little to no chance too, and they are currently being re-attacked and losing more ground. The Inca are far surpassed me as the greatest nation on the Earth, however I have maintained a fair second place. To some CRAZY chance, I managed to jump ahead in the tech race, grabbing Medicine, Electricity, and Theory of Evolution before the AI (who grabed Nationalism, Steam Power, Industrialization, The Cooporation, Communism, Facism, and now Spain has Refining before me) but my charge to Theory of Evolution grabbed me the ToE wonder from a pre-build, jumping the gun all the way to Electronics. With my new techs, I got Nationalism and up to Cooporation (no Commy/Fascism) With a scientific leader I rushed Universal Suffrage (shocking, I know, since I can build Hoover Dam) in order to decrease war weariness in my horribly wear Republic (from China) and to steal it from Spain and the Inca, who both have more wonders than me (and Cuzco is more cultural than London) I am building Hoover Dam, and will almost definately get it before the AI, as they don't have Atomic Theory (to my knowledge) London will soon have the Great Library, SoZ, Smiths Trading Co. (forgot to mention I grabbed that too), Universal Suffrage, and Hoover Dam. (ToE went to a near-by core city from a Palace pre-build)

How might I come back against the Inca, or even regain the continent. Right now a cultural or diplomatic victory look impossible, as my culture is too much weaker for a come-back, and my relations are very poor with the few nations left. Space Race victory looks like the BEST option, as militarily I won't conquer Inca any time soon.

I know I need LOTS of more workers to build my new railroads, but my army cost was going WAY up, and when I reached my maximum expasion I had alot of workers, so I started joining them to cities to decrease units and increase city size for more metros. Now its haunting me with the newly conquered territories.

ANY help would be nice, right now I just don't want to LOSE this game if it isn't already lost. I was shocked I got this far soo well (or well for me) and I don't want it to end now that I am sort of grid-locked against the Inca


PS-I hope this attachment works

 

[vmxa]

Three things to consider:

1) never join workers before Steam, except for a wonder city
2) never trade more than 1 lux to any strong AI
3) beware the run away AI on continents map

It is not uncommon at Emperor or higher to see one AI take over its land mass, when the human is not on it. This poses a problem in that culture loss is possible.

For now you probably need to get out of any lux deals as soon as they expire or sooner. You are making it easy for them to do research with those lux. Get your borders railed, if you have to pump out more workers do it.

Look close at the army and see if you can disband stuff. All regulars can go, all units that need upgrading other than knight to cav should be considered.

Get all the land in your continent now. Once you have rails to the key cities and can get to most coastal areas, look to get Inca to declare on you. You need to slow them down.

They will send landing parties that you can use to generate leaders. Get armies up for an invasion. If you cannot hold your towns over there gift them or abandon them at the fist threat.

Get to flight so you can airlift. When you are ready look for another civ, if any are left to take down for your foot hold. Once you get some armies up, you can get them to spend most of their attackers on your beach head.

Then use armies to raze raze raze.

 

[Spoonwood]

1) never join workers before Steam, except for a wonder city

*Scratches head* I can't remember a game where I haven't joined workers before Steam Power. I usually join them in the high middle ages. However, I think VMXA means to say make sure you have enough workers once you get Steam Power (and have coal and iron). I usually have at least one if not two or three 2-turn worker pumps.

2) never trade more than 1 lux to any strong AI

I also have a hard time remembering where I haven't traded away at least most of my extra luxuries for more cash. Maybe the AIs will have an extra tile or two worked due to such a luxury, but with how much the AIs water, I don't see this all too much more production. With a careful use of artillery and a conservative use of your units, I don't think think an extra unit more to kill of an AI will make things too much more difficult either... especially since you have more money to buy units.

You are making it easy for them to do research with those lux.

I don't see a research problem in his game. He has a nice tech lead.

 

[vmxa]

I fail to see any way that trading 4 lux to a top AI civ can fail to help them in their game and their research. That one is way ahead in techs does not alter that one iota.

They will otherwise use many jokers and get nothing from them. The lux provide by the player lets those jokers go back to producing. How is that good for the player?

We are not talking about 1 extra citizen working here, that is FOUR lux. That is going to be a big boost. It is not a question of if it is a game turning deal, it is just a bad idea for nearly every game. I have never done it and I never will. I say again do not trade multiple lux to anyone nation, if it is rank above you or very near you.

Edit:
I pulled up the save and he does not have a big tech lead. He does not really even have a tech lead. He got AT and Elec from the ToE. That is what he has on Spain, who has refine on him. Inca is down those two and Corp. Of course both have researched Commie and Fascism. So it looks to me like he is not out researching them at all.

Edit2:
I see England does 557bpt and I would put Inca at around 800bpt maybe down as low as 750bpt.

Edit3:
I would at least up the slider another notch. A little deficit research will not hurt as you have cash.

 

[DWetzel]

I often trade luxes to the AI for gpt, gold, luxes, or techs. I can't recall ever giving one four at once, but that's only because I'm rarely in a position where I have four luxes that another civ wants AND they have something worth it. But two is pretty common.

Sure, it improves that civ, but that CAN be a good thing in many circumstances (specifically, being a good trading partner); you can also choose not to continue those every 20 turns if things are getting out of hand.

It works well if you want a strong trading partner, or don't mind the civ coming in 3rd/4th position catching up to 2nd. It's sort of the same principle as tech trades: sure, they improve, but you still improve over everyone not involved in the trade, so on balance it's a good thing.

 

[vmxa]

Trading at emperor or better is going to be a one way street after the early game. You either trade to weak sisters and I am fine with that, I said no to strong ones. Else it will be lop sided in their favor.

When you are giving 2 lux, you are not getting two back, unless it is some xCC game. So they gained more than you. In techs it is more of the same. The thing is that players that can make good trades are not posting emperor games looking for help.

So telling them to make multiple lux deals with the top dog, is not going to work in their favor. As you know you gain more than a one for one happy factor with markets and the AI will have markets in its cities at that stage.

Inca has a massive amount of land, so I would not be surprised if they already had 4 lux of their own. He only is showing trading 2, so they probably have 6. Those two lux gave them 6 extra happy faces in each market.

They are not going to be a good trading partner anyway, they will soon want to go after your continent. They are not far from owning theirs. They see you as weak and will not be afraid.

 

[Spoonwood]

I fail to see any way that trading 4 lux to a top AI civ can fail to help them in their game and their research. That one is way ahead in techs does not alter that one iota.

They will otherwise use many jokers and get nothing from them. The lux provide by the player lets those jokers go back to producing. How is that good for the player.

You get more gold for more research or more units. Also, if it picks up the tech pace, that's fine. For most conquest or domination games with max opponents, the sooner you get to Military Tradition the better. The sooner you get to Industrialization, the faster you can train armies. The sooner you get to Replacable Parts (ala Moonsinger), the better your artillery. Granted this may have its limits when the AIs can quickly build bombers and you don't want them to get there, but in general, a slower tech pace has at least as many disadvantages as advantages. And you also have to know how to use armies and artillery well I guess.

That is going to be a big boost. It is not a question of if it is a game turning deal, it is just a bad idea for nearly every game. I have never done it and I never will.

If you haven't done it, then you simply don't know how well you would do if you did.

I pulled up the save and he does not have a big tech lead. He does not really even have a tech lead. He got AT and Elec from the ToE. That is what he has on Spain, who has refine on him. Inca is down those two and Corp. Of course both have researched Commie and Fascism. So it looks to me like he is not out researching them at all.

He has a tech lead. He just trades Atomic Theory for Refining and he has Electronics on them. He may not have out commerced them, but with Theory of Evolution that doesn't really matter now, does it?

You really do need more workers in this game. If you're not going for metros in this game, then you would have done better to get some more shields out of some of your size 12 cities a lot earlier. I saw a few cities at size 12 with 5 or so extra food. You can often mine or forest for more shields in such a situation.

 

[Spoonwood]

The Inca don't pose a problem in the tech race of this game. The luxuries did not make them into the tech superpower (in this game). Diplomatic in this game should work out fairly simply... just don't research Replacable Parts... trade for it. Beeline to Motorized Trasportation, then back for Flight if not learned by Spain yet, Fission and then build the U. N., and then get military alliances against the Inca 1 turn before you finish the U. N. Pay whatever you have to pay in order to get them... turn research to 0 and give them as much gpt as they want for the alliance. Space would require more effort. You have a fair amount of cash that you could probably do all science and luxury for the rest of the game, especially if you sell some tech for gpt.

 

[Taras Bulba]

The thing about the trades with the Inca are that they are a large source of my income ATM. One trade I believe is running at like 97 gpt IIRC. Not to mention my one city on their contient would SURELY die unless I pumped it FULL of Infantry (that is if I get to Replaceable Parts any time soon) I was hoping to get to Flight before I declare war, so I can send troops over en mass very quickly. My navy is non-existant, so I doubt I'd be able to destroy their forces over the water and out of the 4 Man-o-Wars I built, 2 died from attacking regular caravels, and another died from a regular privateer (all vets.) I think I may have 1 left.

And if I lose that city on their continent, I lose a source of 2 wines, which would lose me another luxury. I need all the ones I can get

Not to mention it would take forever to get good peace terms, as I am soo much weaker than them. War Weariness (despite me grabbing Universal Suffrage) would destroy my nation, I'd need to go into communism (which I'd have to buy) or Monarchy which would take turns of anarchy. Should I try to conquer the continent, get Replaceable parts, and flight and THEN attack the Inca? I'm afraid if I wait until then, it'll just be me vs. them.

 

[Bowsling]

I have not looked at the save, but I'd go for communism. You sound like a pretty big empire, plus no war weariness and draft rate for emergencies would really help. A tech lead which it sounds like you have means you can buy communism for something unimportant.

 

[Taras Bulba]

I have not looked at the save, but I'd go for communism. You sound like a pretty big empire,

well, I'm the second biggest, but the Inca are probably over double my size right now

plus no war weariness and draft rate for emergencies would really help.

no war weariness is the key factor. Drafting isn't the best of things to use at higher levels IIRC. That causes citizens to riot a lot

A tech lead which it sounds like you have means you can buy communism for something unimportant.

well... unfortuantely the only tech I can really afford to trade is Atomic Theory. If I trade it, I'd rather trade it for refining, however I probably would be able to get Communism too

I'm sorry I can't post some screen shots. I guess I could, but that would take a long time. As right now, this computer is the only one that has internet, and the computer that has Civ III on it is not connected. The hassle isn't worth the effort.

 

[Spoonwood]

You can trade The Corporation to the Inca. With Spain you can only trade Atomic Theory.

 

[Bowsling]

Drafting isn't the best of things to use at higher levels IIRC. That causes citizens to riot a lot

I meant in case of emergency, for example if the Inca get near the city with wines.

 

[vmxa]

Culture
Inca 61406
Liz 34958

Spoonwood "You get more gold for more research or more units. Also, if it picks up the tech pace, that's fine. For most conquest or domination games with max opponents, the sooner you get to Military Tradition the better. The
sooner you get to Industrialization, the faster you can train armies. The sooner you get to Replacable Parts (ala Moonsinger), the better your artillery. Granted this may have its limits when the AIs can quickly build
bombers and you don't want them to get there, but in general, a slower tech pace has at least as many disadvantages as advantages. And you also have to know how to use armies and artillery well I guess."

I do not want to pick up the tech pace, I want to slow it down. I want to be making more beakers than anyone so I am the tech leader at some point. The sooner that point comes, to stay, the better. If the game finds us both
in the middle of the IA, it gets much harder to deal with a strong AI.

They will have bombers to make my invasion much tougher. They may have rails up in lots of places to allow them to try to swamp my landing. Now if all the nations on the other land stay more less equal, then it is not so bad. That is not what we have here.

Now if you are going for UN or Space, maybe that tactic will work, maybe not from this point in this game. You already have made enemies that are likely to be around at vote time. Inca will not have a lot of long time foes
as they are going to be or already are dead.

Space is shaking for someone that is not experienced at this point. You also are exposed to a culture loss here as Liz is bent on fighting Isabella. The only one that Inca has not doubled in culture.

Liz has a massive amount of land that is under others control. It is full of tiles with no roads, so will be hard to take and hard to defend. It is reasonable to think that Inca will be able to invade one of these poor
sisters, unless Liz helps them. If they get on the continent, it could be a problem.

I would agree that the sooner I get to MT the better, not the sooner we get to IA. I want to get to MT and them not. One way to do that is to keep them on a war footing. Not required, but useful.

"He has a tech lead. He just trades Atomic Theory for Refining and he has Electronics on them. He may not have out commerced them, but with Theory of Evolution that doesn't really matter now, does it?"

This started out with him having a big tech lead now it is one tech. I am not fond of trading 9330 beaker tech for 7465 beaker tech. I may do it, but it will find its way to Inca and help them get into the next age.

The AI will ignore AT and Elec and head for the military techs once you have them or the Hoovers is built, till they have only those to get for the next age. This means bombers and tanks sooner.

I may go ahead with the deal and hope I can kill Spain, before they peddles AT. I am not sure. Anyway Inca makes about 250bpt more than Liz and will overhaul her in tech, unless something is done. My point was that you are not really a tech leader if you are slower at research than the other guy and only got those two tech from a wonder.

"The luxuries did not make them into the tech superpower (in this game)."

Never said it did, but it helped them a lot.

 

[vmxa]

Taras Bulba "The thing about the trades with the Inca are that they are a large source of my income ATM. One trade I believe is running at like 97 gpt IIRC. Not to mention my one city on their contient would SURELY die unless I pumped it FULL of Infantry (that is if I get to Replaceable Parts any time soon) I was hoping to get to Flight before I declare war, so I can send troops over en mass very quickly. My navy is non-existant, so I doubt I'd be able to destroy their forces over the water and out of the 4 Man-o-Wars I built, 2 died from attacking regular caravels, and another died from a regular privateer (all vets.) I think I may have 1 left."

I have not been able to look over the game in detail, but you have 5 home grown lux, why is that not plenty? The loss of grapes is not a big deal and probably going to happen anyway fairly soon. You can trade the one lux for the 99gpt and that is fine. It is the second lux that I would not make.

You are looking at it like my ole lady. She see a sale and thinks I can save 50 bucks, not that she cannot afford to spend the money right now. It may be a good deal, but it helps them at a time when you need to slow them down as much as you can.

You are running 30% lux on top of having 6 lux? That seems like a heck of a lot.

How do you expect to fly over mass numbers? You would need need mass airfields and that would need mass numbers of workers, do you have them, nope.

"And if I lose that city on their continent, I lose a source of 2 wines, which would lose me another luxury. I need all the ones I can get

Not to mention it would take forever to get good peace terms, as I am soo much weaker than them. War Weariness (despite me grabbing Universal Suffrage) would destroy my nation, I'd need to go into communism (which I'd have to buy) or Monarchy which would take turns of anarchy. Should I try to conquer the continent, get Replaceable parts, and flight and THEN attack the Inca? I'm afraid if I wait until then, it'll just be me vs. them."

I just posted in a thread that I picked up at 16xxAD and was in Republic. I essentially played the rest till I killed off all and had 2 or 3 lux to start. No US for some time. I am not sure why it should be a huge issue. True the other govs would be less WW issues.

Commie would be a big problem right now, look at CAII it is the poorer of the three choices. It has another major problem in that it use pop to rush things. You would be -20gpt and only 241 beakers per turn.

I looked at just a few towns it is about what I see so often in these games. Cities are chucked full of structures. Dinky little towns that will not do anything productive are building temples or have granaries already and on and on. To the tune of -238gpt.

Way too few workers, too few towns with too many dead tiles.

Pull up F1 and scroll down the list.
Temple 6
Lib 9
uni 9
Factory 4
Troops 9
Granary 2
bank 5
cath 5

I may not have this count perfect, but pretty close. You have 59 towns. Why would you make a granary at this stage? You have 6 lux and are running 30% lux, why would you build temples in tiny towns? Many are on a hill with mountains or other crap land, so they are not even going to get much bigger.

Uni going up in towns with 6 beakers. You get the idea, these are not good investments and this is why you are stuck with a massive maint bill. Less of this stuff and more towns down in the same amount of land, would have gone a long way to seeing you in better shape.

Hope it goes well.

 

[vmxa]

Taras Bulba, BTW the way I can never hear that name without thinking of Yul Brenner.

I took a longer look at the save and here is what I see. Note it does not include any considerations of trades. You may have some decent options there. I always felt that trading with the AI is like playing cards with 6 year old's. It just is not fair, but some times we do it.

Lets see what is going on first. We do not have Salt, so cannot make cavs. We are down Refine, but are up AT and Elec. We have 10 turns to RP. I will say I would have bee lined for RP and not the ToE.

You want to get to infantry and artillery. You also really want to faster workers. You can still get the ToE as any prebuild still works. You just need to get the tech, in time to switch the build. In the mean time RP lets you
get rails up faster and increase the shields in the wonder city.

You are at war with China. They too have Salt not very far away. The position I take on it is that, I prefer to leave China in place for now as they are a buffer with Spain. I would rather switch to Japan as they are behind
me and have a lot more land. Not only that, but the salt is close.

I see a starving size 12, not a good thing. The builds are not going to be very helpful now or even down the road in many towns. Slider is at 30 for lux, science is 50%.

We have so much space that could be filled and do not have a single settler nor any in production?

Toyama: switch to settler. Sell Lib, you get 1 beaker, what is 50% of one rounded down? Need to irrigate the cow. I presume you did not mine those hills as shields will be lost.

Sado: switch to wealth and turn the citizen into a beaker head. Nothing gained here by trying to add a few more pop, nor building things. It is poorly placed next to the volcano.

Orkley: switch cathedral to aqua. This place could be a full sized farm. Sell Lib, same story 1 net beaker for life here. I will sell the temple once we can get a few specialist up.

Cherbourg: switch the temple to an explorer as that is the only means to get any of the shields already invested. Sell Lib and barracks. Switch pop to beaker head. Barracks is of no use here. I would not let anyone get to the point where they could attack the town anyway. Nothing there to upgrade. You will not be able to afford to upgrade the lone cannon.

Grenoble: switch lib to worker. Sell temple and rax. Yes you have a rifle here, but you also have rails. You can send the rifle off to be upgrade when the time is right, if ever.

Tours: making a bank, nice. Oh the town makes zero gold you say. Well whats 160 turns to build a bank that will cost maint. The town must be run my socialist as it has Rax/Temple/Market/Lib/Aqua. Not bad for a zero growth
size 2 town. I know you did not build all that stuff, but you did not sell any of it either and are trying to add to it?

Sell all that I can. I reluctantly switch to harbor. I was about to make it a worker, but with the aqua here I go with the food.

The Mumbles: switch cathedral to market. I move pop on Portsmouth to free up tiles for Mumbles so it can grow faster. Later can give tiles back. Sell walls, lib, temple and barracks. Size 7, so walls not useful now.
Move citizen off mountain to grass. Now +3 food and got back the lost beaker. Move joker to grass +4 food.

Belfast: switch aqua to treb. Size 2, no food. No harbor either and I would not invest in one in a corrupt town. I take the two pop and make them scientist and will let town starve to size one. The one will be a scientist for the rest of the game. Now I get 3 beakers instead.

It is losing 3gpt, so I sell Lib and temple so now it is -1gpt. After this turn it will go to wealth and not cost anything.

That is a run down on the border with Japan. Gold was 2463 now 2713 46gpt now 61gpt.

Now a look at the Chinese border.

Kuala Lumpur: switch to worker. Sell granary and some other building. Send a regular spear from Bordeaux over to be disbanded to rush worker. I have no use for regular spears in Republic gov at this stage of the game.

Maybe not at any stage. I send the other to Chinan.

I do not know how long this war has been going on nor how we stand. IOW I am unclear as to continue it or switch to Japan. Given that the salt is Kaifeng and that area can be cutoff, I will go for it. Once that is secured, make peace.

I see a cav was left out to die at 1 HP.

Tatung: switch Lib to wealth.

Paoting: switch to wealth. It was a close call what to do here, but Temple in 57 more turns will not matter.

Chinan: switch the Lib to a wall. Yet another lib going in 80 turns in a 1 beaker town. Sell harbor as there is enough grass to feed the place. Debate on the market and may yet sell it.

 

[vmxa]

Now the rest. I am not going to list every change, just a few to highlight some points.

Amiens: switch to wealth and put the lone pop as scientist, here after refer to as BH (beaker head).

Birmingham: I switch to 90% research and zero lux. This may not stand, but I want to see what is really needed. Looking at the town at 50%, it has no need of the uni going up. At 90 it is marginally ok. The granary is of no real use, unless you plan on making settlers or workers here. Not a good plan if you want all those multiplier building.

The town is not growing at size 5. What is 50% of zero again? Sell it and the temple and the barracks. Not going to build troops here. We will get it growing eventually, but are way to short on workers to do anything about it now.

Sell granary in any town not growing or already size 12.
sell walls in size 7 or in places that will not come under attack.
Sell libs if less than 4 beakers net.
sell barracks if not going to make troops here, due to A) lack of shields B) cannot afford the upkeep for the troops.
Sell harbors if not use coastal tiles.
Stop any build that meets above.

Need to get rails to borders and to find some workers to improve top cities and no growth towns.

Paris: switch from FP to a settler. Need to not wait 67 more turns for the FP.

Newcastle was to going to switch to FP in 2, but it has corrupt shields. Switch to factory instead. Not going to need many banks. Well may need them, but hope to run low in the tax slider.

Canterbury: switch it to FP. I hated to let go of the cav, but FP is more important and is 10 turns.

Bristol: this is painful. Making a uni with 154 shields in it now. Bristol is size 4 tundra with no growth and no harbor. Why it even has a lib is my question. It has a temple too of course. Best I can do is switch to a rifle and lose the 74 shields. Sell the structures. I put all pop on BH and let it starve to size 1.

Leicester: another example of not looking at the town and just building what seems like good idea. It is making a cathedral, but with lux slider at zero, it is happy. Only 1 unhappy citizen, so why do I want blow 160 shields and 2gpt maint?

Not only that, but a granary was just complete 5 turns before or was started when the town was not growing. Either way it is size 7 and no extra food to grow, but a granary was built. Yes we can get it grown, but not for right away as we do not have the workers.

Anyway, why do I want to spent shields to speed up the growth of a size 7 city? Put a granary up in one of the early towns and let it make the settlers, only a few early places need granary. Switch to settler.

Berwick: making a uni at size 6 and cannot grow. I switch to aqua in 1 turn. It also had a cathedral?

London: you should have rushed a coal plant before starting hoover. If you did that and mined the one grass tile, you would have finished it in 9 more turns. You could switch it as I can still saved a turn.

Jamestown: may be my favorite as it is size 4 with a cathedral and a colosseum and temple. A market would be much better as it also ups gold. It is making a rifle at 80 turns, not a good plan unless it is a massive AW game.

I just noticed it also has a uni? It is making 4 beakers at 90% now that is money well spent. This place would have been better off with a wall and a civil defense by now. I put two pop as BH as get 7 beakers and sold off
the lib/uni/temple/cath/colo. Will make a wall and start a civil defense.

If someone comes for the place may as well either make them pay or gift the place. If you were to get to flight and the defenese was not finished you could switch to an airport an pump the place up.

BTW even if you could hold the place they will cut the wine. You would have to put up a strong defense to hold the grapes. If you really want the wines you should have founded the town on the grapes and get another town on the coast.

As it is now a war will probably cut of the trade route for the wine, even if they do not take the town. I would consider rushing a settler and moving it to the wine hill. Abandon the town and found a new town. It looks like there is no culture to prevent it or force you to over lap any ones tiles. Then get up the defensive structures and finally an airport. You will need an airport on your end and then the grapes stay yours, IF you can hold the town.

I have seen so many walls, I am sure most were not needed. It looks like someone playing a war game and I doubt you were at war that much. Even the capitol had one iirc.

Still no MA started.

Final tally:

111111 gold 2463 61gpt income from cities 1355 557bpt RP in 10 turns
1610AD gold 3973 54gpt income from cities 1425 930bpt RP in 6 turns will drop to 5 after new towns planted.


Anyway I hope some thing in there will be us some use.

 

[vmxa]

T Diplomatic in this game should work out fairly simply... just don't research Replacable Parts... trade for it. Beeline to Motorized Trasportation, then back for Flight if not learned by Spain yet, Fission and then build the U. N., and then get military alliances against the Inca 1 turn before you finish the U. N. Pay whatever you have to pay in order to get them... turn research to 0 and give them as much gpt as they want for the alliance. Space would require more effort. You have a fair amount of cash that you could probably do all science and luxury for the rest of the game, especially if you sell some tech for gpt.

That is not going to work. I started sooner on winning Japan over, but they would never vote for me. Inca was at war with all of us for some time and each vote Japan abstained.

Spain was polite and voted for me. I gifted techs and still nothing. I knew I was not going to win them over when even 3 techs and a lux would not get them to into an alliance Vs Inca.

In the end they made an MPP with Spain who already was my ally. Note that I never attacked Japan or Spain. I did not raze any towns, so whatever was done was done long ago.

Now I admit I did not go to extremes by dealing them lux and maybe a town in the hinder land. Not sure that would work either, but I feel the whole UN thing is lame. It is like trading in general, it favors the human too much.

Space would be a snap in this game as I am several techs ahead, but conquest may be beyond reach as they have at least 600 infantry.

I have not decided yet. I am done with the vote, no more election. I figure to kill off Spain and then Japan and we will see at that time, if invasion can be done.

Not going to use nukes, if I can avoid it.

 

[Spoonwood]

You can always set research to zero with no luxuries, sell off improvements like mad, sell the very last luxury and resource sources, and then use tax collectors for all your citizens if he trashed his reputation that much. You just need to get military alliances with everyone against the Inca. You can feel however you like about a diplomatic victory, but it's your opinion only.

 

[vmxa]

What will raising more cash do for you? He is not willing to take techs and or cash. I had plenty of cash. You had no recourse for a diplo victory in this game. I do not know what was done in the game, but Japan would not move off of furious.

I have run into that many times, where you could not move a nation to vote for you regardless of what you offered.

As to alliance, same thing. Japan would not make that deal and you get the he will never accept that if you offer map, lux, gpt. Rep was trashed and 4 or 5k and several techs did not move him.

What I said about the UN is not an opinion, it is fact. You are proposing scamming some civ into a vote or an alliance, how is not favoring the human? The AI can not do that an does not have the final say, players have it.

Now if you want to say it is fun or interesting, that would be an opinion. That it is broken, is a fact.