How do you run/create a NES?

[Jkchart]

Hi all,

I've been trying to look more into this and come up with concepts/ideas/rules, but I'm finding it so difficult.

Does anyone have anything that can help me? Are there any templates, anywhere I can go to learn more about how to start the process and get something running?

I keep getting side tracked by trying to figure everything out and it gets overwhelming.

Thanks in advance for any help!!

 

[Lord_Iggy]

Welcome! There are many general NESing templates that we use.

Broadly speaking, the simplest kind of template might look like this:

Nation Name: Nessos
Economy: Large (6)
Military: 12 000 Infantry, 2000 Cavalry

Economies will often be modeled by a number of points or levels. They can be spent on various things, and military stats broadly show how much force a nation can use to defend, attack, or intervene in the affairs of other countries.

Of course, a stat block that simple wouldn't model much more than a simple war game. A conventional NES might have a variety of lines to describe some cultural details and provide some information to flesh out the country. Here's a system that I've used in the past:

Nation Name
Cities: Capital, if any yet. Major cities will also be listed here.
Leader: Your Nation's Leader/Your Name
Culture: A sentence or two describing your nation's ethnic and religious makeup.
Government: A sentence or two describing your nation's political structures.
Economy: 2- 2/0 [Note: this indicates two economy points that can be spent, and a breakdown of how much of the nation's is based in rural areas, and how much is based in urban areas]
Population: To be determined by me
Army: To be determined by me
Navy: To be determined by me
Technology: A sentence or two describing your nation's technological and scientific development.
Wonders:
Description: Please describe your people's appearance and any interesting things about them.

An example of this is shown below:

Annokha
Cities: Kettedin
Leader: Assorted Chiefs/North King
Culture: Annokha Animists, with large enslaved minorities.
Government: Originally a consensus-based tribal government, war chiefs have found ways to subvert the authority of the political leaders and have in effect set up a parallel, more powerful system of government.
Economy: 2- 2/0
Population: Small
Army: 1500 (Horsemen and Archers)
Navy: None
Technology: The military is fond of horse and short bow. Domestic technologies are fairly simple. Pottery and agriculture are around, of course, but the margins of society still hunt and gather to supplement this. Agriculture still uses the foot plow, construction is only at a basic level, and they generally have to trade for metal tools.
Wonders: None
Description: Annokha are an unsympathetic, fierce tribe of slave raiders from the hills they call the Tambuk, green and cool compared to the lowlands nearby. Expansionist and ruthless, they are in a state of mild hostility with most of the people they meet (they don't really regard raiding as synonymous with 'war'; war is an altogether different and much more destructive endeavor), but simultaneously quite eager to cultivate trade links. However, their capital at Kettedin is a place where any merchant can find a safe haven, and in general, men with whom they have a good rapport will almost certainly not fall victim to their wrath.

This system allows for the clear naming of major cities and a brief description of the culture of the nation, an abstraction of a people's economy and military capabilities, and a more detailed description of the nation as a whole.

Here are some other systems, this is North King's from N3S III: End of Empires:

Haifaio Hailsia - Lord_Iggy
Leader: (Age: )
Government: Gerontocratic Oligarchy
Factions:
Aramsayafa Faeoria: Ruling Faeoria. Large, somewhat chaotic.(Leader: (Age: ))
Faerouhaiaouans: Culturally influential but recently politically marginalized; disorganized.(Leader: (Age: ))
Dremaiites: Rich, influential, but somewhat disenchanted.(Leader: (Age: ))
Ieraitans: Extremely influential intellectual/philosophical movement based in Sakhelakheia.(Leader: (Age: ))
Culture Description: Hailsia is, quite possibly, the center of the world. Faronun theater is performed the world over, and its art and architecture has imitators as far away as Parthe or the Trahana. The counterpoint of Kothari music has begun to have a significant impact on what was once a fairly conservative style. Doru o Ierai, or the Hunt for Truth, is the focus of many in the country, who seek to spread the "perfect knowledge" through the world, especially to the south. Recent cultural exchange with the Vellari Exatai has caused a cultural flowering, particularly in theater.
State Religion: Conclave Iralliam (Doru o Ierai)
Annual Income: 44165
Annual Expenses: 30000
Expenses:
Treasury: 10750
Debt: 0 (Interest: 0 (Rate for new loans: 0.14))
Military:
Army: 50000 Infantry, 10000 Cavalry, 0 Levies, 0 Siege Train(s)
Navy: 200 Ships
Maintenance: 30000
Description: The Haifaio Hailsia is a large empire centered around the peninsula of Hailsia, regarded as the successor to the more ancient Empire of Helsia (though they claim a continuity of government), and a breakaway state from the former Farubaida o Caroha. Established after a long period where the Farubaida drifted increasingly apart due to differing geopolitical concerns and visions, Hailsia championed the growing spiritual movement of Iralliamite schismatic movement, the Faerouhaiaou and the Empire of Dremai. Today, the Haifaio is a vibrant cultural center, especially around the upland city of Sakhelakhaia, and a significant trading power.

This system shows a detailed breakdown of internal factions within a nation and has a much more granular economic system, with maintenance expenses for keeping large armies and navies, but fundamentally shows the same basic things.

And here is EQandcivfanatic's system from Capto Iugulum:

Vinland: Lord_Iggy
Formal Name: Kingdom of Vinland
Parliamentary Monarchy: King Ingvar Gyllensvärd (Conservative)
Riksdag: Konservativ Industripartiet (Conservative)
Head of Government: Statsminister Konrad Franzen
Capital: Nya Stockholm
Manpower: 1,350 (+18)
Economic Points: 0 (+225)
Domestic Spending : -52 EP
-Education: -20 (14)
-Infrastructure: -6
-National Insurance: -14 (14)
-Vinlandskridningpolis: -12
Royal Vinlandic Armed Forces: 104 Infantry Brigades, 42 Cavalry Brigades, 11 Lodjur Armored Brigades, 6 Lejon-Modell Armored Brigades, 1 Björn Armored Brigade, 4 Rovdjur-Modell Armored Brigades, 19 Artillery Brigades, 2 Landcruisers
Army Quality: 8
Army Doctrine: Kungliga Vinlandska Försvarsmakten 1930
Royal Vinlandic Navy: 1 Trovão-class Destroyer,7 Furacão-class Destroyers, 6 Tufão-class Destroyers,1 Maryland-class Battleship, 1 Kronos-class Battleship
Navy Quality: 5
Royal Vinlandic Air Force: 1 P-16 Fighter Squadron, 1 P-21 Fighter Squadron, 5 F-25 Fighter Squadrons, 4 JC-7 Fighter Squadrons
Air Force Quality: 2

Once again, the system shows a brief explanation of the government, while also showing the available manpower, an abstraction of the effective 'size' of an economy, plus a fairly detailed military breakdown including doctrines and equipment models, befitting the alternate-1900s of the setting.

The rules that you use will vary heavily depending on what sort of game you want to run. If you want to run a 'fresh start' approximating a game of civilization, you might want something that has a focus on culture, social organization and what constitute's a given group's economy, while a modern wargame might be much more focused on very specific technologies, doctrines, command structures and force locations. What are you hoping to run?

 

[Gelion]

Hi Jkchart, welcome to our subforum!

Broadly speaking the Never Ending Story is simply that - a story. The stats and the rules and the tools that come with are there because of a long evolution of story-writing to make it more balanced and transparent. The games are mostly focused around history to give players and the mod some context to which they can hang on to. The games can also be set in any setting/timeline/universe.

If I were to design a game from scratch here's what I would think:

Setting
I'd need a game where players can interact with each other and be able to advance their cause/plot with stories. So I'll need a setting. Lets say I picked Dune's Arrakis. The setting and world description is therefore already done for me by Frank Herbert.

Stats
Now I want to see what kind of game I'd like. Lets say I want to style the game as a light storytelling, but I also want big politics. So I'd set players roles as rulers of noble Houses. What does that mean? It means that players would control Houses' possessions on Dune and off-world. That means that I'll have to design stats for Dune-based and not Dune-based houses. Human organisations have simple stats: income, spending and current assets. Lets say that Houses have income (in points from 1 to 10 or infinity), expenditure (1 to whatever) and possessions. Possessions can be: army, fortresses, slaves, factories. Army can cost money, fortresses help in defence, slaves work and revolt and factories give you income or army. You now have yourself a complete set of stats for the game.

Map
If you wish for your game to have a tactical element then adding a map might be a plus. I'd just take a map of Arrakis from the PC game Dune II and add dots where player houses, armies and fortresses are. They can now interact with each other based on their location and their desired future location.

Rules
Rules are linked to stats. In our game lets say 1 province gives you 10 income/cash. 2 cash is the cost of an army. Fortresses cost 5 income and increase defence of a region by 50%. Factories increase income by 2 and cost 10 or can produce 1 army. And slaves are a story element that can appear in provinces that you conquer. These are economic rules. Military rules would govern army movement for example army can move up to 2 provinces per turn and fight once. This rule can be completely omitted in a game set in WW2, for example, as we roughly know how far armies moved in that period and how they fought. But in a simple map and stats game these rules are key.

Gameplay
And there the very simple game is set. Players now know what kind of resources they own and how they can be used. They can see their tactical situation on the map and interact with other players accordingly. Additionally they can write stories such as "Hero X went into Ordos fortress and fell in love with Ordos princess. They escaped and found an old sietch in the desert". And the mod (you) can decide that it merits a certain bonus to a House or not.

Your knowledge of history, sociology, economics and, in fact, any science to do with humans will make the game you play or design more enjoyable. So my general advice is to see what kind of game you want to make and take it from there. Rules and stats might come naturally when you try to describe the sandbox your players will be playing in.

This was a very basic overview, but do ask more questions if you have any. There's also this thread that is very helpful.

 

[Jkchart]

Welcome! There are many general NESing templates that we use.

Broadly speaking, the simplest kind of template might look like this:

Nation Name: Nessos
Economy: Large (6)
Military: 12 000 Infantry, 2000 Cavalry

Economies will often be modeled by a number of points or levels. They can be spent on various things, and military stats broadly show how much force a nation can use to defend, attack, or intervene in the affairs of other countries.

Of course, a stat block that simple wouldn't model much more than a simple war game. A conventional NES might have a variety of lines to describe some cultural details and provide some information to flesh out the country. Here's a system that I've used in the past:

Nation Name
Cities: Capital, if any yet. Major cities will also be listed here.
Leader: Your Nation's Leader/Your Name
Culture: A sentence or two describing your nation's ethnic and religious makeup.
Government: A sentence or two describing your nation's political structures.
Economy: 2- 2/0 [Note: this indicates two economy points that can be spent, and a breakdown of how much of the nation's is based in rural areas, and how much is based in urban areas]
Population: To be determined by me
Army: To be determined by me
Navy: To be determined by me
Technology: A sentence or two describing your nation's technological and scientific development.
Wonders:
Description: Please describe your people's appearance and any interesting things about them.

An example of this is shown below:

Annokha
Cities: Kettedin
Leader: Assorted Chiefs/North King
Culture: Annokha Animists, with large enslaved minorities.
Government: Originally a consensus-based tribal government, war chiefs have found ways to subvert the authority of the political leaders and have in effect set up a parallel, more powerful system of government.
Economy: 2- 2/0
Population: Small
Army: 1500 (Horsemen and Archers)
Navy: None
Technology: The military is fond of horse and short bow. Domestic technologies are fairly simple. Pottery and agriculture are around, of course, but the margins of society still hunt and gather to supplement this. Agriculture still uses the foot plow, construction is only at a basic level, and they generally have to trade for metal tools.
Wonders: None
Description: Annokha are an unsympathetic, fierce tribe of slave raiders from the hills they call the Tambuk, green and cool compared to the lowlands nearby. Expansionist and ruthless, they are in a state of mild hostility with most of the people they meet (they don't really regard raiding as synonymous with 'war'; war is an altogether different and much more destructive endeavor), but simultaneously quite eager to cultivate trade links. However, their capital at Kettedin is a place where any merchant can find a safe haven, and in general, men with whom they have a good rapport will almost certainly not fall victim to their wrath.

This system allows for the clear naming of major cities and a brief description of the culture of the nation, an abstraction of a people's economy and military capabilities, and a more detailed description of the nation as a whole.

Here are some other systems, this is North King's from N3S III: End of Empires:

Haifaio Hailsia - Lord_Iggy
Leader: (Age: )
Government: Gerontocratic Oligarchy
Factions:
Aramsayafa Faeoria: Ruling Faeoria. Large, somewhat chaotic.(Leader: (Age: ))
Faerouhaiaouans: Culturally influential but recently politically marginalized; disorganized.(Leader: (Age: ))
Dremaiites: Rich, influential, but somewhat disenchanted.(Leader: (Age: ))
Ieraitans: Extremely influential intellectual/philosophical movement based in Sakhelakheia.(Leader: (Age: ))
Culture Description: Hailsia is, quite possibly, the center of the world. Faronun theater is performed the world over, and its art and architecture has imitators as far away as Parthe or the Trahana. The counterpoint of Kothari music has begun to have a significant impact on what was once a fairly conservative style. Doru o Ierai, or the Hunt for Truth, is the focus of many in the country, who seek to spread the "perfect knowledge" through the world, especially to the south. Recent cultural exchange with the Vellari Exatai has caused a cultural flowering, particularly in theater.
State Religion: Conclave Iralliam (Doru o Ierai)
Annual Income: 44165
Annual Expenses: 30000
Expenses:
Treasury: 10750
Debt: 0 (Interest: 0 (Rate for new loans: 0.14))
Military:
Army: 50000 Infantry, 10000 Cavalry, 0 Levies, 0 Siege Train(s)
Navy: 200 Ships
Maintenance: 30000
Description: The Haifaio Hailsia is a large empire centered around the peninsula of Hailsia, regarded as the successor to the more ancient Empire of Helsia (though they claim a continuity of government), and a breakaway state from the former Farubaida o Caroha. Established after a long period where the Farubaida drifted increasingly apart due to differing geopolitical concerns and visions, Hailsia championed the growing spiritual movement of Iralliamite schismatic movement, the Faerouhaiaou and the Empire of Dremai. Today, the Haifaio is a vibrant cultural center, especially around the upland city of Sakhelakhaia, and a significant trading power.

This system shows a detailed breakdown of internal factions within a nation and has a much more granular economic system, with maintenance expenses for keeping large armies and navies, but fundamentally shows the same basic things.

And here is EQandcivfanatic's system from Capto Iugulum:

Vinland: Lord_Iggy
Formal Name: Kingdom of Vinland
Parliamentary Monarchy: King Ingvar Gyllensvärd (Conservative)
Riksdag: Konservativ Industripartiet (Conservative)
Head of Government: Statsminister Konrad Franzen
Capital: Nya Stockholm
Manpower: 1,350 (+18)
Economic Points: 0 (+225)
Domestic Spending : -52 EP
-Education: -20 (14)
-Infrastructure: -6
-National Insurance: -14 (14)
-Vinlandskridningpolis: -12
Royal Vinlandic Armed Forces: 104 Infantry Brigades, 42 Cavalry Brigades, 11 Lodjur Armored Brigades, 6 Lejon-Modell Armored Brigades, 1 Björn Armored Brigade, 4 Rovdjur-Modell Armored Brigades, 19 Artillery Brigades, 2 Landcruisers
Army Quality: 8
Army Doctrine: Kungliga Vinlandska Försvarsmakten 1930
Royal Vinlandic Navy: 1 Trovão-class Destroyer,7 Furacão-class Destroyers, 6 Tufão-class Destroyers,1 Maryland-class Battleship, 1 Kronos-class Battleship
Navy Quality: 5
Royal Vinlandic Air Force: 1 P-16 Fighter Squadron, 1 P-21 Fighter Squadron, 5 F-25 Fighter Squadrons, 4 JC-7 Fighter Squadrons
Air Force Quality: 2

Once again, the system shows a brief explanation of the government, while also showing the available manpower, an abstraction of the effective 'size' of an economy, plus a fairly detailed military breakdown including doctrines and equipment models, befitting the alternate-1900s of the setting.

The rules that you use will vary heavily depending on what sort of game you want to run. If you want to run a 'fresh start' approximating a game of civilization, you might want something that has a focus on culture, social organization and what constitute's a given group's economy, while a modern wargame might be much more focused on very specific technologies, doctrines, command structures and force locations. What are you hoping to run?

This is great, thank you!

I definitely want it to be a bit more of a "fresh start", maybe a little bit of an "advanced start", but definitely more like a typical game of civ. I'd rather the combat and systems to resolve conflict be a bit more loose and abstract than hard and fast rules if possible for better player input (if that makes sense) that isn't always a game of chance.

 

[Jkchart]

Hi Jkchart, welcome to our subforum!

Broadly speaking the Never Ending Story is simply that - a story. The stats and the rules and the tools that come with are there because of a long evolution of story-writing to make it more balanced and transparent. The games are mostly focused around history to give players and the mod some context to which they can hang on to. The games can also be set in any setting/timeline/universe.

If I were to design a game from scratch here's what I would think:

Setting
I'd need a game where players can interact with each other and be able to advance their cause/plot with stories. So I'll need a setting. Lets say I picked Dune's Arrakis. The setting and world description is therefore already done for me by Frank Herbert.

Stats
Now I want to see what kind of game I'd like. Lets say I want to style the game as a light storytelling, but I also want big politics. So I'd set players roles as rulers of noble Houses. What does that mean? It means that players would control Houses' possessions on Dune and off-world. That means that I'll have to design stats for Dune-based and not Dune-based houses. Human organisations have simple stats: income, spending and current assets. Lets say that Houses have income (in points from 1 to 10 or infinity), expenditure (1 to whatever) and possessions. Possessions can be: army, fortresses, slaves, factories. Army can cost money, fortresses help in defence, slaves work and revolt and factories give you income or army. You now have yourself a complete set of stats for the game.

Map
If you wish for your game to have a tactical element then adding a map might be a plus. I'd just take a map of Arrakis from the PC game Dune II and add dots where player houses, armies and fortresses are. They can now interact with each other based on their location and their desired future location.

Rules
Rules are linked to stats. In our game lets say 1 province gives you 10 income/cash. 2 cash is the cost of an army. Fortresses cost 5 income and increase defence of a region by 50%. Factories increase income by 2 and cost 10 or can produce 1 army. And slaves are a story element that can appear in provinces that you conquer. These are economic rules. Military rules would govern army movement for example army can move up to 2 provinces per turn and fight once. This rule can be completely omitted in a game set in WW2, for example, as we roughly know how far armies moved in that period and how they fought. But in a simple map and stats game these rules are key.

Gameplay
And there the very simple game is set. Players now know what kind of resources they own and how they can be used. They can see their tactical situation on the map and interact with other players accordingly. Additionally they can write stories such as "Hero X went into Ordos fortress and fell in love with Ordos princess. They escaped and found an old sietch in the desert". And the mod (you) can decide that it merits a certain bonus to a House or not.

Your knowledge of history, sociology, economics and, in fact, any science to do with humans will make the game you play or design more enjoyable. So my general advice is to see what kind of game you want to make and take it from there. Rules and stats might come naturally when you try to describe the sandbox your players will be playing in.

This was a very basic overview, but do ask more questions if you have any. There's also this thread that is very helpful.

Oh this is a great basic guide, thank you! I'll be sure to check out that thread as well and present any more questions I have

 

[Angst]

My only help here is that NESes take a LONG time to get done, particularly updates. Scale your stats format according to your expected workload. Especially now this is an important thing to think about since the forum has a LOT of "demand" from the side of players, a lot of people are returning to the forums hoping to take part in more games. Update workload is the #1 NES killer. Thing is that unless you want to aim for a more "competetive" edge (ie having the point of your NES getting impressive numbers with your nation), stats heavy systems are not really that useful as massive arbitration will happen everywhere regardless - they aren't that much more "fair" if you aren't going for an arcadey, even if complex, province system or something, with formula in between (complex versions of this can be seen in stuff like Paradox games). Especially since more realistic worlds have more polities, defaulting towards fewer stats on your stats sheet somehow usualy makes it easier to process. If you want a lot of stats still, having major nations simply use larger stats sheets than lesser nations is a useful compromise.

 

[Jkchart]

My only help here is that NESes take a LONG time to get done, particularly updates. Scale your stats format according to your expected workload. Especially now this is an important thing to think about since the forum has a LOT of "demand" from the side of players, a lot of people are returning to the forums hoping to take part in more games. Update workload is the #1 NES killer. Thing is that unless you want to aim for a more "competetive" edge (ie having the point of your NES getting impressive numbers with your nation), stats heavy systems are not really that useful as massive arbitration will happen everywhere regardless - they aren't that much more "fair" if you aren't going for an arcadey, even if complex, province system or something, with formula in between (complex versions of this can be seen in stuff like Paradox games). Especially since more realistic worlds have more polities, defaulting towards fewer stats on your stats sheet somehow usualy makes it easier to process. If you want a lot of stats still, having major nations simply use larger stats sheets than lesser nations is a useful compromise.

Thanks, Angst!