Leonel
Breakfast Connoisseur
We decry it and hope it blows over before we have to do anything. Like when you make like you're going to get out of your chair and the phone stops ringing.
How do you solve a problem like a genocide...?!
- Thread starter Che Guava
- Start date
EdCase
Defender of the Faithless
To answer the question.
Refuse to die.
(A very unhelpful response indeed, but the question is unaswerable,may as well try to whistle a color.)
Refuse to die.
(A very unhelpful response indeed, but the question is unaswerable,may as well try to whistle a color.)
EconomistBR
King
Genocide has its roots on economic motive.
The survivors profit from the death of vast portions of society: Homes, furniture, money, farms and jobs. The murderers grab it all.
Because of this people use the most stupid reason to kill each other: religion, nationality, language, ethnicity, etc...
The survivors profit from the death of vast portions of society: Homes, furniture, money, farms and jobs. The murderers grab it all.
Because of this people use the most stupid reason to kill each other: religion, nationality, language, ethnicity, etc...
Yeah, I'm aware of the history. The point is, it wasn't "irrevocable ancient hatreds" or whatever, but rather the two identities were very recently constructed and are really kinda nebulous and spurious. Aside from nitpicking, what's your point?
Ayatollah So
the spoof'll set you free
Maybe this is a trick question, but I can't see why the answer isn't "All of the above". Use inclusive culture and counter-propaganda if possible; use force when necessary.
Now if only we could come up with some international mechanism that gives nations an incentive to do more than just "make like you're going to get out of your chair until the phone stops ringing, then sit back down."
Ecofarm
Deity
You claimed that Rwanda was not genocide, and I'm nitpicking? One cannot commit genocide against a "caste", as you claimed Rwanda was. "Genocide is the deliberate and systematic destruction of an ethnic, religious or national group" (Wiki; 2007). I was not nitpicking; I was correcting someone who claimed that Rwanda was not genocide.
I'm saying it's not a genocide? Uh, no. All I said was that they're recently constructed identities, and very slippery and diffuse ones at that... not some "ancient tribal hatreds" that renders stopping it impossible. In the context of my argument, which runs that genocides shouldn't be seen as inevitable and can be stopped with strong counterveiling force, this was fairly obvious. The Rwandan genocide could have been stopped with outside intervention. That was my entire point. Um, try using some common sense when you read posts instead of going out of your way to make weird nitpicky interpretations.
Yeah, that supports exactly what I said. A core group of 30 000, revved up by the complicit officialdom for whatever reasons (power, hatred, greed), plus a lot of people going along with it, forced into it, or simply ignoring it, out of a population of 7 million. Seems that my statement was pretty much accurate:
What percentage is 30 000 of 7 million, anyway?
The point is this core group had a free hand because there was no counterveiling force but instead a climate which supported and engouraged it. Their actions would not have been possible in the face of stronger counter-force.
Che Guava
The Juicy Revolutionary
Maybe its a joke, maybe its common sense pragmatism, but frankly, attitudes like that just make me feel ill.....
Ayatollah So said:
I agree: whenver intolerance rears its ugly head, we should be ready to apply pressure, but unfortunately, things get a little hairy when you try to balance that with the rights of states as well. TO look at the list again...
(1) A group of people are identified as 'different' from the national norm.
Simple enough, but where is this not the case, really? Indigenous people are often set apart from the national norm, as well as immigrants, natural minorities, etc. We try to set up rules to ensure thier protection, but often this can lead to exclusion...
(2) Said group is marginalized, either by isolation, harassment, exclusion through legal means, etc.
Again, very sticky. If a group is sent, for eg, to a 'reservation' (or whatever they might be called), is this to empower them or to isolate them? If immigrants receive harsher punishments under the law than full citizens, are they being harrassed? If a minority is excluded from some employment sectors because they can't meet mainstream language requirements or the workplace doesn't meet thier cultural requirements, are they being excluded? I don't know if there's a country out there that doesn't at least touch on these?
(3) A propaganda campaign against the group is launched, or intensified.
This is a point where it gets a little more clearcut, but a grey area still remains. If the media in the country is not owned by the state, then it can be difficult to temper people's 'opinions' on groups they consider different. Propaganda can also be ambiguous enough to slip by 'hate legislation'. Take the example of the recent electoral ads in Switzerland by right-wing groups there: a cartoon TV ad depicts a white sheep at the swiss border lettin gother white sheep in and pushing the black ones out. Of course, the parties maintain that the 'black sheep' represent criminals trying to enter the country, but there may be another subtle message in there...
(4) Killing begins....
...and by this point its usually too late..at least for some. Force can end the conflict, but once blood is spilt from one, it tends to boil in others...
I guess this list just serves as a template of how thing usually get to the 'kill zone'. Once we see a pattern emerging in a country that fits the one above, we should start speaking up, and, unfortunately, start considering stronger measures.
I think that mechanism is shame. THe more of us get up and do something, the more likely those on the fence will come over...
MobBoss
Off-Topic Overlord
Why? I am just pointing out the obvious, not condoning the practice. By all means explain what 'attitude' I am having here.
Japanrocks12
tired of being a man
You might want to fix up the title a bit.. the ambiguity is sorta funny.
robo-snickers
frisco pimp
sleep with all the hot women so they can have babys so there race, country and culture can stay alive
Fugitive Sisyphus
Escape Artist
The problem of genocide is solved by redefining the term in such away that it is only genocide if it is perpetrated by a western country.
Japanrocks12
tired of being a man
simply put: if you want to solve a problem like a genocide, you dissect it and kill every little fragment of it.
Shylock
Hey smiling strange
Che Guava
The Juicy Revolutionary
Well, maybe I did misrepresent your comments a bit, but I do get annoyed when a question like "how do you stop a genocide?" is asked, and someone responds with "might as well just let them kill each other and have done with it." I know that's not really what you said, so maybe I read into it too much...
Leonel
Breakfast Connoisseur
No, let socialism decide!
MobBoss
Off-Topic Overlord
Well, perhaps you could say it was said with a Darwinian slant to it.
Che Guava
The Juicy Revolutionary
Ah humanity, red in tooth and claw....maybe it's time to evolve beyond settling differences with mass slaughters, no?
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