How do you think BERT is doing?

[ShaggyCan]

Anyone know how well BERT sold? It seems to have really stalled here, the stats on steams to indicate this, CiV still going REALLY strong.

I think if one of the top modders from the community did one of the balance patches that they are so famous for it would go a long way to resurrecting the game. (I believe there is work being done in this direction) Or even as a longer shot an awesome totally conversion. I realize these things take time, but I think the fix that makes this game a classic isn't going to come from Firaxis.

Also is it 'legal' for people to discuss and point people towards mods for BERT in this forum? I realize there is a BERT mod forum, but a very small % of people actually go there, so it really could use some redirects from this one, which many more people see. This game really needs all the help it can get. I'm just talking maybe one thread where people can go, 'hey this is a great mod, go here to learn more about it'.

At this point all I would like to see from Firaxis is all the modder support they can give. Its time for them to go on vacation, let the community fix it, and then do their usual; steal the most popular mods and put it in vanilla.


PS Just to illustrate my concern, at this time there are 4 times as many users looking at the community balance patch sub/sub/sub forum than there is in this BE: General discussion forum.

 

[Gorbles]

Comparing BE / RT to CiV at this point is redundant, because CiV for some reason has rather unique staying power compared to any other entry in the series (perhaps because it was the first Steam-only launch).

Only time will tell how well BE has done. It received an expansion pack, which is more than a lot of folks predicted it would get. It might even get another.

There are a lot of good mods for BE / RT, and Firaxis frequently feature them on their site. I think the draw of CiV is the historical setting and progression, something BE doesn't have because it's set in space. A lot of people evidently play the series for that historical connection, and expect Firaxis to cater to that. *

I think various points of interest would be to expand the Affinity system, address concerns about game pace / Victory progress, and also improve AI range and scaling (at this point). If the AI was more of a challenge in the way that CiV scales, maybe it would keep some people who only play against top-tier AI satisfied for longer.

* so long as Firaxis don't do anything vaguely liberal because pandering to social issues is Bad. Pandering to gamers is Good!

 

[Ryika]

Anyone know how well BERT sold? It seems to have really stalled here, the stats on steams to indicate this, CiV still going REALLY strong.

I think if one of the top modders from the community did one of the balance patches that they are so famous for it would go a long way to resurrecting the game. (I believe there is work being done in this direction) Or even as a longer shot an awesome totally conversion. I realize these things take time, but I think the fix that makes this game a classic isn't going to come from Firaxis.

Also is it 'legal' for people to discuss and point people towards mods for BERT in this forum? I realize there is a BERT mod forum, but a very small % of people actually go there, so it really could use some redirects from this one, which many more people see. This game really needs all the help it can get. I'm just talking maybe one thread where people can go, 'hey this is a great mod, go here to learn more about it'.

At this point all I would like to see from Firaxis is all the modder support they can give. Its time for them to go on vacation, let the community fix it, and then do their usual; steal the most popular mods and put it in vanilla.


PS Just to illustrate my concern, at this time there are 4 times as many users looking at the community balance patch sub/sub/sub forum than there is in this BE: General discussion forum.

Peak after the AddOn was released was around 13,459 players according to steamcharts.com. Peak after the release of the base game was 86,747 players.

From that I conclude the sales numbers are probably "Meh." overall.

I assume that given the fact that the addon was generally received positively and the biggest problem just seems to be a lack of interest, there will not be a second addon and that the game is probably going to die a slow death now. I'm not claiming certainty on that, but I personally would be very surprised if they set out to work on a second addon without having an external "anchor point" to spawn new interest from players.

 

[GoodSarmatian]

Well, I'm the kind of guy who almost always buys all expansions (proper expansions, not dlc) for the games he likes, and I didn't get Rising Tide because there are still too many unadressed balance issues.
I check this forum from time to time for news on another patch, but it does seem quite dead. Looks like there still isn't much to Beyond Earth once the novelty has worn off.

 

[Gort]

Well, I'm the kind of guy who almost always buys all expansions (proper expansions, not dlc) for the games he likes, and I didn't get Rising Tide because there are still too many unadressed balance issues.
I check this forum from time to time for news on another patch, but it does seem quite dead. Looks like there still isn't much to Beyond Earth once the novelty has worn off.

I'm in the same boat as you. Poor balance, bugs, and the feeling that the game still has little to offer in terms of replayability have kept me from putting any money down.

Some of the patches caused a bigger spike in player numbers than the actual expansion did.

 

[Lucius_]

I stopped playing once the hall of fame completely broke. Game needs another bug patch stat.

 

[ShaggyCan]

Yeah, I hear all guys. To me, at this point, only a really good balance mod by one of our top modders would probably be enough to save this game, for me, long term.

 

[Callonia]

Well, RT made me not hate on CivBERT because it is now at least minimum enough to be satisfactory.

 

[poom3619]

You know, Civ5 BNW's top modders (at least the folks who do high-caliber new civilizations) made few modded civ for Beyond Earth for few months after Beyond Earth release, noted the lack of mod support and lack of Firaxis' response to their problems and go back to Civ5 and stay commited to there like they was.

Maybe because player's response wasn't worth the time spend in making and "debug" it or people simply don't interested in Beyond Earth's mod. Few modders stay here. The game need something more than what it's offer now to attract players and modders.

 

[Gorbles]

Beyond the lack of hacky DLL access, what mod support does BE not offer given the same tools?

The only modding question I ever asked Firaxis over Twitter (about unit upgrade portraits; now redundant with RT) I got a response to. Guess I got lucky.

 

[legalizefreedom]

I assume that given the fact that the addon was generally received positively and the biggest problem just seems to be a lack of interest, there will not be a second addon and that the game is probably going to die a slow death now. I'm not claiming certainty on that, but I personally would be very surprised if they set out to work on a second addon without having an external "anchor point" to spawn new interest from players.

I tend to disagree. Besides not being polished with a little TLC, I believe the lumps BE has taken are similar to any new franchise, particularly a niche within a niche.

I see BE as a long term plan. After this first cycle, everyone will be familiar with the civ personalities and general framework of the game. Not only will there be another add-on, but I think you'll see a sequel. I know publishers are notorious for cutting their losses, but this feels like an investment in the future, likely because of their faith in firaxis to get it right in the end.

It plays differently that the historical civ and I believe you'll continue to see that divergence as a strength of the game as it evolves.

 

[NASAROG]

I think it's doing fine. Stamps says so at least.

 

[BroOfTheSun]

I disagree with the general consensus on this forum that the game isn't balanced. I think the devs did a good job of opening up the game to different strategies other than academy spam, and that this adds balance to the game by giving you different ways to winning. The problem with the game now, is that the AI is too easy, and it's too easy to win on Apollo. CiV had this exact issue when it came out, and they created a patch later on that increased the difficulty.

I don't think balance is the reason this game isn't as popular as CiV. This game seems like such a huge improvement over CiV. Most of the fun aspects of CiV are expanded on in this game. I could probably talk a lot about those but don't have the time atm.

I think the reason people aren't playing this game as much as CiV is because of the lack of difficulty. CiV also gives a historical appeal that keeps everyone playing it too, whereas CivBE doesn't really have leaders that you can easily relate to. Personally, I also think some people are just tired of the CiV formula for a game, and another CiV game maybe helped them realize that.

CivBE definitely feels like a huge improvement on CiV, to me at least. I really enjoy the game, and I'm looking forward to an AI patch that will up the difficulty of the game.

 

[Barathor]

The sky isn't falling (yet! #expansion2); it's fine.

EDIT: eww, santa hats already?

 

[MrFrodo]

I'm enjoying Beyond Earth, but I will admit it lacks a historical feel, that takes away from the kind of role playing enjoyment I sometimes got into playing Civ 1-5. Some of the new game systems in BE are pretty cool though.

 

[Ravenwild]

I am hoping for a second addon. Let's be honest, Civ 5 was pretty terrible until Brave New World.

They really need to change the victory types though for it to be good.

 

[PhilBowles]

I disagree with the general consensus on this forum that the game isn't balanced. I think the devs did a good job of opening up the game to different strategies other than academy spam, and that this adds balance to the game by giving you different ways to winning. The problem with the game now, is that the AI is too easy, and it's too easy to win on Apollo. CiV had this exact issue when it came out, and they created a patch later on that increased the difficulty.

I don't think balance is the reason this game isn't as popular as CiV. This game seems like such a huge improvement over CiV. Most of the fun aspects of CiV are expanded on in this game. I could probably talk a lot about those but don't have the time atm.

I think the reason people aren't playing this game as much as CiV is because of the lack of difficulty. CiV also gives a historical appeal that keeps everyone playing it too, whereas CivBE doesn't really have leaders that you can easily relate to.

That's definitely a big part of it - strip away the historical window-dressing and Civ as a series just isn't something that can compete with other modern computer games, as it's still essentially what it's always been: an outsized board wargame. Which is great for board game fans, but they aren't a major demographic any more.

I don't think fatigue with the Civ series per se can be an explanation for BE underperforming, as the comparison that opened the thread was with the continuing staying power of Civ V. If play rates over time are a reflection of sales figures, Civ V may be the pinnacle of the series' commercial success to date.

CivBE definitely feels like a huge improvement on CiV, to me at least. I really enjoy the game, and I'm looking forward to an AI patch that will up the difficulty of the game.

I certainly wouldn't agree that there are any obvious areas where Civ BE improves over Civ Vl; the next 'real' Civ game could profitably incorporate some of the underlying ideas, but aside from the espionage system and the variety of tile improvements none of the actual mechanics that implemented them. While it's a definite step back in terms of the 'Sim City' aspect, without clear rewards for specialising, without unique building effects or even the percentile-based system of Civ IV (the main way that game encouraged specialisation); getting +2 to yield X gets tired fast.

 

[PhilBowles]

I am hoping for a second addon. Let's be honest, Civ 5 was pretty terrible until Brave New World.

They really need to change the victory types though for it to be good.

Civ V was fine following its first major post-release patch, it just had to compete in the minds of long-term fans with series favourite Civ IV. In Gods & Kings it was a good game in its own right, and in some ways better than in BNW.

BE with the expansion approaches the level of 'okay' seen as a game in its own right, rather than in comparison with its predecessors, that vanilla Civ V enjoyed, but still suffers from lower difficulty and oversimplified strategies even in comparison with that. This is an improvement at least over the base game, which was so unplayable past the early-game exploration phase that - as a devotee of the series since Civ I - it's the first incarnation where I've never bothered to complete a game.

 

[BroOfTheSun]

I certainly wouldn't agree that there are any obvious areas where Civ BE improves over Civ Vl; the next 'real' Civ game could profitably incorporate some of the underlying ideas, but aside from the espionage system and the variety of tile improvements none of the actual mechanics that implemented them. While it's a definite step back in terms of the 'Sim City' aspect, without clear rewards for specialising, without unique building effects or even the percentile-based system of Civ IV (the main way that game encouraged specialisation); getting +2 to yield X gets tired fast.

I need to explain what I mean when I say improvements from CiV. That may take awhile for me to do, and I don't really have the time. In short, when I think of improvements, I'm thinking about expanding policies into the Virtue trees. There is more flexibility with the virtue trees, and a lot more virtues to select from compared to policies in CiV. I really like that change.

Artifacts are a big expansion. CiV just has artifacts towards the end of the game, and they just give culture. BERT has artifacts everywhere that give unique upgrades, and it is a large, and fun part of the beginning of the game.

BERT has lots of worker improvements to play with, which I really like. Specializing cities comes more from worker improvements that specialist builds (although you can make specialist citizen strategies still somewhat work).

Biomes and biome quests are really cool, and seem like a variation on natural wonders of CiV.

I could keep going on with the comparisions, but no time.

 

[PhilBowles]

I need to explain what I mean when I say improvements from CiV. That may take awhile for me to do, and I don't really have the time. In short, when I think of improvements, I'm thinking about expanding policies into the Virtue trees. There is more flexibility with the virtue trees, and a lot more virtues to select from compared to policies in CiV. I really like that change.

I suppose that's a reasonable point. Virtues feel such an unnecessary tacked-on feature of both base BE and the expansion, there just because they transcribed the culture resource from Civ V rather than because it adds anything much to gameplay, that I hadn't really considered its implementation.

Artifacts are a big expansion. CiV just has artifacts towards the end of the game, and they just give culture. BERT has artifacts everywhere that give unique upgrades, and it is a large, and fun part of the beginning of the game.

I do like the artifact system, but it's more a case of something different that the Civ V setting doesn't really allow - one of the few ways in which BE really exploits its setting - than an improvement over Civ V. I would like Civ V artifacts/literature etc. to be a bit more varied in what they do, but there's a limit to what you can plausibly do with them in a historical game.

BERT has lots of worker improvements to play with, which I really like. Specializing cities comes more from worker improvements that specialist builds (although you can make specialist citizen strategies still somewhat work).

My issue there is not that you can't specialise in BE, but that there is no good reason to. You can win the game perfectly happily on the highest levels just building biowells and academies everywhere. Again a percentile-based series of buildings that reward you for having cumulative yields of the same type is necessary to promote this.

Biomes and biome quests are really cool, and seem like a variation on natural wonders of CiV.

Also something that doesn't really translate to a real-world setting. I like Marvels, but wish there was a bit more variety to the quests than 'find 1, then find 2, then get bonus' - though if the AI registered that marvels existed and actively competed to get the bonuses that might play better.