How to leverage the Roman UB effectively?

[LostCrumb]

Hi everyone,

Last weekend I planned to start a game with Julius Caesar. I spent some time thinking about how I could leverage the unique traits of Caesar/the Romans: Imperialistic means faster settlers and faster great generals, the Organized trait allows keeping more cities early and once COL is researched, the economy saving courthouses can be built much quicker. Combined with the Roman UU this is crying for early war. However, I cannot figure out, how the Forum fits into that style of play.

First, the Forum comes with Currency, which I normally do not research very early. Instead I prefer COL, which also has a good synergy with the Organized trait. Researching Currency instead of COL meant delaying cheap Courthouses, since COL can be accessed through cheap priesthood, while Currency has Mathematics or Alphabet as prerequisites. Forums also cost more hammers than Courthouses, even without the Organized trait.

Second, I don’t know how the leverage the +25% GPP. It does not seem like a huge factor. You could also build the Parthenon, which costs as much as 2.67 Forums (at least at my current game’s settings) and provides +50% GPP.

In have the impression, the Forum is a weak UB to counterbalance for the strong synergies of the traits and a strong UU. The Comprehensive UB Guide, however, closes the summary of the Forum with “this UB is very useful and versatile, making it one of the best.”

So, what am I missing? How do you leverage the Forum in your games?

LC

The Comprehensive UB Guide:
http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=192196&highlight=Forum+Roman&page=4

 

[Kesshi]

LostCrumb,

I primarily play a Specialist Economy. Markets provide me with merchant specialists without needing to run Caste system. A Merchant and Scientist both provide me with the equivalent of 6 commerce under Representation. 3 gold 3 beakers for a Merchant and 6 beakers for a Scientist. In addition to the specialist, Markets provide me with bonus happiness from multiple resources. This means more whipping for faster food-to-hammer conversions or a larger size for more Great Persons. The Market is a wonderful building that is an excellent source of cheap happiness. The +25% gold is not to be ignored either, but it is not primarily why I build the Markets in most of my cities.

This is all without mentioning the +25% GPP rate that the Forum provides you with. And while not every city will benefit from the Forum's extra feature, the few that do make fore a very welcomed addition to it. Since most GP farms will be very large cities, you will probably be scrambling for happiness everywhere you can, this makes the Market/Forum almost necessary. This is especially true if it's a VERY VERY heavy food based city, as you may end up using your whip a lot.

 

[slobberinbear]

I agree with Kesshi. Julius screams for a fast-expanding empire, with research powered by an SE. The UB just dovetails with that, allowing for more specialists. To get the most mileage out of Organized, try to research/steal/bully your way to the better civics -- Hereditary Rule, Representation (from Pyramids), Vassalage, Bureaucracy, Organized Religion, and Theocracy. Plan on staying in slavery for a long time.

 

[Julian Delphiki]

Augustus + wonder spam + Parthenon + forum is quite sweet combo.

 

[noto]

I agree with Julian. The forum is most powerful when combined with Augustus. Augustus Ceasar is the closest thing in the game to the industrious + philosophical combination. Think about it this way: the forum for Augustus and the Praet for Julius Ceasar. Try playing a wonderspam game with Augustus, it's quite fun. As for JC...I mean, come on, do you really need any more help than the Praetorian? That unit is a sure ticket to winning the game.

 

[LostCrumb]

Thanks for your helpful thoughts!

LostCrumb,
…

This is all without mentioning the +25% GPP rate that the Forum provides you with. And while not every city will benefit from the Forum's extra feature, the few that do make fore a very welcomed addition to it.

I agree with Kesshi. Julius screams for a fast-expanding empire, with research powered by an SE. The UB just dovetails with that, allowing for more specialists.

I have to admit, I didn’t try that. In my game I was running a cottage economy. My idea was just to assign some merchants to finance my expansion by generating and settling some GMs. It worked fine, but I think the forum did not make such a great difference.

Augustus + wonder spam + Parthenon + forum is quite sweet combo.

Think about it this way: the forum for Augustus and the Praet for Julius Ceasar..

I have never explicitly tried a wonder spam game, but it seems like Augustus and the Forum are the perfect combination for that. And in this case I can see where the Forum really fits into the overall strategy. I was hoping for such an idea, thanks.

As for JC...I mean, come on, do you really need any more help than the Praetorian? That unit is a sure ticket to winning the game.

 

[Diamondeye]

Praetorians are the Iron Fist of the Roman Empire. Utilize them with Julius Caesar, along with CoL for Courthouses (ORG = Faster!), and Currency for traderoutes and forums. Running merchant specialists can save your war-weary economy, and the extra GPP will provide even more GMs.

 

[futurehermit]

Augustus: wonderspam

Julius: specialist economy

Both: praetorian romp

 

[Levgre]

I usually use cottages rather than farms, therefore I tend to have one or two cities which place special emphasis on great people points.

In fact, the GPP system works in such a way that 1-3 cities can produce great people just as well as many cities, since if your GPP production is too high the slower cities may never catch up to the much faster cities, or you just might not get the great people from the slow cities until the industrial or modern era.

So by building just a couple forums, I would effectively increase my GPP by 25%.

 

[PimpyMicPimp]

I never found the Forum the part of Rome that defines their strategy (that would be the allmight Praets). It seems more like Mali's UB; a nice bonus on something you would build anyways.

Lots of good ideas in this thread, though. I may have to rethink my stance.

 

[Magma_Dragoon]

Read obsolete's thread on the WE/SSE. Its powerful, especially with Rome.

 

[zenspiderz]

I don't play rome much but did try augustus a try mainly to try out the forum.

What I aimed for with augustus (alongside pratorian conquest) was a super merchant city. Built GLH, colossus and ToA in one costal city, my capital i think and soon as aI could put a forum there too. The city starting popping merchants like corks at posh dinner party. All were settled in place which gave more food for more merchant specialist for more GMs. Eventually I planned to put a Wall st there.

 

[Iranon]

Augustus is an excellent wonderspammer, and as such can make good use out of the Forum. Going for early wonders can make adequate expansion challenging, so Imperialistic is actually a wonderful support trait for this playstyle.

Julius is quite strong for a warmongering SE as others have said. I'd like to point out that ORG is a trait conductive to both warmongering and a Specialist economy. Warmongering, because unlike the other economic traits ORG helps even when you're cranking out troops instead of feeding scientists/working cottages. SE because you will tend towards a higher population than an equivalent CE, meaning more maintenance, meaning larger savings from ORG.

 

[futurehermit]

I think running merchants instead of scientists with Rome is a very strong approach. Although you will tech slow during the medieval period probably, the key is to keep your economy from total collapse (i.e., strike) while you are expanding rapidly via praets across your continent. If you secure enough land (is power) you will be able to win the game handily once you are able to restore your economy to the point you can assign a bazillion scientists or else lay down cottages and get the slider >= 50%.

Merchants and Great Merchants help a lot here because they give a nice flow of to keep you afloat and pay the bills. The forum, being a market replacement, amplifies this by 25% and also increases your rate of GM generation, which when settled or sent on a trade mission, helps pay your bills a lot. As has been mentioned, if you settle them all in one city, it can eventually get wall street further capitalizing on this investment. Basically, once you have currency (and then construction/col) you can go nuts with the praet conquering and simply do all you can to keep your economy from collapse. In theory, you should be able to conquer your entire continent on monarch and lower (not sure about emperor+) before the AI gets gunpowder. With enough cats early and trebs midgame your praets have nothing to worry about really. Xbows I guess, but with enough collateral dmg, even they are not that scary.

 

[CivCorpse]

I always thought the UB for rome was thew barracks the Prats rolled out of.

 

[dankok8]

I always thought the UB for rome was thew barracks the Prats rolled out of.

good one!!!