Many civs did not started already 4000BC, they started later, either as a split of or they evolved from what we now would consider as barbarians. So why not adding this to civ. Far away colonies that split of the origin empire, if the people are unhappy or there are religious diversions. And barbarians, who left alone for a long time evolve to a new civ. As a ( IMHO positive ) sideeffect, this would make domination victory more difficult. ( so many tried in history, and all failed in the end ) Any thoughts on this?