Immortal University 65 - Shaka

[Noogai]

If only Liz was ahead of you in tech than internet wouldn't get you much since 2 AIs need to know the tech. Sounds like all hammers/gold/food (rush buy/whip) should have gone to infantry/artillery or tanks/bombers - whatever you had tech for at the time. As soon as you saw her building SS parts (before you were obviously) this should have been the plan. If you have the commerce to have a tech lead on everyone else, with US that means you have units. Stopping research for 10-20 turns for this won't hurt you since you had a lead on everyone else. If you were going for SS victory capitulate Liz when possible and direct her research to non-SS techs.

It's tough not to be afraid to declare on an AI with a tech lead (i do it myself often) but really even if you only had infantry/artillery vs tanks/fighters/SAMs etc you will have no trouble as long as she doesn't bribe someone in on you. Just hit before mech infantry and you should be good. Also, like GG said on turn 1 of the war anyone that is willing to be bribed on her would lower the price a lot.

I'd replay it if i were you if you have a save around the time you started going for internet. Losing to SS is rough and you should give it another try throwing all resources into an army to take her out.

Probably I should have just declared on her and then try to bribe someone (later they fighting with each other so it was impossible), but I was too since I avoided war for the whole game. I had Modern Tanks when AI had regular infantry (dunno about Liz though..)
She was building casings, but so was everyone else who went for Rocketry and stuff when I was teching Computers. I bribed other people against each other, but somehow missed Liz and then it was too late..

Screenshot one turn before I loose (note I have gifted and traded for gold several techs, since it doesn't make difference at this point):

Spoiler :

And the last screenshot (not many turns away from launching full SS, though I knew I lost at the time Liz launched her):

Spoiler :

 

[Mylene]

Not sure i'll finish this game, agro AI is pretty stupid.
JC sends a stack across the map towards me, at pleased, i gave him tribute too.
Begged a peace treaty, now i could build some axes or LBs against his stupid Praets while he "camps" me, but...it's pretty silly, other than that not a hard map.
Please no more agressive settings, one of the most stupid game mechanics if everyone plots war all the time with no reason.

 

[TheMeInTeam]

Not sure i'll finish this game, agro AI is pretty stupid.
JC sends a stack across the map towards me, at pleased, i gave him tribute too.
Begged a peace treaty, now i could build some axes or LBs against his stupid Praets while he "camps" me, but...it's pretty silly, other than that not a hard map.
Please no more agressive settings, one of the most stupid game mechanics if everyone plots war all the time with no reason.

AGG AI definitely forces players who otherwise rely on diplo to be honest though. AI also has less chance to stupidly sit on its hands while humans or even another AI wins untouched. It doesn't make it smarter, but this is balanced as a war game and maybe the AI should play it as such.

People are considering running it in HoF OCC games because it significantly cuts into the chances of ANYBODY going culture...although pericles is still pretty likely.

 

[Habitus]

AGG AI ups the build prob, and increases the chance to declare at any level they would already declare at iirc, pre BTS it was just an additional diplo modifier. Diplo still works for safety as often as not, thou the build prob makes wonders go abit later + higher power rating make declarations more likely on by itself without the increased chance in code anyway. It helps the 20-30 prob AIs most, the 35-40 AIs usually start into maintence problems so their poor tech rate gets even poorer.

Deity AGG AI is very common on hof for deity culture games where your not confident of keeping up in tech rates and you pick the AIs who rarely will declare anyway (ie Liz, Musa, American leaders)

Going to give this a go over next few days, 1505 seems to still be the target date to beat

 

[Mylene]

It's a game that turned out to be no fun, not just that i get (almost) attacked after giving out tribute from an AI far across the map. No no, Hanni declares on Lizzy far away as well (with 5 cities) and i could eat him for breakfest later
Asoka (lol ~~) does the same and ruins his good position.
Things like that don't happen in a normal game, it feels more like playing in the Twilight Zone. I def. blame the agressive settings

 

[vranasm]

does someone even find enjoying playing with barbs this game?

I selfteched Archery right after AH since I knew I will have big troubles without, but still

Spoiler :

17 archers, 11 warriors, 4 axeman, 2 spears in 103 turns, like really?

If I would try to rush someone I would kill less AI units.

Gave up after some AI "stole" me TGL not in mood to battle such nonsense.

 

[GenerallyGreat]

does someone even find enjoying playing with barbs this game?

I selfteched Archery right after AH since I knew I will have big troubles without, but still

Spoiler :

17 archers, 11 warriors, 4 axeman, 2 spears in 103 turns, like really?

If I would try to rush someone I would kill less AI units.

Gave up after some AI "stole" me TGL not in mood to battle such nonsense.

I took ages to choose between pottery/archery and going straight to BW. Try again going straight for bronze and I think you'll do it a lot easier. A couple of impis cruising around with a couple of shock axes to compliment your warriors and you can get them under control.

 

[TheMeInTeam]

IIRC I went pottery ---> archery also but i don't recall barbs being THAT brutal. At least, nothing outside of usual on deity with the amount of land around. They weren't fun but doable.

 

[GenerallyGreat]

IIRC I went pottery ---> archery also but i don't recall barbs being THAT brutal. At least, nothing outside of usual on deity with the amount of land around. They weren't fun but doable.

Yeah I'd been playing a bunch of deity starts at the time too so I was big on getting troops out by habit. Deity Inland Sea is just plain cruel most of the time.

 

[Mylene]

Don't forget barbs will be different for everyone.
But it is what i keep saying often Archery can be a step backwards, you are put into a sitting duck role, which doesn't happen with Impis/Axes.

 

[GenerallyGreat]

Don't forget barbs will be different for everyone.
But it is what i keep saying often Archery can be a step backwards, you are put into a sitting duck role, which doesn't happen with Impis/Axes.

You mean having to station them on defensive ground and wait to be attacked rather than going on the offensive right?

 

[Mylene]

^^ Yep, which can be a pain for pillaging.

 

[GenerallyGreat]

Especially when you are trying to cottage those beautiful Inland Sea floodplains!

 

[DanielTorrence]

Did you try declaring on her then asking someone to dogpile? I find it's a pretty reliable way to get cheap war bribes going with civs that aren't bordering.

thanks to the forum encouraging me to whip more early I was able to get out the cities GG settled in about the same time frame. Never thought that could make such a difference while expanding. As it was already said, the land was quite good for cottaging and with the AIs warring each other,

Spoiler :

especially Izzy continiously figthing Ashoka

, I could mop up all the AIs basically with Cavalry. Only the last guy just made it to rifling, but of course he had assembly line by then and I was facing infantry. Luckily, he did not have that much money to upgrade his maces

One thing I observed was: in an earlier attempt I was able to lib Rifling around 1100 A.D..That was my attack date as well, since I had two GM to upgrade preproduced units, but could barely vassall one AI, after that all the others had or were close to rifles (around 1260(!)). In a second attempt I attacked around 1050 A.D. with cuirassiers, teched to rifles after the first war and finished the game with only one AI hitting rifling at the last turn of the game. It seems trading things like banking and gunpowder speeded them up significantly.

A nice map, but I am not sure things will get so smooth with non-aggressive AIs. It helped a lot that they were at war almost constantly.

Spoiler :

Joao wasn't attacked by his neighbors and he was teching pretty good.

Up for the next IU

 

[Zx Zero Zx]

Habitus you are a very sadistic cruel person. There is no chance in hell that you can open with any tech start besides Pottery -> Archery.

 

[GenerallyGreat]

Habitus you are a very sadistic cruel person. There is no chance in hell that you can open with any tech start besides Pottery -> Archery.

Bronze works just fine as a start here.

 

[Tempesta13]

I also skipped archery here. I settled elephants east and got the copper with my 3rd city. It was rough but ended up working out ok as i just lost a couple improvements and nothing else. I remember hurrying to get those 2 settlers out though - iirc i went settler at size 3, then a second worker and chopped out the 2nd settler for the copper. Might have grown to size 4 while building a couple more warriors, not sure.

I had a couple axemen that were scrambling between cities trying to keep up w/ barbs and also had to emergency whip an axe or two in the capital keeping it from getting up to size 6 for awhile. Seemed like it worked out better than if i had of teched archery though. 1 axe in or near a city and you're safe from barbs there where even 2 archers can't always protect improvements and the city. Plus archery delays writing and alphabet/aesthetics/whatever by a few turns which i try to avoid at all costs.

Unless it's a start with a leader w/ no mining or agriculture and only farm food specials i always go BW - if i see no copper and i see lots of empty land i go archery.

 

[Zx Zero Zx]

Bronze works just fine as a start here.

Mm in all of my games the barbs wouldn't let me get bronze.

 

[Habitus]

I went BW on my game too, never got round to finishing thou even thou I made the challenge to try and make me finish a IU for once

 

[Jester Fool]

never got round to finishing thou even thou I made the challenge to try and make me finish a IU for once

Haha. Me neither, although I have the save filed away (since I should be able to win). Just afraid to continue playing 'cause I'll probably mess it up. Fun, aggravating map. Definitely helped me work on my early game (and improve). Habitus.