Import Civ4 maps to Civ5!

[Silverdawn]

GameSpy has a news item indicating that it will be possible to import Civ 4 maps into Civ 5 and get them converted.

http://pc.gamespy.com/pc/sid-meiers-civilization-v/1101645p1.html

Jon Shafer apparently indicated it in an interview with BitMob but I haven't had time to listen to it:

http://www.bitmob.com/articles/import-your-civilization-4-maps-to-civ-5#ixzz0rnTdk5qK

 

[Ahriman]

I can't really understand how that would work.... square to hex?

And how could it convert units - particularly in mods??

Every Civ4 unit has a civ5 counterpart?

This seems odd.

 

[Gre_Magus]

If that is true, that's pretty interesting news that raises interesting points and questions.

First it means the world builder must be reasonably powerful - it apparently can convert a square grid into a hex grid. I wonder if that also means you'll be able to import bitmap maps and convert those.

The guy who got the quote from Shafer on BitMob makes it clear (in a correction) that this does not mean you'll be able to automatically import something like Fall from Heaven. That seems clear enough - the source code for the two games must be quite different, so it would be almost impossible to automatically convert scripting and dll mods.

I also imagine that is limited to world builder save game information. So you can bring over city location and size, unit location. But what about situations where Civ4 units and buildings don't exist in Civ5? They might be replaced w/ Civ5 equivalents or just left out.

Now, one thing that I don't think this means but would be FREAKING HOT would be some kind of XML conversion tool. Now obviously Civ 5 units, buildings, techs, etc. will have attributes that Civ 4 doesn't have, and vice versa, and obviously even where the attribute names are the same, the values would have to be tweaked. It wouldn't be technically difficult to write an XSLT script to do this, just time consuming. But it would be very cool to be able to import some of the great looking units developed for Civ 4 (especially if the graphics files are compatible) give 'em a ranged strength, etc., and go to town with them in Civ 5.

 

[Gre_Magus]

I can't really understand how that would work.... square to hex?

This guy on the "Play Techs" blog explains how to convert square grid coordinates into hex coordinates. I don't understand the math but he claims "it's fairly easy", and I'll take his word for it. I'm sure it's not a hard computer program to write. I'd be curious if the end result looks "warped" in anyway, however.

http://playtechs.blogspot.com/2007/04/hex-grids.html

 

[Gre_Magus]

Also note - the bitmob page says to "check in tomorrow for the complete interview"...

 

[The_J]

I guess there'll be some border recognition algorithm which will recognize the shape of the continents and will try to draw them in hexes.
Will probably lead to some distortion, but you will not have to redo the most work.
Sounds interesting.
Technically it's doable, but the unit conversion would require some hardcoding ...interesting.

 

[Phoenixscar]

Now this is exciting news!!!!

Link:
http://pc.gamespy.com/pc/sid-meiers-civilization-v/1101645p1.html

EDIT: New clarification that you can import maps and NOT mods. Damn.

This is the link that gamespy was reporting on:
http://www.bitmob.com/articles/import-your-civilization-4-maps-to-civ-5#ixzz0rnTdk5qK

 

[Danger]

Now this is exciting news!!!!

Link:
http://pc.gamespy.com/pc/sid-meiers-civilization-v/1101645p1.html

EDIT: New clarification that you can import maps and NOT mods. Damn.

This is the link that gamespy was reporting on:
http://www.bitmob.com/articles/import-your-civilization-4-maps-to-civ-5#ixzz0rnTdk5qK

Still a very exciting prospect! Well done John!

 

[KrikkitTwo]

Importing Mods would SERIOUSLY not make sense.

Importing some graphics, but not 'rule changes'

 

[CanuckSoldier]

Well this is nice, but it would be alot more useful if they made it so it can convert Civ4 python maps scripts to Civ5 lua map scripts. Really the only group that uses premade worldbuilder maps are the Earth players.

CS

 

[AriochIV]

I don't get how importing a grid map to a hex map will give you anything other than a complete mess.

 

[tom2050]

It must do it good enough to make it worthwhile of inclusion by the developers. <---( NOTE: of course I do not know if this is 100% true from the devs point of view, I am just guessing and leaving this statement so I don't get blasted with trolling for this simple statement.)

It will make it, no doubt easier to get modding rolling along and help the Civ4 modding community to get involved with Civ 5.

 

[Me,myself,and,I]

No it uses trig, but I don't understand quite how that works.

 

[The_J]

I don't get how importing a grid map to a hex map will give you anything other than a complete mess.

Because you can't imagine it correctly.

Simple explanation, from what i guess:
A "screenshot" of the map will be made, and then a hex grid will be layed over it.
What terrain is where will just be calculated out of the average of the present terrain.

You will know say: Something like single mountains or so will just disappear!
Well, probably right.
But this functionality is probably not made for players who just want to try out a Civ4 map, it's made for civ4 map makers who want to convert their old maps.
It's just that you don't have to do 100% of the work again, only 20% maybe.

 

[jacortina]

Coordinate transformation of squares to hexes is pretty easy. Start with your basic squares (current maps are just a bunch of squares; it's not until rendered that the looks matter):

Spoiler :

[font="courier new"]|___|___|___|___|___|
|   |   |   |   |   |
|___|___|___|___|___|
|   |   |   |   |   |
|___|___|___|___|___|
|   |   |   |   |   |
|___|___|___|___|___|
|   |   |   |   |   |[/font]

Simply shift every other column up (or down) one half 'unit' (hex orientation can be one of two directions, so this shift might be to the left/right):

Spoiler :

[font="courier new"]|___|   |___|   |___|
|   |___|   |___|   |
|___|   |___|   |___|
|   |___|   |___|   |
|___|   |___|   |___|
|   |___|   |___|   |
|___|   |___|   |___|
|   |___|   |___|   |[/font]

You can already see how the squares now each border exactly six other squares (diagonals no longer touch corners). Then you just make the shapes hexes (in the picture, all that had to be done was change the straight vertical pipes | into forward / and back \ slashes):

Spoiler :

[font="courier new"]\___/   \___/   \___/
/   \___/   \___/   \
\___/   \___/   \___/
/   \___/   \___/   \
\___/   \___/   \___/
/   \___/   \___/   \
\___/   \___/   \___/
/   \___/   \___/   \[/font]

Straight rivers along sides of multiple squares would have to be made to slightly meander, of course. But that shouldn't be too difficult, either. Other than that, features on/of any given square simply become features on/of the associated hex.

No border recognition (or trig) required in basic transformation from a square grid to a hex grid. What it comes out looking like is all left up to the rendering engine, of course (that's what 'decides' what to show in and along the edges of things).

 

[Tamed]

Looks like a great feature, may even end up working on saves. Here is the link to the article:

http://www.joystiq.com/2010/06/25/civilization-5-will-convert-civ-4-maps-automatically/

Edit: Noticed someone else posted this, but no one posted the Joystiq link which seems to have the most comprehensive info, so I think this could be merged or left up.

 

[duckstab]

Sounds pretty cool - I wonder how it will handle mapping the individual civs since a lot are going to be absent.

 

[Gre_Magus]

Here's the full interview on bitmob. Pretty interesting stuff on how the in game browser will work, but I think only the bit about importing maps counts as new information.

http://www.bitmob.com/articles/e3-2...fer-the-in-game-mod-browser-of-civilization-5

 

[timtofly]

The map is just a skin that is "stretched" over the grid. From the screen shots we've seen the graphics of 5 is "squarish" overlapping the hexes anyway.

 

[KrikkitTwo]

Essentially ever other row or column of a Square Grid can be mapped easily to every other row/column of a hex grid

Row or column depends on the alignment.

Its the rows/columns inbetween that are difficult