IO3 - All of Rome's Cities are Mighty!

[SilentConfusion]

I played up to turn 90. Turn 90 has no actions done on it, no one is on automove, and only the spawnbusting warriors and city protectors are fortified.

t = 80: whipped worker in Caligulum
t = 81: worker trained in Caligulum
t = 82: granary built in Rome, starts on Praet; barracks built in Antium, starts on Praet
t = 83: Rome grows in population
t = 84: Sailing is researched; Antium grows in population; whipped Praet in Rome
t = 85: Praet is trained in Rome, starts on Praet; whipped a Praet in Antium; whipped a Praet in Cumae
t = 86: barracks built in Caligulum, starts on Praet; Praet trained in Antium, starts on Praet; Praet trained in Cumae, starts on Praet
t = 87: Praet trained in Rome, starts on Praet; Cumae grows in population; whipped Praet in Cumae
t = 88: Praet trained Cumae, starts on Praet
t = 89: Rome grows in population; Praet trained in Antium, starts on Praet; meet Lincoln of America and sign OB treaty
t = 90: nothing yet

More detailed turn log:

Spoiler :

I whipped the worker in Caligulum. I figured the city's namesake would approve and it saved 3 turns of non-growth allowing the worker to improve the horse tile and chop a forest.

The very next turn (81) we built the worker was built and we got this random event.



If we build enough stables our horsepower will get some kind of bonus. We have to do this by the Renaissance. We might do it eventually, but certainly we won't be building any stables in the immediate future.

On the next turn Rome finished building a granary, and Antium a barracks. Both begin building Praetorians.

Our wandering warrior discovers the previously unseen city of Lalibela.



And our wandering workboat find the Byzantine capitol city of Constantinople.



Our researchers who have been diligently focusing instead of wandering discovered the practice of Sailing, which allowed the city of Caligulum to be instantly connected to iron before the road made it all the way there. The discovery of sailing also boosted our trade route income bringing in gold from the newly discovered Byzantine cities.

Our wandering warrior wanders a little further and notices that the Ethiopians are mining copper and building some Axemen. He thinks to himself that this copper source should be pillaged early in the war if possible. He also notices the barbarian city of Visigoth guarded by two warriors.



Our generals pointed out this attack route, noticing that after only one turn we could be next to the city on a hill and ready to attack the next turn and could attack not across a river. The newly built Praetorians coming out of Rome, Antium, and Cumae headed in this direction, while our worker started make a road to this spot.



Our cities rolled out 5 Praetorians who all started heading towards the attack spot.

Our workboat had continued on after finding the Byzantine capitol and finally comes across a new fellow, a Lincoln of America. Our ambassadors aboard the workboat signed an open borders treaty with Lincoln of America.





Our warrior watches from a hilltop as the Ethiopians found a city in the desert next to stone.



This is the positions of our 5 Praetorians. None are on automove. The worker is building roads to make reinforcing our army take less time.



City reports:

Caligulum:



In three turns the city will grow, and a praetorian can be whipped once 15 hammers have been invested in the current build. The whip unhappiness from this city has already worn off.


Antium:



Antium's whip unhappiness wears off in 5 turns and Antium will grow in 5 turns, so after that another Praetorian can be whipped. The gem mine was built and connected adding more happiness allowing more judicial use of the whip. A worker is in the forest south of the gem mine ready to chop it, he is not chopping currently.


Cumae:



Cumae is the only city that got whipped twice and has a 5 turn unhappiness penalty and a 15 turn unhappiness penalty. This double whipping was done because there were only two improved tiles. I would keep whipping this city when it is 1 turn away from growing to 3 population. Our elephants and gems are raising our happiness levels allowing more whipping. A worker is chopping a forest just outside the cultural borders, although he isn't currently working.


Rome:



Rome has 4 turns of unhappiness left and will grow in 3 turns. I would recommend not whipping Rome until it gets to size 7. At size 6 it can put out 16 hammers per turn, meaning 3-turn Praets. A worker is chopping a forest to the NE of Rome, although he is not currently working. A praetorian will be built in Rome next turn.

Here is the power graph. Zara has grown his power value with his axemen, but notice that we have shot upwards past him with our new troops.

EDIT: Save added. That should be the right save.

 

[Brian Shanahan]

@ Confusion good turnset, 5 Praets is a good start, and nice to see Mr. Lincoln in the game. It'd be lovely if Carthage were here too, we could beat up our oldest enemy a bit for old times sake. I am looking at possibly staging a Marian revolt to bring back the Republic as it was a far better war-maker than the Empire.
A few points:
1) we seem to be slightly lacking in a save, so I can't got it.
2) Horse whisperer quest:

Spoiler :

Horse Whispering
Prereq: ANIMAL_HUSBANDRY AND Horse resource
Obsolete: NATIONALISM or PRINTING_PRESS or EDUCATION or GUNPOWDER or ASTRONOMY
Active/Weight: 25/500
Aim: Build default number of players for this world size stables (7 for standard)
Result:
1.you get default number of players for this world size Horse Archers (6 for standard)
2.All mounted units get the Sentry promotion
3.All stables provide +1 food
I'm not too sure what gives two or three

3)Yeha raze frankly the position is junk, the dot map city put 2S1E is far better, as soon as we clear them stupid barbs.
4) Do we want to keep Aksum? Personally I'm for razing unless something compelling happens there. If we place a city inland where I suggested we would ahve to get rid of Lalibela too. And looking at the position of Lalibela I'm not too fond of keeping it either.

 

[Brian Shanahan]

It is the right save so this is a got it. I won't play tonight as I'm drunk. I will get up in the morning check back here and play as advised, and make it up as I go along if not.

And I see we have a sixth coming down from Antium. Will I build 5 (should manage in <10 turns) and then commence the attack, or will I just keep building and give Justice the honour?

 

[IdiotsOpposite]

Zara is REXing. We must stop him!

I think that after the war is over, we maybe could get horse whispering and some galleys and maybe take over Lincoln with our 6 HA/Praet army? Or is that TOO ambitious?

And I suppose you could Raze Lalibela... it doesn't seem like too bad of a city, but it would interfere with C.

And yes, start the Marian reforms? The Roman people have had enough of Caligula!

I'd put out a few more units and commence. As I said earlier, Zara is REXing. We have to stop him.

 

[SilentConfusion]

His REXing isn't really that bad for us, especially if his new cities are on flat ground. That means his troops will be divided. Our Praets will not be. With as many cities as he has I'm sure he doesn't have more than two defenders in most cities. Our first two cities captured should be the Northern-most one and Aksum, I think. When we have our Praets in place we can declare war and attack the Northern city on the second turn and I think we can attack Aksum on the third turn after that. The other cities aren't on hills and should fall easier. Our warrior should try to either pillage the copper or cut the road to at least deprive Aksum of copper. The new cities shouldn't be able to churn out as many units.

I'd wait for 8-10 Praets on that attack tile with more coming in reserve before attacking. Whipping is alright as we have happiness to cover the penalty, although I'd let Rome grow to size seven before whipping.

As for whether to attack Lincoln next, that is way too far ahead. We might find that Byzantines would fall easier. Justin's power currently is far below ours and Zara's. Unless Lincoln's much weaker actually I'd rather attack Justin first. He's a much shorter distance by galley and once we had a foothold on that side we could more easily attack Lincoln and whoever else is there.

 

[Brian Shanahan]

Just two points before I play. On the long term we need to decide how we are going to win this game. I'm guessing from the bloodthirstyness seen so far Domination, Diplomation or Genocide are the preferred routes.
The second point is on geography. I am thinking we are on a mini continent, backing up onto the tail of a main continent, where we will find a few enemies. The other option I can see is that we've got four 2 civ continents to deal with.

 

[Brian Shanahan]

Caligula: now to sit down relax and enjoy a nice meal with my senators' wives he he he.
<CRASH>
Caligula: What is the meaning of this. Guards, Guards,my palace is under attack.

Marius: We know, and it is us doing the attacking.

Caligula: Who are you? I demand you leave sacred your divine emperor.

Marius: I am legate Gaius Marius of Legio IX and I am here to restore the Republic.

Caligula: But it can't be you're dead a hundred years or more. Impostor!

Marius: Ah but I'm not, Zeus looked down on his favoured people and saw that it was not good, decadence, sloth, effeminancy, and saw that Rome had abandoned its Republican principles and had become no better than the despotates of the East. He ressurected me to return Rome to the true path. Now begone, vile creature lest I slay you myself.

Caligula: AAAAAAaaaaaaaargh!!!!!

Marius: Let the word go out amongst these hateful creatures "I'm mad as hell and I'm not going to take it amy more". Get out the whip lets give these people a taste of true Roman discipline

Turnset
Turn XC
Move the Praets
Anitum and Rome workers are chopping to the strains of "I'm a lumberjack and I'm ok"
Settler spear pair move 1NE out of Gondar.

Turn XCI
Lincoln has copper.
Rome Praet>Praet
Cumae whips Praet
Gondar settler heads E

Turn XCII
Gondar settler E again
Cumae Praet>Praet

Turn XCIII
Gondar settler NE
Antium Praet>Praet
Find a Big Blue apple next to Lincoln's copper.

Turn XCIV
Move along nothing to see here

Turn XCV
Debra Berhan (?) founded on a hill (recommend raze)
Computer doesn't know rules keeps suggesting cottages
Cumae, Cakligulum and Antium all whip Praets

Turn XCVI
Whipped cities and Rome build Praets>Praets
Zara worried about barbs, Yeha best defended city.
Divert 2 Praets to Debra.

Tunr XCVII
Maths is in pick alphabet, Marius is displeased he cant send messages to his legates.
Antium makes 1T Praet (combination of chop and whip)

Turn XCVIII
Barb city N of Lincoln on coast, beware galleys for work boat

Turn XCIX
Debra pops border
Repositioned my stacks
War -2 turns at most.
Science=40% (down from 60%)

Turn C
Picked Praets in Rome Cumae
Nothing else.
Visigoth has an archer and two warriors.

Here is a few pictures of the empire (forgot to take any during turnset)

Our core cities


A reason for war, Zara had the gall to plant a city on our land, and in a stupid place too.


Zara's empire


The Continent


What we know of the Barbarian fools to the North. The workboat is in the North beside the barb city.

 

[Brian Shanahan]

Thoughts on the save, attack now or next turn, we have 11 Praets in place (2 at Debra, 9 at Gondar). We have 4 more on the way, and are still building. Our power to Zara is 1.8>1 FTW. shouldn't be too hard.
Justinian next, we could start pouring out the galleys now, we have 2.9>1 in the power on him.
Lincoln will problably be harder, we cannot see his power, and he is building Axes (he had 2 axes and an archer in New York).
It was a choice between Alpha and Curr, I picked alpha first. I think we should take currency next and then either CoL or Const. after that (depends on if we're warring Justinian).
We probably should try for optics pretty early too, see the rest of the world.

Finally on the war we should be able to win fairly quickly if the die rolls our way at Gondar.

 

[IdiotsOpposite]

Go for it. Declare war, and show those "mighty" Ethiopians and their leader who really rules the continent!

Us, by the way. Us.

 

[Brian Shanahan]

Go for it. Declare war, and show those "mighty" Ethiopians and their leader who really rules the continent!

Us, by the way. Us.

Remember its for Justice to do the war (much as he's a pacifist with the RNG). Just remember all Rome's wars are defensive, preemptive defense.

 

[SilentConfusion]

Remember its for Justice to do the war (much as he's a pacifist with the RNG). Just remember all Rome's wars are defensive, preemptive defense.

The swift sword of Justice... It is to feared.

 

[ForGreatJustice]

Oh believe me, my justice is very slow and painful

I love what you guys have set me up with. I'm honored to do the part of striking the first blow against Zara.

Looking at the save, here is what I think I can accomplish in 10 turns tactically. Could use any other input.

1. Raze Dedre Behan with Praets near Rome
2. Main Praet army goes to Gondar and then to Aksum, razing both.
3. Reinforcements will link up with the group that razed Dedre Behan and begin to move south to either reinforce the original (but by then decimated army) or move in parallel (if the original is still mostly intact) and attack Yeha (bad idea since it has good troops) or attack the city starting with L in the tundra.
4. Send probably 2 praets down to pillage that south tundra iron, and also the copper for good measure

With razed city money I can probably squeeze out Alphabet in my set, we want currency?

Depending on the war effort, I will squeeze in a granary here, a settler there, only if the situations present itself. I think just making Praets though will be the safe bet. Any extras can be used to take out Just. Probably our timing for taking him out is before he gets cataphracts, or when we get rifles. So that means we get ready for him soon or we can just build infrastructure and bide our time. Since our power rating is so high against him, I vote sooner. Plus I think he has a few wonders we could steal from him

 

[Brian Shanahan]

On Justinian we could probably take him out quick if we get a few galleys up, and don't lose too many in the war against Zara. The power ratio should be sitll at a bout 2>1 if we get decent RNG rolls. Also I would keep Gondar and raze the rest, and get rid of Yeha, even if it means losing a few, as it blocks a very good position.

 

[ForGreatJustice]

Also I would keep Gondar and raze the rest...

I don't know. I was thinking that by razing Gondar, we can gain a lot of gold potentially to fund our research a bit. We're stuck at 40%. Plus due to distance it will be a draining our econ a bit more. I think for speed purposes, we will need every single Praet available to maintain a strong push so leaving behind a Praet or two could hurt our odds against his cap (on a hill) and against Yeha (5 defenders).

Also for speed purposes, I know we love our Praets but we do have horses nearby just needing a road. What if we augment some chariots to counter axes? Defending axes gets 25% for fortifying, some cultural defense bonus, and 50% against melee. Just by my rough estimates, an axe on defense is stronger than our Praet with just CR1

If you guys want me to keep Gondar, I'll keep it. Otherwise I think we should raze it for the gold. Plus not that I noticed, but I'll be pillaging any cottages if Zara had any built.

 

[Brian Shanahan]

Also for speed purposes, I know we love our Praets but we do have horses nearby just needing a road. What if we augment some chariots to counter axes? Defending axes gets 25% for fortifying, some cultural defense bonus, and 50% against melee. Just by my rough estimates, an axe on defense is stronger than our Praet with just CR1

I would but I wouldn't delay attacking to get them, build them now and pull them forward as needed. There is a worker in Cumae IIRC that can hook them up. You should have enough out of Rome in a few turns to handle Yeha.
By my quick eye check of the screenies, we have 17 Praets at the moment, more than Zara's whole army, and we have a pillage warrior 1 tile east of his copper, so no axes for a while.

 

[IdiotsOpposite]

Yeah, Chariots may just be a good idea...

But I agree with Brian. Don't delay the attack to get them.

 

[ForGreatJustice]

No by no means will I delay attacking. The chariots would act as a second wave of faster reinforcements. If things are good to go, I'll play this in about an hour (need to go grocery shopping first). I intend to attack immediately. That warrior in the south will probably die before he has a chance to pillage the copper. Oh well

 

[IdiotsOpposite]

Try to quickly pillage it... the less enemy resources the better, I always say.

 

[Brian Shanahan]

No by no means will I delay attacking. The chariots would act as a second wave of faster reinforcements. If things are good to go, I'll play this in about an hour (need to go grocery shopping first). I intend to attack immediately. That warrior in the south will probably die before he has a chance to pillage the copper. Oh well

Don't forget the ice-cream.

 

[ForGreatJustice]

These were dark times for the Empire. Caligula was murdered, Marius was in power and ruled with the whip. The times were set for the rise of one great man who would forever change history:

Spoiler :

Gaius Julius Caesar... he and his 13th Legion had camped near the Ethiopian city of Gondar. His friend Pompey was camped to the east with his contingent overlooking an Ethiopian city with two names. At dawn they marched and unleashed hell

Spoiler :

Spoiler :

With a formal declaration of war, Caesar and Pompey marched ahead hoping their pincer movement will simultaneously crush both corners of Zara's empire. They experienced early success as their initial targets fell with acceptable losses.

Spoiler :

Spoiler :

After their initial victories, both young generals reorganized for their second offensive push. Julius would strike for Aksum the capital, and Pompey further south to the town of Yeha.

Caesar's 13th Legion

Spoiler :

Pompey's Whatever Legion (couldn't look up one )

Spoiler :

Pompey was victorius and burned Yeha to ashes:

Spoiler :

Caesar, though he respected the capital city of Aksum, saw how limited its potential was and had it burned.

Spoiler :

This would cause a ripple in foreign relations apparently

Spoiler :

"My lord Marius, we have word from the front. Caesar and Pompey have been successful and are near the walls of Zara's remaining two cities!"

Campaign Status

Spoiler :

More in-depth turn report
Finishing up Turn 100: Declare war on Zara
Turn 1:Our pillaging warrior was killed by an axeman before he could pillage this turn, our first fallen Roman Dedre Bran (whatever it's called) razed by one Praet, no casualties. More Praets built, going for two prong attack, one group on Gondar, reinforcements to attack Yeha.

Turn 2: Horses roaded, Antium going to make us chariots to sustain attacks and reinforce faster. Lose 3 Praets on Gondar but got it. Just realized that capturing and keeping also lets you get the pillaging cash. Hmm... Nah, they're heathens plus speed is the key here. 4 revolt and I need as many Praets as possible to get Aksum. Find out Lincoln has Alpha and only him. COuld get it for Math, but we can research Alpha in 5 at 100% (still deficit) so I'll just keep it self-research

Turn 3: Troop movement, Zara sending sword and settler up north. Bad odds of fighting, so I'll wait a turn, nah promoted one praet with Combat I, 66%? I'll take it

Turn 4: Scouting warrior ALMOST kills a sword while defending. Sheesh. Lose two at Yeha, raze it. Got a GG, Gaius Marius. Academy built in Rome. ZY sends another escorted settler, killed that one also got a free worker

Turn 5/6: Movement

Turn 7: In IT Justin demands math? You kidding me? But that does mean we have Alpha now, set for Currency. We lose 3 Praets on Aksum but raze it in the end. Rome grew to 8 and became unhappy but because it had overflow, I 3 pop whipped a settler, so 10 t unhappy will be gone by next pop 8. Because Lincoln already has Alpha, I decided to make a backfill trade with Justin with Alpha for Med, Poly, and Archery.

Turn 8: Rome's settler done, making Lib. Kill another sword escorting a settler, but leave the Praet exposed to a healthy Zara axe, so long buddy Move troops around.

Turn 9: Holy crap, axe does not attack the Praet, and we keep our free worker, yay. More troop maneuvers

Turn 10: Justin builds Colossus. Settler deciding where to go, he's 1N of the stone, led by a scouting chariot. I thought about getting our GP farm in the old Zara lands with 4 food sources. Move more troops, setting up IO.

Well. I'm not sure if I could have warred any better. RNG was fair. I lost when I should have lost, I won when I should have won. The last two cities of Zara are ready to fall in the next 2 turns. There are 6 Praets near the western city, and about 8-11 within a turn next to the eastern city. Currency due in 9 but deficit will catch up. Library in Rome almost done, started building infra when I thought it was feasible. I hope this sets things up well for you IO.

Also for next turn set, some MM will be needed for Cumae. Just take off the sheep and let it be stagnant at 4, or just make settlers/workers with it.