Language translations for leader sayings

[IgorS]

Hi, as a native French speaker Napoleon's lines are not exactly transcripted, there are some spelling mistakes
It's a shame he says "tu" (informal "you" used for friends and family) instead of "vous", it really doesn't suit a legendary figure like him. Some people have already complained about this in other languages :/

I don't know about Napoleon, but as a Russian speaker, I actually think it is okay that Catherine uses "ty" instead of the formal "vy". This kind of suits her "image". She's is flirting with everybody, so she speaks informally. Also, she is the Empress of Russia, so she can address others however she likes.

 

[Danielion]

Interesting. When defeated William says the words the legends tell of him were his last words, but this time in Dutch ("Mijn God, wees mijn ziel genadig. Mijn God, heb mededogen met dit... mijn arme volk.") instead of French ("Mon Dieu, Mon Dieu, ayez pitié de moi et de ton pauvre peuple.")

Of course, it's only a legend, he probably died a quick death.

 

[janboruta]

I don't know about Napoleon, but as a Russian speaker, I actually think it is okay that Catherine uses "ty" instead of the formal "vy". This kind of suits her "image". She's is flirting with everybody, so she speaks informally. Also, she is the Empress of Russia, so she can address others however she likes.

In Polish, using second person plural ("wy") has mostly fallen out of use in favour of third person singular (like in Spanish or Italian) or outright second person singular ("ty" instead of "wy"). Casimir uses second person singular in his lines, as if he was speaking to a trading partner, but not to a person of great reverence to him.

Addressing an important person you don't know personally, or if that person is of higher social rank, is performed via third person singular in Polish, usually using "Mister/Madam" ("Pan/Pani"). However, using those phrases would be very wrong, too formal and static in case of Casimir, whose tone is rather friendly, and where second person singular can be as polite as third person singular.

Examples:
"Jak ci się podoba moja oferta?" - How do you like my offer? - second person singular.

"Postanowiłem z tobą skończyć!" - I decided to end it with you! - as well.

 

[Danielion]

Hi, as a native French speaker Napoleon's lines are not exactly transcripted, there are some spelling mistakes
It's a shame he says "tu" (informal "you" used for friends and family) instead of "vous", it really doesn't suit a legendary figure like him. Some people have already complained about this in other languages :/

Indeed. Catherine also speak improper Russian, always 'Ты' instead of 'Вы'. I've even seen videos of Russian gopniki yelling at a shopkeep at least showing the courtesy of using the polite tense while throwing insults at her.

 

[SnowKomodo]

That's a bit harsh...
I do agree Nusantara is a more encompassing name, but considering that the various dominant cultures (Javanese, Acehnese, Balinese, Bugis etc.) of the archipelago are all closely related to the Malay culture (which is the most widespread, from the Peninsula to Borneo to Sumatra), it is an acceptable name. It's no worse than calling India the Indian subcontinent (the etymological reasons for this are rather preposterous too). Bahasa Indonesia is also based much more on Malay than any of the other languages.

Different names are used because of the differing backgrounds of the user. Nusantara for the Malays, Javanese and many ethnic groups of the archipelago because it is from their language, Malay Archipelago for Westerners because their first contact was with the Malay sultanates of Melaka and Johor-Riau. Sundaland is used in scientific texts. All are valid to describe the archipelago.

I just don't understand why Westerners can't also call it Nusantara. It's not a hard word

Or just call the specific region they are referring to if it's too foreign sounding. So, if it's Malaysia, say Malay Peninsula. If Indonesia, Indonesian archipelago. If both, Nusantara. If the entirety of maritime Southeast Asia, Nusantara also

Westerners always get to name what they want anything they want historically, but I feel like with the communication and understanding we have today, it's not unrealistic to expect people to slowly adapt their label for certain things - it already happens all the time

 

[Geppenguin]

I just don't understand why Westerners can't also call it Nusantara. It's not a hard word

Or just call the specific region they are referring to if it's too foreign sounding. So, if it's Malaysia, say Malay Peninsula. If Indonesia, Indonesian archipelago. If both, Nusantara. If the entirety of maritime Southeast Asia, Nusantara also

Westerners always get to name what they want anything they want historically, but I feel like with the communication and understanding we have today, it's not unrealistic to expect people to slowly adapt their label for certain things - it already happens all the time

Then you may as well ask the world to call China "Zhongguo", India "Bharata" and Japan "Nihon/Nippon"
Living in Nusantara itself, I've actually never read/heard any public figure from Malaysia or Indonesia use the term in speeches or statements. Nusantara isn't that common a term anymore, even in the Archipelago itself.

 

[SnowKomodo]

Then you may as well ask the world to call China "Zhongguo", India "Bharata" and Japan "Nihon/Nippon"
Living in Nusantara itself, I've actually never read/heard any public figure from Malaysia or Indonesia use the term in speeches or statements. Nusantara isn't that common a term anymore, even in the Archipelago itself.

The Malay aspect of "Malay Archipelago" derives from the term "Malay race" which was incorrectly coined by a couple of white guys in colonial times. Since the Western world takes no interest in historical correctness in the Eastern world, that label stuck and now there is a misconception that this term is completely acceptable.

It is a term that Westerners use to simplify the region but it is a very lazy term.

Malay race would make sense if the various island cultures were overwhelmingly similar as Malays. But it is not. For example, there is the Javanese race and history, which is completely and utterly distinct, yet in the Western world Java gets lumped in under "Malay archipelago", "Malay language", "Malay race", etc.

A much more acceptable term then, if Westerners find it so necessary to simplify the people, is Austronesian. Makes way more sense. But better still to specify.

As for the name of the archipelago itself? Again, specify. If you are referring to Indonesia, say Indonesian archipelago. Malaysia (and a few specific parts of Indonesia derived from Malay culture)? Say Malay Peninsula. Philippines? Philippine Archipelago.

Don't want to call it Nusantara? Fine, but don't call it Malay Archipelago.

Remember when people called the entire area East Indies? That is the equivalent of calling it Malay Archipelago today, albeit balanced from a modern perpective

I say this as an Indonesian who has studied the area far too long to accept outdated terms

 

[IgorS]

Indeed. Catherine also speak improper Russian, always 'Ты' instead of 'Вы'. I've even seen videos of Russian gopniki yelling a shopkeep at least showing the courtesy of using the polite tense while throwing insults at her.

We are talking about Catherine here, not some gopnik. A leader of her status would have no problem using "ty", especially in the context of this game.

 

[Danielion]

We are talking about Catherine here, not some gopnik. A leader of her status would have no problem using "ty", especially in the context of this game.

You might be right, you're the Russian speaker after all and Civ leaderheads are of course slight caricatures, where flirty Catherine isn't an exception.

 

[ajok]

Don't want to call it Nusantara? Fine, but don't call it Malay Archipelago.

this.
nusantara is from 2 words, nusa and antara, nusa means island, antara means space, so nusantara is islands with many spaces, which means nusantara is archipelago. but dont call it malay archipelago.

Then you may as well ask the world to call China "Zhongguo", India "Bharata" and Japan "Nihon/Nippon"
Living in Nusantara itself, I've actually never read/heard any public figure from Malaysia or Indonesia use the term in speeches or statements. Nusantara isn't that common a term anymore, even in the Archipelago itself.

if you know many of indonesian nationalism song, it contains many "nusantara", why? because the word is used to called the archipelago before "indonesia" word. yes the world don't know, because indonesia archipelago known as dutch east indies at 17-20 century

 

[God of Kings]

Indonesia is Greek for "Indian (of or pertaining to India) Islands"

 

[ajok]

Indonesia is Greek for "Indian (of or pertaining to India) Islands"

indos and nesos

 

[God of Kings]

indos and nesos

The etymology is proof that Indonesia is a misnomer (they are not part of India (aside from the fact that Nusantara (particularly Sumatra and Java) was Hindu before Islam took hold there)).

 

[Danielion]

Nusantara might take a while to catch on. 'Malay Peninsula' might gain popularity quicker. I have no problem using the term, but I'm not sure people would understand me readily. Well, it's not unheard of that languages use different terms for places of ethnicities. For instance, in Latvian people call Russians 'Krievi' named after a Slavic tribe.

 

[God of Kings]

Likewise, in most Slavic languages, Germans are considered mute.

The Polish word for Italy is Wlochy (cognate with Wales, Waloon, Vlach, Wallachia, and such, all from the Volcae tribe (Celtic)). See here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Walhaz

 

[Danielion]

The Polish word for Italy is Wlochy (cognate with Wales, Waloon, Vlach, Wallachia, and such, all from the Volcae tribe (Celtic)). See here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Walhaz

Which is etymologically related to the word 'false', meaning in this context 'foreign'.

 

[SnowKomodo]

Nusantara might take a while to catch on. 'Malay Peninsula' might gain popularity quicker. I have no problem using the term, but I'm not sure people would understand me readily. Well, it's not unheard of that languages use different terms for places of ethnicities. For instance, in Latvian people call Russians 'Krievi' named after a Slavic tribe.

Nusantara may take a while to catch on. It may not even catch on at all, but if it did catch on it would be a name to stay unlike names like East Indies which were doomed from the start (and names like Malay Archipelago, while not doomed from the start is still not the most appropriate name)

But the distinctions specifying between the likes of Malay Peninsula, Indonesian Archipelago, or simply just naming the island/region itself (Singapore, Papua, Java, etc) is very realistic if not already successful - people already use those names regularly

 

[EulerMcE]

I really doubt inaccurate simplified names like that are particular to the west or the treatment of SE Asia. I would say it is rather common feature of many languages and cultures.

Not that I entirely object to using more appropriate names. "British Isles" is one used in game and in common speech that I'd liked to see phased out because it is inaccurate wrt to Ireland (and the Gaels/Picts in the Celtic context).

 

[Danielion]

Not that I entirely object to using more appropriate names. "British Isles" is one used in game and in common speech that I liked to see phased out because it is inaccurate wrt to Ireland (and the Gaels/Picts in the Celtic context).

I always found it interesting how people from the UK have 'GB' stickers on their cars, instead of 'UK' stickers.

 

[ales_]

Are WashingtonHateYes04 (Alright) and WashingtonNeutralYes03 (Certainly) used in the game?