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Let's make Civ 5

Discussion in 'Civ - Ideas & Suggestions' started by Bevertje, Oct 14, 2006.

  1. noah999

    noah999 Chieftain

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    You kidding ive played all civilization games and civ 4 wiped them all away, all you need is a better computer with a marginal 3d graphics card and the game looks amazing. however if there is to be a civ 5 i would like it to go all the way into the space age and not just end in 2050 it made me mad how i was fighting the last empire and it said my time was up. (yes i know you can tur off time limit in custom game)
     
  2. rysmiel

    rysmiel Chieftain

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    If you don't actually give a toss for how the game looks but are interested in how it plays it's possible to come to a quite different conclusion.
     
  3. stgelven

    stgelven Chieftain

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    with civ3 modding was really easy, now with civ4, you need to know too many thing, python, xml, i don't want to programming, simply modding, i really want that civ5 include powerfull tools for modding.
     
  4. ZooMan2

    ZooMan2 Chieftain

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    I think this is a really cool idea ... you could also add the ability for the player to pause the action and give new instructions between auto-stops ...I think the combination would give a much more enjoyable game and remove a lot of the tedium factor.
     
  5. ZooMan2

    ZooMan2 Chieftain

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    There is a trade off here - while the modding was much easier in Civ3 it was also limited ... modding in Civ4 runs the gamut from simple (and easy) to ultra complex (and hard) ... that said, I think it would be really nice if Civ5 had a nextgen mod tool built on the Civ4 engine but allowing things like those options provided in Colonization without the modder having to be a python programmer.

    What I don't want to see is a complete re-write of the Civ engine that makes all of the Civ4 modding work obsolete and incompatible with the next version -ugh!:cry: That was my biggest issue with Civ4 - all the work I had done in Civ3 modding had to be redone from scratch in Civ4.:(

    By the way - has anyone heard what the time frame for Civ5 is? I've looked but I haven't seen anything.
     
  6. Afforess

    Afforess The White Wizard

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    Civ III modding is non-existant. You can barely mod anything. Heck, Civ2 was more moddable than CivIII.

    I love CIV4 Modding. The Dev's gave us 80% of the game to mod. Go learn to program, it's not any harder than learning a foreign language.
     
  7. Camikaze

    Camikaze Administrator Administrator

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    Unfortunately, no, there is no news as to when or even if there will be a Civ 5. Recent speculation has it that there won't be one, given the shift of focus to Civ Network, but I would think that that would represent a delay in the development of Civ 5, rather than a complete abandonment of the series. Just don't expect anything in the next while.
     
  8. ZooMan2

    ZooMan2 Chieftain

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    Hmph - I guess everyone is entitled to their opinion - even when it is not based on facts. I don't know about Civ2 but if you'd check the Civ3 part of this site you'll find several hundred mods and scenarios - far more than exist for Civ4 - in part because it was much easier to create mods in Civ3 - true you couldn't mod to the same level that you can in Civ4 but what you could do was easier and took less time. You might not consider that modding but there are a lot of Civ3 fans who would disagree.:eek:

    And another thing, what is it with all of the rude comments on this site lately? As it happens I'm a programmer - I just don't do it for fun ... and modding Civ should not be so much work that you lose the fun ... apparently programming Civ4 is fun for you - great - don't belittle others who have more interest in the result (playing) than in the coding required to create the game.

    Live and let live - a little civility goes a long way!:D

    In the end the game designers and developers get paid to create a game (including the mod engine) that the Civ community is willing to pay for. I agree with stgelven that when/if Civ5 is ever created it should include a much stronger set of modding tools ... in fact I'm sure they already have much better tools than we have - they just won't release them because it takes too much work to polish them up for commercial release.:( That is why I hope civ5 is more of an expansion of the existing Civ4 build than a whole new engine as Civ4 was to Civ3.

    Anyway - that's my $0.02 for what it's worth.:)
     
  9. Afforess

    Afforess The White Wizard

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    What we have here is a disagreement on terms. What is modding? Modding is altering core-gameplay. Sure, in CivIII the scenario editor was easy to use, and adding more content was easy; but that's it. That isn't really modding.

    When I fundamentally alter the game, whether by making it so I can have Dark Ages, or research multiple techs per turn; that's real modding. Content != Modding.

    Rude? How so? Tell me who I insulted, so I can go apologize. Re-read my post. It's not rude. Just because the facts differ with your interpretation of reality doesn't mean it's rude.

    I don't disagree with the general premise, but there isn't much left they could have given us. A dedicated unit or building artwork creater would have been useful; perhaps some documentation of the SDK, the EXE source code; but other than that, they gave us EVERYTHING. Seriously, if you think Civ4 modding sucks, try modding a game like Tropico 3, or AOE 3, where the Dev's actively try to stop modders. Civ4 was the most moddable game in gaming history, at least when it was first released.
     
  10. ZooMan2

    ZooMan2 Chieftain

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    Thought that might be the case since I couldn't find anything on Firaxis or 2K and in the normal cycle of things you'd expect something to be in the works. I hope you're right about it just being a delay - guess we'll just have to wait and see.

    Thanks.
     
  11. ichbinsehselber

    ichbinsehselber Chieftain

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    Ramesses' idea sounds really good, but in reality, would we really like it? Look at Master of Orion 3. This game has what you are proposing. And it is sooo much less interesting than the absolutely amazing Master of Orion 2. But who knows, if the problem is in the concept or somewhere else.

    My 5 cents for a CIV5:
    If a new game is developed again with the same idea and just better graphics it is pretty worthless for me. In my eyes the game should be based on one of the CIVs. It does not matter which one. Build on it and improve it. If they start from 0 they will make some things better and others worse.

    Take CIV3 - it has some things improved and some things worse than CIV2.
    Take CIV4 - same it has some things improved and others worse than both CIV3 and CIV4

    CIV4 is very good at configurability and modability.
    It allows for a lot of variety in game play.

    CIV4 is very bad at the combat system. It is worse than CIV3 and CIV2. There is in reality only one value for combat, which is not enough.
    I have to admit it does a fairly good job at disguising this weakness by offering a lot of different promotions, abilities etc.
    CIV5 should again have at least different values for health and for attack and for defence and it would be good if there was a damage factor or something similar as well.

    Due to the problem above CIV4 lacks real artillery like in CIV3, some modders tried to introduce that into the game system, but even if they do a good job, it does not work as nice as in C3C.
    CIV5 should have separate unit type for artillery type units, not just a unit with a bonus vs cities or bombard city defenses like in CIV4. This is a CIV4 weakness.

    Another weakness of CIV4 that should be remedied is that you have to watch those combat animations. I am sure there are lots of guys who like combat animations, but there are also guys who just like strategy games and do not want to what animations. Why not allow switching them off?

    CIV4 BTS finally allowed the AI to make amphibious landings. Funny since even the CIV1 AI already managed that.
    Another reason why CIV5 should not start from 0.

    Consider a combat system like in C-evo, where there is no randomness. A deterministic combat system. Simple and effective.

    And yes I like CIV4 even though I just talked a lot about it's weaknesses.
     
  12. Afforess

    Afforess The White Wizard

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    You know you can turn those off in the graphic settings, right? ;)
     
  13. ichbinsehselber

    ichbinsehselber Chieftain

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    hm, maybe this is my fault then. The last time I tried it either the mod crashed or I did not succeed.

    One more important point for CIV5: Stacks should be penalized again (it is too boring and unrealistic to just simply put many units of different types in one square to attack the enemy. Real armies would get surrounded and out of supply and eradicated. The penalty does not have to be as hard as in CIV2, but there should be some.
     
  14. ichbinsehselber

    ichbinsehselber Chieftain

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    hm, where can you disable these animations? I have already set
    - no combat zoom
    - frozen animation
    - single unit graphics
    - effects disabled
    - all graphic settings low

    Still there is the combat animation.
     
  15. Afforess

    Afforess The White Wizard

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    "Quick Combat" for offense and defense will disable the battle animations.
     
  16. old_civver

    old_civver Chieftain

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    A couple of suggestions for civ5;
    - a summary page at the end of the game suggesting things you could do to improve your play
    - another victory condition: more points than all others combined
     
  17. Shiggs713

    Shiggs713 Immortal

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    the summary page sounds good.

    The victory condition not so good. I can't imagine ever being that bored that I would continue playing when I had more points than all others combined... maybe unless it was a 3 player map :mischief:

    I'd really just like an updated version of civ4. More realism, better graphics and better AI I would pay for. Totally get rid of the production/food process with the cities and make it more realistic. I don't wanna see an earth map where Kansas City is the most populated city on earth. Oh and actually include some decent scenario's and maps for gods sake. The ones included with original civ4 are wretched.
     
  18. old_civver

    old_civver Chieftain

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    The idea with another victory condition is to have the AI simply concede the game when it's clear the player will win. Using the points as the basis for this calculation would serve to use them for something significant. Exactly how many points this should be is to be determined. Perhaps twice as many as the next (or any other mathematical calculation that is deemed appropriate).
     
  19. awesome

    awesome Meme Lord

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    one thing i'd like to see is the next war scenario having the auto-city-naming feature from rfc.
     
  20. Camikaze

    Camikaze Administrator Administrator

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    How would a summary page work? Wouldn't it just be like a list of all the suggestions that you didn't take during the game (like blue circles or suggested builds)? Wouldn't it be just as broken a mechanism as those?
     

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