LK39 - World map, emperor, Songhai

I decided to do only 10 turns as I met the Egyptions, and I need to go to bed. :sleep:

LK37.040.gif

Zoomed out map of current empire

To summarise:

We have a new city, Koumbi Saleh. It is set up perfectly for a settler factory. I would suggest keeping Gao as a settler/worker factory as well. It can never hurt to have too many of them, and so early in the game can provide a massive population boost.

The Egyptions still don't have Writing, if we can meet the Zulus and some European civs as well we should be in a much better position to by some contacts, then buy some techs.

There is nice land to the east, this is currently being explored. There are also warriors heading towards Europe, to the west, and to the Zulus.


Feedback would be appreciated as this is my first SG and so hints on how to play more communally or on my reporting style are very welcome.
 
Uh, save game please.
Do you know how to use the upload feature?

=========================

The General Songhai plan:
1) First to contact the Zulu, hopefully exclusive and contact trading.
2) Contact Egypt and try to get past for further contact.
3) First ships to America.

Can we get lucky and Egypt sell contact with us?

LKendter
Anarres
Meldor (Currently playing)
Dark Sheer (on deck) (needs to re-confirm with 24 hours, or Kazin is playing)
Kazin (alternate if DS doesn't confirm by the time Meldor is done)
Lt. 'Killer' M.

Remember, 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 to complete.
 
1750 BC (Pre-turn)
GAo is building a worker to bring it down to size 1? this is bad as it takes too long for it to grow again. Swap it to build a temple and move warrior form Timbuktu in that direction. Gao should not be allowed to go below pop3 again. Timbuktu is building another warrior, I change this to a temple, both to give time to grow and get the pop up to be able to be a true settler factory. Koumbi Saleh is building a granary but it was three bonus food sources within its range and several floodplains. This is changed to an archer to slag some barb camps with. Jenne is building a warrior, I leave this as it will come in handy for MP duty. We have an over abundance of improved tiles at Timbuktu and none at Koumbi Saleh. We are many turns from MM.

1725 BC (1)
Gao grows one but the MP warrior arrives just in time. This is emp level and we get no free happy people. Warrior headed for the Zulu turns back slightly to pick up goodie hut.
(I) Jenne builds its warrior and starts an archer.

1700 BC (2)
Pop goodie hut and get nasty barbs.
(I) Warrior survives tow barb attacks with 1 HP and promotes. Third baeb wanders off. Egyptian warrior appears outside Gao. Good thing it isn't empty.

1675 BC (3)
Southern warrior rests before continuing on. Buy fine worker from Egypt for 112 and send it towards Koumbi Saleh.

1650 BC (4)
Gao grows again and the lux slider is moved to 10%.
(I) Xeres come a calling with Bronze working for 180g, I tell him no thanks as we should be known to every one but South America and Austrilia in a few turns. That will drop the price on thing considerably.

1625 BC (5)
I notice that Xeres has writing and Cleo doesn't. She will have it soon enough so She gets writngs and 55g for Bronze Working and The Wheel. We ahve horses within range of Timbuktu. Thank the resource RnG for that. Spot Zulu border to the south. Almost to the Med to the north.
(I) Gao completes its temple and starts a spear. Koumbi completes an archer and starts a spear.

1600 BC (6)
Find goodie hut and barb camp to the west. Barb horse appears from the NW. Get a step closer to the Zulu but no contact yet.
(I) Horse attacks Gao, warrior promotes.

1575 BC (7)
Pop goodie hut to the west and get a settler!. Pinkish border spotted to the north.
(I) Timbuktu finishes a temple and starts a spear. The Australians complete the Colossus! What devilish things did you do to them Lee?

1550 BC (8)
Warrior ignores barb camp for now and escorts settler to its new home. Alphabet for Iron working and 132g from Shaka. The Wheel get Mysticism and 128g (all he had). We can trade contact with the Zulu for more tech, but I will wait a little. We have iron near Jenne.
(I) Jenne build an archer and starts a barracks.

1525 BC (9)
Walata is formed on the coast by a river and pops the barb camp at the same time. The warrior fortifies as the barb won't be happy we stole his tents. It starts a spear. Still no contact from the pink border, will wait one more turn.
(I) Gao build a spear and switchs to a settler. We need more shield there for sure.

1500 BC (10)
No new contacts. I leave the choice of what to do with the northern warrio to the next person.

At this point we can sell contact to the Zulu to everyone and probably get all contacts and catch up in tech. This I also defer to the next person.
Gao is set to grow to 6 in 5 and produce a settler on the same turn. There is a worker on the way to improve one more tile for more shields.

LK39 1500 BC Saved Game
 
1575 BC (7)
Pop goodie hut to the west and get a settler!. Pinkish border spotted to the north.
(I) Timbuktu finishes a temple and starts a spear. The Australians complete the Colossus! What devilish things did you do to them Lee?


Free settler - never argrue with those [dance]

The only thing I did to Australia is give them a second worker / settler to get a stronger start. It sounds like it worked. ;)


The General Songhai plan:
1) Trade like crazy, at least every other turn.
2) First ships to America.

Sound like we have entered the heavy trading phase.
Once mapmaking is done the money will be rolling ;)

LKendter
Anarres
Meldor
Kazin (currently playing) **
Lt. 'Killer' M. (on deck)

** Kazin is in, as DS missed my deadline of posting by the time Meldor plays.

Remember, 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 to complete.
 
Originally posted by LKendter
The General Songhai plan:
1) Trade like crazy, at least every other turn.
2) First ships to America.

Sound like we have entered the heavy trading phase.
Once mapmaking is done the money will be rolling ;)
Click to expand...
Some thoughts since it was so late before I got finished.

1) We can get contact with everyone else and tech parity with everyone else with the sell of contact to the Zulus alone. Start trading contact with the Zulus to those who will give contact with someone else and some small amount of cash. Then move to the next one. You will probably find some of the AI who do not have contact with each other yet. This is the trade you need to sell them contact with the other one for tech that we don't have. Some of them may not have writing as yet, use that for extra contacts and techs as well. Once we know everyone it will make things a lot cheaper.
2) No one has Map Making yet (the tech we are researching) as the cost of it is still max. Hopefully that will be the case when you finish trading contacts and tech. Going after this tech will allow us to be the first to get galleys oout and exploring. This makes our maps worth more and gives us the chance to have the first contact with both Australia and the Americas. More exclusive trading.

We have a bunch of money right now because the tech we are researching is a 40 turn tech no matter what (unless we find someone with it already). The city I settled is on the coast, so when we get close, start a prebuild for a galley so we can get it to America faster.

As for the placement of the next settlers, we should now rapidly expand toward the eastern coast. We have a natural dessert barrier to the north and jungle to teh south, but we need to grab all those bonus food and water locations before the Egyptians can. The good news is that we have plenty of horses and iron. We should be able to connect these up and make a lot of money off of them if we can get trade routes to the rest. Also, there is a nice fertile area on the northwest tip that we should grab as well before the Europeans ran out of room. But please, do not let the population drop in the core cities again. I spent most of my turns getting the pop back up to were it should be. We should now be able to build settlers every 5 or so turns and still keep the pop above 4. We will have threee cities capable of producing settlers and workers so we should hit a rapid expansion phase.

Be careful of the barbs. do not let the camps hang around. We want our settlers to be safe.
 
A couple more things.....

Buying workers is still a good deal.
Once we can sell maps, we should use that to generate extra income.
I know it is a big pain, but on this map with this many civs things change rapidly. You have to do a diplo check every turn. That also increases the chance we can buy workers.
 
thoughts:

1) I wouldn't blame anarres for letting the pop go low. w/o at least 1 lux there's too much loss from luxury tax or entertainers.
Things change one you have that one lux, so from now on we should stay on high pop in the core, as meldor says!

2) be carefull trading lux/res to Europe - Egypt will control that and we get the blame if they go to war with either a civ in between or us or our trading partner!
 
Originally posted by meldor
But please, do not let the population drop in the core cities again. I spent most of my turns getting the pop back up to were it should be.
Click to expand...
The reason I was going to produce a worker from Gao is that we really needed another one, and I thought that Koumbi Saleh would make an excellent settler factory, so it was busy building a granary. Also, size 2 was max for Gao without any police units or lux slider. I would not have kept it small, just wanted the extra worker. The settler Gao built before the worker was queued was used to build Koumbi Saleh, itself a better location than Gao.

I personally would have kept Koumbi Saleh as a settler factory and nothing else as it has the potential to pump settlers every 4 to 5 turns. I prefer building granaries in any city that is producing workers or settlers, and so I try to have dedicated settler factories and dedicated unit-producing cities. I tend not to build settlers in unit-producing cities when they get too big, instead I manage the tiles so that there is max production and no growth when it is the desired size.

I am new to SG's, and am not familiar with the do's and don'ts. If these kinds of issues have been resolved in the many SG games people here have participated in, please let me know. I am more than ready to accept criticism, but I need more information on why what I have done is wrong if I am to change, as this is my normal playing style.

It was really fun to play, and I can see myself becoming addicted to SG games, but more feedback on the style of play would be appreciated if it is not currently what you want. :)
 
anarres: I would have built a Granry in Gao, too, then getting a spear and a settler every 15 turns from it with. 2 police it wouldn't have needed lux in any form them. But that's playing style differences, and I agree fully on you decision with the worker. Gao grows so fast that it is worth it, especially as we will soon be short on workers once we start taking all the lands to the east.

I think meldors comment was less criticism and more warning for the future, as things change with the lux we get ;)
 
Everyone plays cities differently - with 2 floodplains wheat (food heavy and shield poor) I would also run the capital to size 1. This city can grow back to size 3 very fast - we need at least 2 cities building settlers so that we can push toward the med area, toward the Zulu and the spice area, and toward the nice area in the Atlantic.

Koumbi Saleh is an excellent choice for a granary and settlers, as plains wheat has shield and cow plains have shields.

I like the fact that we start have the exclusive on map-making. If we are the first there - probably my turn :) - we can get a lot from the map including probably all of the missing techs. Of course, if Killer doesn't do it first ;)



We may want to make Gao a WORKER factory. It will quickly grow, claim the mined plains, and start the cycle again. We can always us more workers. I granary in Gao will be brutal, as we will need a lot of effort to get 60 shields from that city.
 
I didn't feel bad about what meldor said, it's just that I dont want to f**k the game up in any way, remember I'm just a noobie at this.

I said what I did so that I could get advice for the future, and I apologise to meldor if the last post sounded a bit defensive, I know he wasn't having a go.

Can't wait for my next turn :D
 
I did not mean the pre-turn comments to mean that you made bad choices, they just were not the choices I would have made at that time. In general, my choices for building up any city are to try and balance the the amount of food and shields to meet what the city can do at that time. Once we get a decent government our cities will be even more unbalanced towards food.

I think it is better early on to use the lux slider instead of keeping the pop low. Gao's limiting factor for growth is shields not food. While it is true that Gao can quickly get back to 3 pop from 1 it can't build anything while it is doing that. With a low level of population, it must either produce shileds or produce food. With the higher pop level it can produce shields and food. With the population up it should be able to produce a settler every 5 turns, even without the granary. That would take at least twice as long at the lower pop levels. I think I proved to myself in QSC1 that taking the extra few turns to get the pop up pays off in the long run. Commerce is not our main problem right now. We have plenty of income. We can afford to keep the lux slider on 10-20% for a long time if it means getting settlers out sooner.

I have no objection to the a granary in KS, its just that it again has more food than shields to start with. The granary multipoes food but does nothing for shields. The temple allows it to pull in more landed that can be improved to give it more shields. Then the granary can be built quicker and do more for us as the shield production will match better.

AS for trading with the Europeans powers, we need to establish our own routes to Europe through our own harbors on the Med. If we do that and maybe a city somewhere in England, we eliminate the chance that one civ can cut us off (if unintentionally) with our trading partners. I would like to see us with cities and harbors on all three coasts before the expansion grab is over. There are alos wines to the east that would be nice to have as well. Two native luxes are better than one of course.
 
meldor: exactly what i meant: be wary dealing until the routes are secure. I wasn't thinking so far ahead as a completed harbor for both us and the AIs on the med ;)
 
On the question of luxuries - don't forget that at least one spice spotted down south :)

We have a huge amount of good spots to get, so multiple settlers sources is a good thing. Plus, we know from the map layout that we want the little island in the Atlantic. Hey, if we hold map making maybe we can be the first in England :lol:
 
OK, now that I'm actually in, LK, could you give me a link to download the need files please.
 
Don't forget:


Installation instructions:
All players should run the unit setup file!
Drop the batch file SETUP-UNIT3.bat under the directory:
C:\Program Files\Infogrames Interactive\Civilization III\Art\units
Run it to will create the needed new units.
 
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